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Sociopath Anonymous

I lie, I cheat and steal as well. I would like a group like AA so be able to stop and live my life without the stress -- accept life as it comes and make the best of it...I am so tired an soon I will be in jail unless I can stop... how to start an 12 step group for US?...

I am in Miami

pg pg 31-35 22 Responses Jun 3, 2008

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Miami, the fact that you would even think of yourself in such terms tells me you feel something missing in your life, maybe there is something you would like to change or maybe you are void of meaningful relationship or meaningful life. From my perspective, the fact that you aren't in jail points to an emotional detachment rather than a survey of your history or position. Some characteristics of a sociopath are:

1 Superficial charm and good intelligence
2 Absence of delusions and other signs of irrational thinking
3 Absence of nervousness or neurotic manifestations
4 Unreliability
5 Untruthfulness and insincerity
6 Lack of remorse and shame
7 Inadequately motivated antisocial behavior
8 Poor judgment and failure to learn by experience
9 Pathologic egocentricity and incapacity for love
10 General poverty in major affective reactions
11 Impulsivity or failure to plan ahead.
12 Unresponsiveness in general interpersonal relations
13 Fantastic and uninviting behavior with alcohol and sometimes without
14 Suicide threats rarely carried out
15 Sex life impersonal, trivial, and poorly integrated
16 Failure to follow any life plan

The list is from Psychology Today but you could just as easily get a similar list from any number of sources... http://www.psi.uba.ar/academica/carrerasdegrado/psicologia/sitios_catedras/practicas_profesionales/820_clinica_tr_personalidad_psicosis/material/dsm.pdf

My biggest issues are 4, 11, 15 and 16 but I think if you break it down like that, you will find, sure, I have short comings but what can I do about them and more importantly, who can really fix those things other than myself.

Wife and I just finished watching 'Flight', starring Denzel Washington. It's a movie about an airplane pilot who heroically maneuvered a broken airplane to save 200 people from dying in a plane crash. He did this all while he was drunk and high on coke. I don't mean to trivialize your situation by comparing it to a Hollywood movie, but I do think drama, plays, movies, stories have instructional value that move us, direct us and give us pause to reflect.

I don't want to spoil the movie for you if you're going to see it but the instructional value of the film was that the main character was confronted on a number of occasions to turn his life around, i.e. stop drinking, enjoy the pleasure of meaningful relationships, work, etc. each of which he spurned, at least right up until the very end. He suffered the consequences for his actions of course once he came clean and even though he performed a miraculous feat, he was in the end demonized and incarcerated for his lack of concern for the public good by virtue of his alcoholism.

Sociopathy, like Alcoholism which you so astutely pointed put in your request for a 12 step program, is a disease of the spirit, an inadequacy to see value in other people, the world, existence. I guess what I'm trying to say is, even though you get into a program, even though you make a life long commitment to be 'sober' and sociopathically free, in every moment, in every step there is a decision to be made. Every moment presents a challenge to define who you are and who you want to become.

You can get into 12 steps, 20 steps or a hundred steps, the point is, you need to get control of yourself, drive yourself in the direction to become that person you want to be at the juncture of every moment, every hour, every day. That's not to say that the first thought that comes into your brain is the answer. That would be a problem with number 11, but to evaluate what you do, every moment. If you feel you need the structure of a 12 step program, then by all means, get into one and follow through (#16) but just remember, when confronted with a choice, you need to decide how your action will affect not only the people around you, but ultimately, yourself.

I'm writing this to you because I was moved by the movie - as corny as that may seem. I was moved to realize how lucky I am to have my wife, my family my work all the things that make life worth while. I was moved because there are still many things in my life that I question and still wonder if I made the right choice. Reaching out to someone, relating to even a stranger as yourself, is cathartic for me. I hope you can find a way to exorcise your demons as well. Thanks for reading.

hey there, totally with you- just skip the religious angle :-)

If you really worry maybe its a good sign... You know..

Who knows youre not a sociopath... just a little strange man as me..

I m from BRazil..

