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BabzEsq24 BabzEsq24 46-50, F 17 Answers Dec 13, 2011

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When we are told to accept muslim culture as part of our world without questioning it, we need to consider things like this. MOST muslims do not approve of this kind of thing, but some do and some of those who do run whole countries.

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yet certain religious state which shall remain nameless (lest I light someones tampon fuse) is denied the right to exist. Jus' sayin

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Always question. If you apply your standard of a few extremists invalidating a religion or culture, then Bush attacking a country that possessed no threat and torturing prisoners would make America an unacceptable culture and Christianity an unacceptable religion. Always question. Always think for yourself.

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Not denying any country the right to exist. Just think we need to consider the extreme possibilities when we admit Sharia law into English common law.

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Yes, you are right. Our foreign wars say nothing positive about our culture or its main religion, Protestant Christianity. I would not say extremists invalidate whole cultures or religions but when extremists get in charge, it can get ugly, as Bush and his gang proved. English Common Law seems to be endangered from within as well as from without.

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the reality is this doesn't have any more to do with witches than when the Europeans used to burn witches....it's about power and fear-mongering.....People do it everywhere they just use different tools

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I was referencing Israel which is always under siege just to exist

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Witch Craft- what is this 1604?

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Thos people who are so fond of saying that it is only a tiny minority of Muslims that are terrorist and murdering thugs, that most Muslims don't agree with this sort of thing need to keep in mind that all that is needed for the tyrants to succeed is for good people to stand by and do nothing.

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olddreams - Bush was not the leader of the Christians no was he a king! He didn't got to war just out of the blue he had the approval of the congress, we were attacked over 3000 Americans were killed in that attack and you would have him sit on his hands and do nothing, then you are the enemy.

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My people fell into that folly around 1939

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we are blessed with seperation of chuch and state

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They treat women worse than kicked dogs. It would not surprise me

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I agree with you and I would not like to live in a Muslim country for that reason. Yet, I have spoken to many women who have lived in such countries and they tell me they feel very safe in the Muslim countries they have lived in. Most of the time, women are protected and safe in such countries. I am concerned about the application of Sharia law in countries that are traditionally English Common Law countries, the potential for the slippery slope as the Muslim population increases rapidly.

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I read up on single women going to Saudi... easy to get in.. sort of.. NOT so easy to get out. If your sponsor decides you can not leave.. YOU WON'T

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Since I L O V E nacho's.. I would agree lol

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Ketsup is retired as a vegetable in US schools-salsa would at least have a health benefit

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But the Iranian court did give her the option of blinding him with the help of a DR. He was to be put under anesthetic and awaken blind. Regardless of whom you worship or do not this is barbarism.

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Yes, that is correct...it did happen. She was actually purporting "cures" to various clients through folk medicines and such...so if anything, she was more guilty of medical fraud than anything else. It's so sad that she had to die over something so silly :-(

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Lets say she is a complete fraud and charleton- death?

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I'm glad that the majority of Islam is not crazy like the Wahhabi nutters that run Saudi Arabia.

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Yes you did , not just put to death but beheaded



I have never nor will I ever understand why any woman would become a Muslim, Why would they volunteer to become some ******** slave. I don't understand why they act like a bunch of sheep, they have a good mind why don't they rise up against this tyranny.

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See anything about any sort of due process whatsoever? I looked- nothing

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DEMOCRACY: tHE WORST FORM OF GOVERNMENT except for all the others (F.n. I know we are technically a republic but that doesn't sound kick *** enough for this dialogue)

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they have their own freedom, who says that they are slaves? how could you know that? have you lived there and seen how people there treat women? no, but your words are based on media and what it says. Everyone has his/her own freedom of religion.

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You drank the KoolAid. I never wrote they were slaves (although now that you mentioned it. . .) I referenced the US once having supported the institution and after a war declaring it an evil institution. And stop presuming I am basing my opinions on the media- I read more than you can fathom-You never address a specific, you call all those with differing opinions ignorant and you spread a patent blanket over truths for your convenience. If Islam ever needed a spokesmodel it's not you

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I know several American women that better be thankful that doesn't happen here!

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This is a law there, not because she is a woman, or not because people treat women there badly as poeple know which is not true, they killed her because she practiced witch craft which is banned in Islam, and people know that they would be killed if they practice it. Also, muslims in general don't practice that kind of craft so she's already not a muslim women, and saudi women don't do that actually. You do have a bad idea about life there, If you had to go and work there for a while and see the life there you'd understand that point as I did

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well, if it has nothing to do with her being a women why don't you hear more cases of men being accused of being witches or being burned or stoned. Just because it's not a direct correlation, doesn't mean it's not a factor

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Men can face the same if they practiced witch craft, but why don't we hear about that? because people like to look at saudis through that way. Look at how many people die all around the world, why didn't Babz ask about that? because he saw that topic and felt he would write about something that would make our picture about Islam and Saudi worse, alos the article which he read did the same. That's why we just hear about such things, because peple focus on the bad sides which make them talk more than on other things which may be more serious

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I don't have a problem with islam..I do have a problem with people saying that it's ok to burn people or stone people just because a religious authority says so. they are not god. If that's the only way they can think to promote islam maybe they should let someone else run religious things in their country. I do however agree with you on one point, that when the western media talk about islamic countries the do over emphasize a lot of this sort of things. As you've said, a lot of women feel perfectly safe in those countries. And I do think that only talking about the negative is a form of discrimination.

