A Believing Christian

i fully agree with you but science does not tell us how evolution and the big bang occured. theory tells you how someone thinks it happened. else it would be the law of the big bang or the law of evolution. like it's the law of entropy(main reason why evolution cannot be true) law of gravity, law of thermodynamics. please note the only law i have found to indicate the big bang is Hubble's law which by definition is wrong seeing as the andromeda galaxy is moving closer to us at an enormous rate. so this Law that is the suggestion for the big bang is not even a law! it's not even a theory as Andromeda breaks it. yes there are observations of the universe expanding and genesis explains that. regardless the forces that impact on dispersion of substance in space cannot explain why the universe clumped up to form stars let alone entire galaxies (also against entropy) unless you added water! look for NASA experiments with different particles submerged in water and exposed to zero gravity. if you believe evolution you believe that death brought man to the world. if you believe the Bible then man brought death into the world through sin!

I said I was religious, not Christian. I do not believe the Bible, because that book is not part of my religion.

i'm sorry i assumed. i apologize. but if you look at the topic debated you can see how i made this wrong assumption. your religion is just as valid as my religion and just as valid as the religion of the big bang or evolution. i have no problems. i am however willing to stand up against any claims that my religion is false and deserves less respect that something as truly laughable scientifically as evolution or the big bang! i have in the past and will in the future post stories that give my personal proofs of my claims. i am willing to answer to any of them if any questions arise. you also are then welcome to discuss there where i get the why wrong if you wish. but then you will also be asked proof of your claims! up until that point you can read my story if you want like i have read some awesome things about native american beliefs and weird eastern religions i troll as they say i do here. i do not argue and rarely leave any comments. who am i to judge a man for his beliefs? so don't try to judge my beliefs with limited understanding and false evidence! if you wanna state in open forum why you believe evolution then be prepare to explain it! that is all i have asked! i get insults and pointless comments. there are many posts on people explaining what they believe. that's your opinion. but when you claim to why you believe it then you leave open the question. when i answer it and question in return i'm attacking beliefs? then i'm called a hippo-crate! (hows that spelling right - windoze - i'm afrikaans so my english is not the best) i would love to know what religion you do prescribe to just for my own personal interest. i study religions, and i'm always looking for ones i have not come across. personally i really like Buddhism as a idea and then who cannot love the life the pagans have in mind. me 'm non denominational i do believe the bible literally cover to cover yeah! which yeah for someone who doesn't know what i see that might seem just as ridiculous as the big bang is to me. anyway sorry for the misunderstanding.

I will be honest with you, I do not have any hard evidence, and I do not think that any truly exists. Most of what I do is study behavior which is largely interpretive. All I meant to say in my story is that after observing the way the balance of nature, and Organisms interact, and even biological functions work, such as the way cells work, and the immune systems of certain animals, that I have a very difficult time believing that this wasnt designed by some greater being.

For instance, the American Alligator is a very territorial animal, and often fights between males result in huge, deep flesh wounds, and even torn off limbs. Then they go and swim in some of the rankest, stagnant, bacteria-infested water that can be found. Yet they hardly ever get infections or disease as a result. Their bodies produce a powerful antibiotic in their blood that is stronger than anything we have in our pharmacies. The only answer I can come up with is that over the course of millions of years, their bodies adapted, and evolve to give them this gift. The ones with the stronger natural immune systems survived to reproduce. the ones without, did not. That right there is Evolution, in the technical sense.

A lot of people misunderstand what a scientific Theory is. A Scientific Theory is a well-substantiated explanation of some aspect of the natural world, based on a body of facts that have been repeatedly confirmed through observation and experiment and is generally accepted across the scientific community. It is not a Theory as in "I bet Chocolate and Peanut butter would taste good together!"

I hope this helps. Like I said, I do not do a lot of empirical science in my work. I mostly observe animals behavior, both in the wild and in captivity, and make interpretations as to why they do one thing or another. But being that Evolution is still Scientific Theory, and not Scientific Law, you will be hard pressed to find Empirical Evidence for it. All we have are fossils, and Evolution seems to be the best way to explain them, and why they arent around anymore. It is something else that we may never be able to empirically prove one way or the other because it happens over such a long period of time, that nobody will ever actually see it or record it.