You are not a sociopath I would know because I am one I lack remorse, guilt, shame, or comppasion you obviously arnt a sociopath you are just convincing yourself you are

lol you're not a sociopath... you're just stupid.

bingo!

No, you are not a sociopath. You can lie cheat and steal all you want, but as long as you (for lack of a better phrase) "have feelings" of remorse, you most definitely are not.
For example, when I do something "bad", I don't wish I didn't do it. Rather, I do my best not to infringe on the rules society sets simply so I don't get noticed. Self preservation is my main concern, and if you were truly a sociopath, you would be the same.

Merry Jerry, you said in another post that you take very good care of your old shoes. Too bad your new shoe didn't agree to be worn and you returned it damaged. That shoe was too classy and never would have let a sociopath wear it. A regular Jackie Kennedy, speaks French, educated in Northeast, lived in Paris, London, etc. Horseback riding, ballet, rich family. Be careful where you land that plane. The person waiting on the tarmac might not be a DPM but a better lawyer than the one you'll need.

Just create rules of conduct for yourself, things that keep you from those bad behaviors. To Demonicca, we feel fear, it drives most of the things we do, we don't feel empathy, two very different things.

It is my understanding that sociopaths do not feel fear. Since you feel fear and seem to want to change, maybe you can. Support groups are very helpful in prison environments. Have you been diagnosed a sociopath?

Sociopaths also wouldn't care what other people think about them, therefore not need to post that they are a sociopath on a social network site

wrong. Sociopath's don't care about peoples feelings towards them for the peoples benefit, but they are perfectly capable of caring about peoples feelings towards them for their own difficulties. not being able to give love is not the same as not wanting to receive it. sociopaths frequently care about what others think of them. if they didn't, they wouldn't hide all the time.

I agree there should be SA. I am in philly. I went to AA and I understood the concent very well. Too bad I can not change. I can lie to myself all I can but I am always the same.

I am getting worse with age. I guess we want to be this way. I think it may be in the wiring or the brain. I don't know. I can't find a support group for myself. Probably isn't one. I wish there were one.

Wiring, the brain, yes. Dealing with how you really are is what I call moral behavior. Sure, it's lonely, often scary. That's how real life is for lots of us. Unreal life is not worth the trouble anyway. D'moniker, I believe in your progress, so here we are: a support group of two. Presumptious, okay, but I'm old enough you could cut me some slack.

thanks for the comment. This one as well as the one on my other story. I really like your nick and sorry to hear about you fading memory. Loniness sucks. I am glad you are on ep.

I am a sociopath too, I guess. Im not sure yet, maybe some extreme borderline. But Ill have some brainscan soon.<br />
I don't have certain feelings like 'normal' people, but ive done things in my past I feel in a rational way, not emotional, guilty about. So I'm having a lot of questions; if im born with this or made by society? Neurology or genes? <br />
And can I use my disorder for 'good' , 'bad' or 'neutral' by choice? If yes maybe I could find some purpose in unmask other sociopaths between the financial political corporate swines?

I believe sociopaths are born,not made.It could also well be genetic.

there have been plenty of examples of sociopaths being 'good'. the archetypal model for this is Sherlock Holmes.

Berangere, I am considering that if someone is born as a sociopath, and that if this is not his first incarnation (or reincarnation), then his condition was created (made) in a former lifetime. Another thing I find interesting in the matter of things being handed down by forbears -- I've heard an advanced yogi say that we are often born into families with the same propensities as our own and that it hasn't, in actuality, anything to do with anything physical, like genes. I find that of great interest.

Nelladell,so what the yogi was saying is that before rebirth our own propensities attract us into families with the same characteristics? It is quite possible, I had not looked at it that way.May be we go back into that same environment until we start to evolve away from it,learn our lessons.Yes that makes a lot of sense.

RKLawrence.
I was not aware that Sherlock Holmes was a sociopath.May be we see sociopaths under a different light.Perhaps there could be different degrees of sociopathic disorders,in my view sociopaths hurt people because they enjoy it,they get pleasure out of it.They like to hit others in their most vulnerable spots and deliberately deny people they have control over (and in the most calculated way), the things that mean the most to them, just because they can.I knew of a man who would not let his wife have a child because it was what she wanted the most in her life,now this is what I would call a sociopath.

