It's fun.

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Beliefs inform actions, actions have consequences. <br />
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If I think your beliefs are immoral or wrong, I will call them out. <br />
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I'd like to think you'd do the same.

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true, &amp; I respect that. this question is more aimed at the people who just want to be rude and cruel for no reason. you can disagree respectfully, you don't have to be nasty about it.

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There's irrational behaviour from all sides of the debate. I've actually written a story on here aimed at atheists who conduct such behaviour.

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I hope they read it then. I actually would love to read it if you give me the EP link :)

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You probably won't find it all that interesting, but here you go; EP Link

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Well...the ep link doesnt work

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Hmm bizarre. If you go to the "I am an Atheist" section, more story is there. It's titled "Atheistic Behaviour".

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Right and wrong doesnt exist on atheism

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You're right. But that's because atheism isn't a position regarding morality. It's a position regarding the proposition a God exists. Completely different topics. Can atheists have moral values? Yes, no question. But a persons moral values aren't contingent on there being an atheist or not.

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There is no right or wrong without God, but that does not mean atheists cannot be good people or live moral lives it just means the morals they hold to are objectively false.

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You could not be more wrong. God isn't an objective morality. Otherwise you'd have to agree with his capricious nature, including slavery, forcing rape victims to marry the rapists and stoning people for acts such as adultery. Fortunately, you don't agree with your God on those actions, because he doesn't exist. Perhaps you should read your Bible more...

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I'd actually go one step further, and say secular morality is far superior to any intangible moral truth you could obtain from the Bible. You seem to forget your basis for morality was written by cave dwellers who agreed with throwing babies against rocks, and who thought of women as property. You should really be careful before you try to pawn your little book of Genocide off as a moral basis. You won't win this argument, on any grounds.

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I only direct that sort of behaviour to friends who I know can take my humour and throw it back at me, far more important things to rage about than religion.

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Maybe because you guys make such a habit of telling the rest of us what's right and wrong?

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Really? I don't do that..

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You mean we can actually talk logically to you? Nah, I tried that.

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Why would you want to talk logically with us? We are DIFFERENT, I dont expect to change your mind and you sure can not change my mind sooooo why are you even trying to talk to us? Everybodys stuck in their ways, so if you dont believe then cool, just don't be mean or bully people that do. That is so silly.

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"why are you even trying to talk to us?" I'm old school, I think humans can discuss about their beliefs.

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I do too, but you just said you can't talk to the believers logically, so don't contradict yourself.

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Not my fault, my dear. I did try to talk in all honesty but religions are used as shields, people will just repeat the same formula and think redemption is in repetition.

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BTW, when I said 'can' (discuss) , I meant 'are allowed to', 'should'.

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Okay, so let them think that then. You will repeat that God is not real right? Ok so what? Thats okay, no one is against you for that, you have the total right to believe that. Why should we fight? Honestly, we shouldn't really cross paths *unless a respectful debate came about* I would never single you out just because you believe theres no God. That is beyond cruel.

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I generally don't just say' god is not real', I like to justify my opinions.
'No-one is against you for that' , you can't be serious? religions have always turned pagans, non-believers into martyrs.
Finally, I care about humanity, I care about the world where my child lives, that's why I'm not indifferent to the power of superstitions.

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So you feel the constant need to prove WHY you believe in something? I guess the conversation ends here..we are on two different levels. Goodbye

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Some people like to go beyond beliefs.

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There are many reasonable logical christians out there. You know this but try to pass it off like you dont

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And reasonable Muslims, I'm talking about discussing about religious concepts, this is impossible. And I mean discuss, not mock.

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Why did Christians spend hundreds of years torturing and killing atheists for not believing in Jesus?<br />
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I think you can tolerate a little teasing.

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Wow, I don't know why "christians" did that. I am not a "christian" or tied to any particular religion for that matter. I am me &amp; I believe in God, thats it. The fact you feel you have to tease is childish..but what can I expect from SOME Atheists? Not ALL of them are so self-centered and disrespectful.