thank you greaser! your answer is the very first willing to address the issues at any level. i would love to have your job! i have so many pets i loose count. i think animals are awesome! ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------ the facts about the alligators sounds fascinating i never seize to be amazed by the wonders in nature! and i can see clearly how evolution could be plausible. i quote you ----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- A Scientific Theory is a well-substantiated explanation of some aspect of the natural world, based on a body of facts that have been repeatedly confirmed through observation and experiment and is generally accepted across the scientific community. ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------ this is the problem this definition is not found in respected dictionaries for the word science pertains to provable testable observable fact and theory means unproven unfounded belief about a certain topic ----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- the phrase scientific theory in itself is an oxymoron. but yes i do agree that science can make you deduce a theory. this does not however make the theory correct. or scientific ----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- my main problem with evolution is the that it needs to negate entropy! the law of entropy says that with time things tend to disorder due to randomness. exmpl: i throw my toys on the floor. they will never land in an organized fashion no matter how many times i try. and if i leave them there they will never organize. or form order. they need an outside energy that is controlled to bring them order. so i pick them up and place them on the shelf. many suggest the sun is that force that evolution needed. the sun however is not controlled and is random itself also following entropy which is why our sun is dying. the sun will fade your car's paint, wrinkle your skin and destroy you roof. the sun only destroys it does not control it's energy it only provides fuel. thus plants do not negate entropy because the conversion of the fuel is a controlled process of the leaf and the plant. detach the leaf and the leaf will also wither and decompose due to entropy. this basic scientific FACT suggests that evolution is not improbable but impossible. ---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- the fossils for one have no intermediary fossils between any of the species. "missing links" the greatest must be the evolution of a single celled organism into a multi-celled organism. there are "fossils" of single cell organism. we find them today too. but there are no fossils of 2 4 8 16 32 or any number that indicated cell division or organization we have "millions" of years of gap fossils to get to the first living creature we claim has lived.? even today what multi celled organism are there? you have single cells and then complex life. too many gaps. even the fossil record does not ecist. there is no record of fossils found. ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- quick question : in the work you do have you ever come across a benefit for your research that came from a belief of evolution. do you know of any medical or scientific advance that this theory has provided? if there is none. what value has this theory for biology and medicine that makes belief in it essential?

I do not really see the belief in evolution as essential, but so far it seems to be the most probable explanation I have found. Whether it was guided by a Creator is also up to personal interpretation.

The world we live in is a vast, and mysterious place. Things happen every day that we may not ever be able to explain. I think where people go wrong is that they believe that you either have to have faith, or science. I see no reason not have a little bit of both.

It drives me insane when one group will use their particular stance to discredit another. One that comes to mind is Atheists who try to use Evolution to discredit a Creator, but I dont like it when that coin is flipped, either.

There is only so much of our world we can understand. I am of the mindset that If something you believe is true to you, and helps you get through this **** hole called life, then it is valid and should not be questioned by anyone.

thank you Greaser for you truthful and earnest reply! i am not amazed that it is the one with the capacity to understand there is a creator than can partake in a civil debate and try and answer the points he can. and admit to those that cannot. it shines the light on the subject that i was hoping for. I do however disagree with you in one fundamental way. If science could prove the theory of God is wrong! then the science would have to be excepted! similarly when science proves a theory wrong it also has to be considered wrong. else were just working with false theories too afraid to question them. We will still be stuck in the dark ages when the church and science told us the world is flat the sun revolves around us and the moon is a smooth sphere. Science has dis-proven all these ideas! and if you wish to continue to believe that then by all means i agree with you that your belief is your own! but you then cannot put your belief up as scientific evidence, if we do not confront these things where will science go? i am still in the search to find the medical and or scientific benefits that the belief in the evolution has given the world! if there is value and truth then why does it not benefit? E=mc^2 made huge leaps in our advancements technologically. due to the truth it contains. I am not against science. i am sure anyone who reads my posts and stories must clearly see that i love SCIENCE but cannot love man's THEORY when the science at it's fundamental core says that it is not only improbable but completely unlikely. science advances our human race, opens up the doors of knowledge, false beliefs blocks that progress, we have seen this all over history. and the world is repeating this again. the theories are not needed to do any science medicine or biology, and can only hinder progress. this can be seen how plasma is not being sufficiently studied because the belief of the big bang is hard to remove from the curriculum, so now you have students studying quantum theory trying to explain the big bang when plasma theory using fluid dynamics is a lot more plausible explanation for the origins of the universe. so currently the big bang is hindering advances in plasma technology! i point you to our fusion reactor experiments! if we had less people concerned with the big bang, we might have had our clean energy source already! I hate this type of hindering theories and will always be testing them and bringing science proof for why they cannot be right!

Honestly, All the sciences you mentioned are far above my pay grade. I just the guy who feeds the Crocs.

lol still want your job : o ) love them reptiles! especially my yellow rat snake. thank you again Greaser been awesome chatting with you!

Greaser - I love the way you write and am quickly becoming a fan!

please explain God telling man he would die if he ate the forbidden fruit?

A myth. In fact it is based on earlier Babylonian/Sumerian stories about the garden of eden.

In the earliest surviving version (that pre-dates the Bible) the Adam character (originally named Adapa) fell from grace for REFUSING to eat the fruit. In that version god offered Adapa the fruit as a reward, telling him that it would make him immortal but Adapa refused it and thereby passing up his chance to become a god.