Sociopathic personality as per the DSM-IV.Psychiatric manual:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Antisocial_personality_disorder

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pg, <br />
Unfortunately, since sociopaths tend to be predators, they cannot interact very civilly to one another once they are exposed. It would be a constant struggle for domination and control within the group, which would be counter-productive. <br />
In a very real sense, no one here who is sociopath can help you because they are, by definition, unable to empathize. Even people with the power to empathize cannot help either because they do not know what it is like to not have higher emotions.<br />
It is unusual for sociopaths to reach out, but even we want to know what we are, sometimes. What is unfortunate is that we must go at it truly alone, for we are not like most people, in a very fundamental way, and we cannot band together cohesively because of what we are. <br />
The most contact and support you can find will most likely be here, or on sites like this, because of our tendency to clash. If you read the comment section of any of these stories, I think you will get a feel for what the discussions would end up as.<br />
Also, I would readily meet with you, but I am inconveniently on the other side of the country.<br />
J

Untrue. Saying all "sociopaths tend to be predators" is painting all of us with a broad stroke. Most sociopaths know there is something "wrong" with them, and therefore do their best to act normal, and ultimately not be labeled "different". I for one, do my best to hide my otherwise natural instincts. How then am I a predator? How, if not acted upon, can predatory instincts automatically label one as a predator?

First off, is anyone else insulted by the categories you have to choose from to join this site? Pathetic. Moving on, humans...as we are...no matter what...look for some kind of release and comradery. I dare not even speak the words out loud...even here somewhat anonymous. It's what I would call a very "interesting" life...but I honestly don't know what other people live with, only that I've only known that I'm not a normal girl, but I could sense that it's best to not let on. The sooner you can accept and try to control what and who you really are, the happier and more content you will be...mot to mention the more manageable your life will be.

Everyone has sociopathic tendencies!!

It's funny, I was just thinking the same thing today. Lots of "normal" white people routinely committed unspeakable acts of cruelty against black people in this country not so long ago, and that was condoned by society. I'm sure many of those people weren't true sociopaths, yet they would remorseless and feel justified in their actions.

boredom. displaced. is it actually wrong, or the beginning of evolution....

sociopaths are not the bext step Up the evolutionary ladder, but a throwback. It is devolutionary. Higher primates share the ability to look out for others In their community. To care for, and Nurture. To the extent that a sociopath does Not feel a connection to others around him, he is Not a step forward, but a step backward.

really- read a book before you write something like that! dont know what i mean? google evolutionary social standards

I agree with you, but that's not our problem, is it? that's for the future generations to deal with.

I agree with Merry but there is a lot of disagreement on the subject.

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If you want to stop stealing, just get a job and stop. How hard is that?

my god!!! you must be some kind of nobel ****** price!!! so clever!!!! (hope you're smart enough to feel the irony of my comment)

A Sociopath "friend" stole thousands of dollars from me after the horrific death of my child. My Sociopath husband has stolen decades of my life. He has recently been discovered to be a pathological liar and has become abusive since his "mask" or "false self" has been revealed. If our world consisted of 90% Sociopaths rather than 6% society would not function. THANK GOD for those with empathy, compassion and a conscience that bring joy, happiness, harmony and LOVE to this fallen world. Otherwise, suicide, divorce, murder and chaos would prevail. I would rather live within my current pain, than never know true love and emotional intimacy. Those without are an empty shell and most will likely spend eternity in Hell, since they despise authority. God is the ultimate authority for all human beings. Sociopaths will ultimately lose ALL CONTROL at the time of death. Since I have the gift of compassion and empathy, I'm not laughing at you... I pity you.

Something tells me you should look a little deeper into yourself. I don't believe your ex husband or ex friend is the problem. I think the problem is that you are incredibly ******* stupid. How could you be married to a sociopath for ten years and not even realize it? You have obviously chosen to associate with the wrong people in your life, which in turn tells me you are incredibly unintelligent or just very naive.