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Same can be said for your people, theists.
If you have a problem with your religions' fundamentalists, there is a problem with your religions' fundamentals.

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I don't have a problem with anything. I'm just wondering and addressing. Still, your childish so I can't really talk to you. Goodbye.

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If you don't like the answers to a question, maybe you're just not ready to ask that question.

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If I had a problem, I just would delete them or delete the question. The same way you answered me is the same way I answered back.

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I think that's hypersensitivity. Tone is mostly implied in text and is mostly up to the reader. If you are sensitive or looking for a fight, you'll find one.

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A fight? Over the internet....lol XD

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Jesus was pretty clear that that would happen. It's not like you're being fed to lions or anything. It just comes with the territory.

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Your right..but I'm just addressing it because I really wondered. They did beat Jesus after all...

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Yeah. I know what you're getting at. I'm hardly Christian enough to earn any persecution anyway. I notice a few people just like to say 'shocking' things about him on here.

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Funny thing is, I'm not "christian" I don't put myself in any particular category &amp; I don't label myself like that. I'm me, &amp; I believe in God. Simple.

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Jesus doesn't have a problem with it, he turns the other cheek. He know they are just jokes and is not offended by it.

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They are just jokes? I didn't know.

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I don't waste time on things I don't believe!

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I'm glad! You are smart.

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I feel sadness for theists led to believe their very birth is of sin and their lives don't have meaning unless they beg for forgiveness. I feel sadness for people trapped in fundamentalist societies or even worse, countries, who face persecution or even worse for questioning their faith or declaring their lack of. I don't consider questioning bronze aged claims about a god to be a waste of time, I don't hesitate to challenge someone's acceptance of these claims. Beliefs are directly tied to actions and history is full of examples of the problems with religion. So is the present. And so will the future, unless enough societies decide enough is enough and phase out the god delusion. That sure won't happen with idleness, and theists aren't all just accepting of letting the cards fall as they may either.

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I see your point. I feel sad though, that you sit up at night worrying about what others believe. At least, if you don't like theist, you would find the good in it. If "religion" is keeping someone from doing foul things, that should give you some comfort. As a believer, I don't have time to challenge you &amp; I sure don't have time to try to prove something to you when you obviously made up your mind. But anywhos, I appreciate your comment :)

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When did I say I sit up at night worrying about what others believe? You aren't just making up arguments from the opposing viewpoint to fit your preconceived conclusion, are you?
Religion doesn't keep people from doing foul things. It's not a coincidence that the most religious countries aren't exactly shining beacons of peace and equality for their citenzry. I do appreciate your attempt though.

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I'm not making up view points to fit my conclusion, no need to get crazy. I said that as a way to show you how much time you waste being sad for others because they chose to believe and you didn't. Thats obnoxious. Two, believing does keep some people from doing foul things, I'm not even going to touch on that too much, if you don't get that, then oh well. Three, yes religious countries aren't the most peaceful places to be, but then again, what place is totally peaceful? We don't live in a perfect world, &amp; we don't understand everything, &amp; I won't act like I do. I can't tell you why religious countries are some of the worst corrupted countries, but I can tell you that I am a believer, God does exist, and I pray for this world and its people often. I have nothing more to discuss with you.

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Can you point out where I said I lose sleep at night thinking about theists? You ARE making up viewpoints. No need to deny, it's obvious. I listed several reasons why I'm disturbed by religious beliefs, you addressed none of them. You won't discuss how religion keeps people from doing bad because you cant support that nonsense. No, we don't live in a perfect world, but that doesn't mean we just shrug our shoulders and say "oh well". No, we improve the world. The existence of god, any god, including yours, is a guess. Not proven. You haven't participated in a discussion yet, you have just used fallacious arguments and presented baseless assertions. I can tell you this much, I sure won't lose any sleep over this exchange!