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My understanding, after a bit more probing is that she was charged specifically with sorcery after trying alternative medicine. I do not know enough about Islam, but is alternarive healing a violation?

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You don't know me Christina- for starters I am a woman. As for why I didn't ask something that didn't cause you discomfort- skip my Q- I don't ow you a justification for using EP to exchange ideas about current events-in fact that is a cherished componant- as to whyI didn't write of anything more serious- I rather think the beheading of a woman anywhere in the planet is serious. The Saudis so not need my help in negative PR. In the words of the Bard: "the lady doth protest too much."

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sorcery is a violation there, she knew what would happen to her if she practiced that, but she insisted on doing it & she got what she deserved

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I know you don't owe me any justification as you said, but you know, you just asked about something which is a rule must be followed whether in S.A or any islamic country. The way you asked that Q was not a smart one if i can say so, sorry to say that but I'll explain one thing, what do people know really about saudi women? you think that they don't have their own freedom, but why? because they are not allowed to sleep with many men without getting married? or because people care about their honor there more than anything else? or because what? women there have their own freedom & live the same life you live, they do whatever they like, and they travel, study, go out & have fun, dance, party & sometimes their life is more exciting than ours, but what's the only difference, they are decent people all the time, religious, they do respect each other & live as if all of them were from the royal family. You know, they do live best than our life. I'm not accusing you of something. I'm saying that, such a Q may make a lot of people have a bad idea about a great country, and let them still ignorant about the life there

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Let's back up the train for a second Christina- do you believe in witch craft? Do you believe she actually had the powers associated with witches?

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In the real world can anyone actually have a sorcer's "powers"-wait- I have to cross my arm and blink to get dinner on the table

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All with male escorts, or not a man in 100 miles - some may even vote soon, but don't let them drive! The fundamental human rights issues are what bother me. The US had laws prohibiting woman from voting, allowing slavery and a lack of due process until the 14th amendment. But above all the most basic human right violated is the failure to divide religion and state. Ancient religious edicts that fail to evolve lead to inhumanity. I thought there was hope with the Arab Spring- but it seems that was as impotent as (sadly) Occupy Wall Street Movement. Can Islam survive in a secular state or id it fueled by a God many may choose not to believe in-I’m a church goes because I can or not and the state has nothing to F’n say about it. Please read the Universal Declaration of Human Rights. http://www.un.org/en/documents/udhr/ I have trouble reconciling this sound document with many tenants of Islam.

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Witch craft there doesn't mean that people have a supernatural power and stuff like that. Witches there do make people sick, and kill other people by a way or another. Not as that meaning BabzEsq. No one would believe in such things, and in sorcer's power as you described it. Witches there use real things to kill people or make them sick and this is the first point. Another point, women there are allowed to vote, and apply for different jobs. They can be deans, doctors, and scientists and ....etc. Women there have their own rights which fit to the Islamic law. Another thing, human are weak, and whatever they did, they wouldn't define and set perfects rules and law. If people separeted religion and the state, what's the point? which laws do people have to follow then? other people's laws? how long have Saudi been a kingdom without any revolutions or any problems? for more than 100 years, and why? how could they do that? because they follow perfect rules. Look at how people nowadays are immoral ( not all of them for sure ) but there's no aim in their life except having fun all the time. I'm not saying that we have to be so religious as them, but at least we have to learn from them. Talking about islamic laws, look at the current financial problems in the world, all the people suffered because of that but in Saudi they were not affected by what happened, why? don't say because they have ( oil) as people say here, no, but they have an islamic financial law. Do you know that people there don't pay taxes or fines? why? because the Islamic law says that's not good for people so it's banned, while people here complain about how much they have to pay to their governments, and how life is difficult. but I want to say one thing, some of the Islamic laws are strict, yes, but all of them are good, and I wish poeple here learn from them at least what would help us in our life.

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Your description of robo-religiobots living in Islamic bliss is so twisted, internally inconsistent and devoid of even the smallest scintilla of factual reliability that I am ultimately bored. However, allow me to go patriotic for a moment- are you in the United States of America right now?

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Probably, the zealots who run saudi arabia just do whatever they like because they know they've got so much money and influence no one is going to call them on it

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where is the world outrage?

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somewhere under the piles of money and buckets of oil

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the people who run that country have decided that being backward is an excellent way to control their population

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this is the islamic law, not only in Saudi, but in all the islamic countries as UAE, and in the middle east in general, don't talk about a kingdom in that way if you don't know anything about that rules they use. It's not related to the royal family itself, this is the law of the country they MUST follow

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Don't be silly, of course they can change the laws....laws are changed all the time including ones inspired by religious doctrine. You can't even say it's always been this way everywhere because the conservative shift lots of places is relatively modern. it's happening all over and it doesn't have anything to to with god or islam. Crazy zealots are just trying to drag the world back into the dark ages.