Wrong. By early self-training, the s. typically has extraordinarily effective ways of masking. I knew a (deceased) s. who fooled some very astute observers for decades.

I too was married to someone I could call a psychopath,he was manipulative and I was naive! some very intelligent people can be fooled by sociopaths,I am so sorry for what you went through,sociopath alway pick on the vulnerable and know whom they can victimise,they are very adept at it.

A Sociopath "friend" stole thousands of dollars from me after the horrific death of my child. My Sociopath husband has stolen decades of my life. He has recently been discovered to be a pathological liar and has become abusive since his "mask" or "false self" has been revealed. If our world consisted of 90% Sociopaths rather than 6% society would not function. THANK GOD for those with empathy, compassion and a conscience that bring joy, happiness, harmony and LOVE to this fallen world. Otherwise, suicide, divorce, murder and chaos would prevail. I would rather live within my current pain, than never know true love and emotional intimacy. Those without are an empty shell and most will likely spend eternity in Hell, since they despise authority. God is the ultimate authority for all human beings. Sociopaths will ultimately lose ALL CONTROL at the time of death. Since I have the gift of compassion and empathy, I'm not laughing at you... I pity you.

If you believe in God, and the latest research shows that a true Sociopath is as he is, either from genetic predisposition followed by early cgildgood experiences that lead to it's expression, then God can be said to have made the sociopath what he is. Why would God do that to anyone?

You just seem angry about the people who hurt you in the past. Had those people been "emphatic" and still hurt you, would you really have said all "emphatic" people will go to hell? Surely you have to admit, you're making quite a blind and over-general statement.

if people like you didn't exist, it'd be harder to exploit people, so "THANK GOD" indeed.
have fun attracting more of us. that's what you're doomed to.

I've realized what god is. permitting any potential to manifest without intervention, so what does that mean? we're free to exploit the hell out of this place. and it's our ballpark

;) I attend church. are you a christian too?

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Who is God as you understand Him? Do you believe this God can help you? Are you willing to turn your will and life over to His Care wholeheartedly and unreservedly?

When you realized you were a sociopath as you say, what came to mind?<br />
I ask this because there are two paths it could take, one leads to true sociopathy and the other to a simple pathological criminalistic personality.<br />
Do you want an AA group so that you can have help to become 'normal' or to avoid prison?<br />
Do you think there is something wrong with being a sociopath?<br />
Do you feel guilt about what you have done?

a good question since a true sociopath feels zero guilt over anything they have done. zero consiounce means zero guilt. reminds me of the al pacino scene in " The devil's advocate." where he implores Keeanu to " drop that heavy bag of guilt."

sure a "true" sociopath doesn't feel guilt at all, but there is more than one level in sociopathy...

Oh good point! If I'm answering that question it would be to avoid prison. I'm guessing that's the sociopath's route but no matter.

The second question is a little loaded. Plenty of empaths I know assert that there's nothing inherently wrong with being a sociopath; it's the actions that sociopaths often chose to take that makes them wrong.

And for the last if I ever figure out what everyone means by "guilt" in the first place, I'll be able to answer that last one. : )

Go to AA, or NA and work the twelve steps. I've been doing it for 10 years, ever since I got busted for armed bank robbery. It has helped me develope a conscience and become a truly happier person as I use my sociopathic talents for good, not evil.

There is no help. If you are truly sociopathic then accept it and use it too your advantage. Ive dealt with this all of my life. You may feel youre missing something...and you are...a conscience. Im over being disturbed about it. <br />
In some cases it goes away on its own in your 40's. In my case it didnt. All the accepted wisdom is that treatment and a cure are non existent. Good Luck.

i agree i am in my 40s and if anything i am worse now- but i live with it just fine and doctors just want to talk about your feelings- but i have none so whats the use of paying 200 bucks an hour ?

Your story is awfly short. Do you think you provide some more details (no, I'm not a cop!)?