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Then my athiest friend, what are you doing to change the world and make it better? Anyway, thats the difference between believers and non believers, you guys live only off of proof &amp; you want to always be right all the way down to whats a real discussion lol. I can't physically show you God in my heart. I'm not going to sit here and write down examples because your no threat &amp; I don't need to prove anything to you. Atheist are a minority in this world, get over yourself.

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Perhaps, some of them believe that you spend your energy, life, hopes and desires around lies and they wish to save you from that? Because they care about you? Being rude is rude, I know but imagine you wish to save your friend from a very bad relationship and nothing seems to work. You either say, OK, I've tried everything that is possible within the range of nice words, so I can walk away. Or, you care enough about your friend that you risk being rude, to confront them with the truth that they waste their time... I don't know. I only know it may be more complex than it seems...

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Hmm. I see yout point, but there is a line. One, I am not their friends &amp; I don't desire their help. Yes, if they choose to *RESPECTFULLY* tell me they *THINK* I am wrong &amp; why, then I will hear them out. But my belief (&amp; other believers) belief is not DEBATABLE! Who is anyone to walk in &amp; say my whole life is based on lies? Can we repeat that? MY LIFE? Exactly, I choose this then let it be, it has nothing to do with any atheist or non believer. Anyways, thanks for commenting :)

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As I said, it may boil down to how much they care. In my example above, your friend would be upset when you give advice to step out of a bad relationship. He or she would say "my love life" is not debatable. But how vigorously they bite the rescuing hand does not tell anything about how strongly they need to be rescued. Again, I am just trying to give a perspective you might not considered yet. Not saying this is necessarily the case.

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Your right, unfortunately, I have dealt with a friend like that, and I tried to help her out...she KNOWS he is not the best but love drags her on..now shes faced with H.I.V.&amp; is still with him..I love her &amp; no longer try to force myself on her *as in helping her when she doesn't want it* - correction - whenever she asked for my opinion I would help her..&amp; she asked often. Anyways, thats different in the fact that in a bad relationship theres more bad then good, thats why H.I.V. is in the picture now. As far as me being a believer, well I'm not harming anyone, my life is pretty ok, I'm happy where I am at, I have my health, my two arms, two legs. I have a happy heart as a believer..I've done a ton of good. So, yeah, when a Atheist tries to "help" me its a little offensive..how dare they intrude? I don't intrude on Atheist...but I guess this war is a never ending one....I'm happy that Atheist I know in real life act nothing like the ones on the internet...the boldness someone feels behind the screen is baffling...Behind the screen &amp; in real life, I try my best to be respectful &amp; I appreciate your perspective..that is all.

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Because we feel so sorry for you. It's as if you are asleep and we are awake. We want you to have a better life. If you have a better life, then perhaps you will get your religious laws out of our government.<br />
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Christians don't care that they are cruel because they think that by imposing Christian laws on non-christians is a good thing to do. No - it's not. It's a CRUEL thing to do.<br />
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WAKE UP! Look at how barbaric Christianity has become in the last 30 years.

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Religious laws out of the government? Its not my fault Atheists are only a minority...it seems on EP you are majority so say what you please :)

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Without God there is foundation for moral values which is found all over the government, there is nothing wrong with murder, rape, stealing. It is religion that gives us the basis for affirming these are wrong.

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People who have doubts about their beleifs are usually the most vocal and the most standoffish

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Yes, take a look at the comments below!! Many atheists will fight me till the death! Its extremely funny..&amp; kind of absurd.

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The believers who need bringing down are the ones who themselves seek to bring down everyone else, by making the rude nasty threat of eternal torture. It's a personal offence, and immoral bid for control by fear, that hardly merits a sweet response.

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A biased question like this will get biased answers. I do hope you will gain life experience and empathy to answer these questions for yourself. No issues are black and white-that only happens on paper.

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That is a very good question, I have asked that for years.

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