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You proved that you don't know about anything now, it's the islamic law, and they can change it, saudi people are religious and the follow the law without breaking any rule. They can't change it because they would change a religious rule then. What do you know about the rules or laws there? have you lived there? contacted with saudi people? I bet you didn't.

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seriously...you really need to study middle eastern history and different formsof islam...There isn't just one way...and things aren't nearly as black and white as you been mislead into believing.

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hey, I've lived there for years with my family and we were treated in a good way. I know more than you know, no need to study and read about things I already know. I know there're a lot of forms of Islam, but there's just one in S.A and all people follow it . have you studied about that? read books about that? if you did, who wrote those books? Arabs themselves or other people who wrote lies about them?

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you responded as if you're not aware of the fact they can change and history is full of change so one much question the level of your knowledgee. Living somewhere doesn't prove you know a thing about history. It's often one of the major factors in people being misinformed about history. What they are doing there is wrong, and it doesn't have anything to do with god or his mandates.

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they have their own religion, and they respect their laws. Don't think they don't like them because they do. If you loved there you would notice how peaceful is the life there, and how people are good. No crimes, murders, and no immorality as in the other socities. No need to change the law because its their religion.

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I consider burning a woman as a witch as both a crime and a murder so we're going to have different ides about how great their morality is. It's evil, and just because religious people tell you something isn't evil doesn't mean you should believe them. religious organizations and the people who promote them, have been party to some of the most unforgivable crimes and sins.

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i'm writing this for the 2nd time, anyway, who said that they burn people or women in the islamic law? it's banned as well to burn people, also in fact they cut the witches head off, and they deserve that in fact because people there really believe in Magic and witches and by doing that people put an end to such acts that may cause a lot of problems in the society itself

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sorry i was spacing off ..but I fail to see how the method of murder has any bearing. Just because people believe she has supernatural powers doesn't justify it either. People have been saying stuff like that for centuries and it's no truer now than it was in the past. It's wrong.

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Slavery, Segregation, and the disenfranchisement of women from the vote to name a few were all laws in the US- Governments should evolve from the Stone Age-The Arab Spring was an example of what happens when they do not. Your űrber defensiveness in you failed attempt to justify the murder of this woman speaks volumes. The silence in all media about any trial or due process screams foul.

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Jean- there comes a point when trying to teach a pig to sing becomes a waste of time and annoys the pig. I believe you and I have hit that mark with Christina-I'm done wasting my time with her- she's all yours if you want her

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Do you believe in witch craft?

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She believes in witch craft as a crime. There really is nowhere to go

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Her people are evolved enough to speak for God but she believes in witch craft. (throws her hands up)

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Cristina is happy being a slave , she doesn't have to think for herself, all her decisions are made for her so she has no responsibility not even for her own fate.

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cristina read these verses from the Qur'an and tell me again how wonderfully women are treated in Islam - http://www.thereligionofpeace.com/Quran/003-wife-beating.htm

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I'm not a slave, who said am I? do you know who I'm anyway? one of you, but you people talk about Saudi as you know what life is there. just tell me, how are women slaves there? in what way? do they beat them as you imagine all the time? no, what about what's written in the website, all things there are lies. I've studied religions. memorized Qura'an & bible, and I know what they talk about. This website is blocked in Saudi, first of all, why? because it says LIES. Maple, not all what's online is right. Do muslims hit their women badly or as you imagine? no but if they need to hit their women, they do that but rarely as people do here. Plus if we considered this as if it happened, that was be before 1500 years ago, but life now is totally different. Look at how men treat women here? they just Use them for their sexual needs or other things. That's why we just consider life as a way to have fun all the time. ( I;m not saying all of us for sure) but women there are highly educated & men treat them well. This is the fact & I'm saying it because I'v lived with those people for a while & I do respect them.
@ BabzEsq, I didn't say I believe in Witch craft, I said they have another meaning for it. Witch craft is not as you see in movies where people use magic and can make sky rain and silly things. Witch craft there means putting things in your food or drinks that would make you feel sick all your life, or make you eat something that affect your body and you may not be able to have babies all your life because of that, or may kill you, and it means any way that those witches use to kill people in a way or another. There're cultural differences between us, and we may understand words in a way that's different from their way. Put this in your mind. I don't need you to explain for me anything, this is up to you whether you want to say something or not, but first & before that, look for saudi women online and ask them about their life, & they will tell you anything you want.. oh, and plz read what I write correctly next time, ok.

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Your description of robo-religiobots living in Islamic bliss is so twisted, internally inconsistent and devoid of even the smallest scintilla of factual reliability that I am ultimately bored. However, allow me to go patriotic for a moment- are you in the United States of America right now?

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BTW if the Saudi's are as free as you say why does the kingdom ban certain websites? Where's the freedom in censorship

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But they have oil! Oil!

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and the Bush family loves them

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Sadly you did :-(

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I also read Saudi is going "sin-free" tourism. No booze, no men & women swimming together etc

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No tourist for them. Pratically impossible that is.

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