No, That's Wrong

One of the things I despise most about religion is the religious philosophy on morality. First of all, theists are always saying that they are more moral than we atheists are just because they have their daily dosage of god in their diet. How the hell does that work? How on earth is it more moral to do the right thing because one is afraid of the consequences they might suffer if they didn't do it, than if they did the right thing for the sake of doing the right thing.

That is basically what this equation boils down to. They abide by the laws of morality to avoid being punished, to avoid going to hell, to avoid the cold judgement of their oh so merciful god. Atheists and other people unaffilliated with religion do the same thing because it is the right thing to do. Not out of fear, not because we might make god poop his omniscient pants, but because our moral code tells us to. AND WE ARE THE MORALLY STARVED?! WE HAVE NO MORAL CODE?! I've known far too many people with this same idea and I have to say, they have their philosophies backwards and their heads planted firmly up their self-righteous *****.

godsmack666 godsmack666
18-21, M
21 Responses Mar 9, 2009

Oops, posted the same thing. I agree completely

pat, I love how you have not responded to resem, why not tell him that she is in a better place, that is if she is not burning in hell for not loving your lord. Why not set poor resem straight and tell him how if only those people in war torn nations would accept Jesus as lord and love him, they would be sitting on apple pie with ice cream enemas.<br />
While your at it tell him why the little girl in Tracy Ca. who was murdered by the sunday school teacher, why her cries to god were not ignored but in his mercy he allowed her to die, oh, but in that she was not saved she went to hell anyway, hmm, that's a hard one, but at least the poor Sunday school teacher knows she is going to heaven, Jesus saved her.

Tell that to everyone forced to live in corrupt, war-torn countries who cry out for him every day and don't see anything from it. Tell that to the love of my life who died young and suffered every second right up til the moment she died. Don't come in here spewing your vile propaganda just to stir up trouble. I'm not in the mood for YOUR ignorance. Stick to your own damn group.

I don't know how this got sent to me. I love the Lord Jesus, He is real, not because you don't think or believe so, but because He is! God knows all of your heart and forgives even in your ignorance! Happy Ressurection Sunday!

Good point MitchAndMaureen

I agree with this sentiment. There is something that makes me gag when I hear people say things, like, " I don't drink coffee I'm a christian" or I don't drink or wear make -up cos I'm a christian" I know people who do neither but not because they're a Christian. There is an element of self righteousness in all this that leads me to stereotype too many people and I shouldn't. The preservation of a secular state is the most important thing we can do.When I see special treatment being given to religious institutions I go mad. Faith schools, special tax incentives, automatic representation and the like. There are many bodies that deserve a voice and are denied cos the churches are deemed to have an inside line to the almighty. Once we institutionalize that concept we have abrogated collective reasoning and will return to the dark ages of fear and superstition with an elite of religious mullahs dictating our lives. Now where have I seen that before. <br />
One final, flippant ,thought. If Islam's rejection of western goods is a manifestation of how its despises our society why do they so openly covet our weapons and flatter us so sincerely in their pursuit of the ultimate weapon. Why don't they just pray us out of existence.

It's no problem at all LLL25, I'm glad we could help :) I'll have to look at that story.<br />
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Most of us were in similar predicaments at one point or another and you'd be surprised just how helpful the people here can be. <br />
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I hope to hear from you more in the future my friend :)

*blushing* *curtsy* <br />
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you guys have no idea, (or maybe you do), how much it means to me to meet people who think this way. it feels like im coming out of the closet or something! im terrified to tell anyone! <br />
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it wasnt god himself that i even stopped. it was almost like i was being forced to choose something because the time was ticking. reality is, i have no control of my time and neither does some man upstairs. <br />
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i feel that if religion was gone there wouldnt be so many problems. <br />
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thanks again peeps and resem9- a huge thanks to you for posting this story. i posted a story a little while back about my confusion on religion.

Congratulations LLL25. I look forward to hearing from you more often and I hope that we can answer some of your questions as well as ease your transition. Jojo is right in saying that we all have different reasons for believing what we do and I'm curious as to what yours might be. It's not an easy thing to do, converting from theism to atheism. I hope you feel liberated.<br />
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No one here will try to change what you believe, just help you to understand our beliefs a little better. Godfree is correct, some of the most intelligent people I've ever met are right here and they would be happy to hear from you. :) We're all here to talk

jojo, you forgot to tell her about the donut and coffee meet and greet later

Livelovelaugh25, What a great "confession." You are amongst friends here. It's always a little 'scary' when you come to new conclusions and you feel like you're in the minority. Do read some of our stories and you will see what different experiences brought us to where we are today. I think most of us use the scientific approach. We have been persecuted but together we deal with it effectively. If you need to talk, we're all here for you. We can't tell you what to believe but we can help you with some questions, friendship and understanding. :-)

LL25, wow, you could not have made a declaration of this magnitude in a more apropos setting.<br />
In this forum you have assembled some of the brightest people it has been my pleasure to know.<br />
Read their blogs and comments, the fear will abate and the feeling of freedom will encompass you like the air.<br />
Congratulations on your liberation.

it's a little hard to read all this. i myself just came to the realization that there is no god. i was brought up to believe in him and blah blah, you know the story. i think faith is a powerful thing and does great things. but it also does devastating things. i will admit that a small part of me is scared to not believe. but that is what fuels my fire to be a non-believer. NO ONE will make me fear anything. almighty or not.

Thank you all for your wonderful comments. Krypton and Stevester, I always enjoy reading your take on these things and a great deal of the time I agree with you. Jojo, thank you for your support and I'm glad you agree with me. Applebomb, I'm glad you enjoyed this.<br />
Mitchandmaureen, phrasing is a bit extreme but I get what you're saying. However, it is phrases like that that seem to make the rest of the community uncomfortable around us and in the case of some past presidents (Bush Sr) completely disregard our existence. It may be a good idea to keep things like that to yourself while in public, I don't think any of us want to take any more heat than we already do, lol.

Krypton those were some great thoughts! I appreciate the benefit of reading them. Thanks. Stevester, you too.<br />
Apple, we all laugh at the fact that Christians do good things because "God" wants them to/ or they will go to hell and we do them because it's the right thing with no strings attached.<br />
Some people just don't get it! LOL Wow! How did I miss this all day?

excellent. valid. poignant. i concur!!!!

apple, who knows how they think but fear of hell and damnation and all that stuff is a big element of it. I remember listening to a guy in Corn <br />
Market telling us all we would go to hell for celbrating Christmas. I think he meant the fact that we wud b taking the demon drink.

The religious groups are smart enough to get in early. children are a blank page thus the faith schools, the Jesuits call to arms "give me the boy and I will give u the man" rings true. i don't blame the religious communities for this reruitment tactic, it just makes sense. But the difference I see in the UK is the increasing exclusivity and polarisation arising from the newest faith based schools. Over the years the Catholic and Methodist schools in Britain increasingly accepted pupils of any denomination. Parent saw the exemplar academic tradition of these schools and the schools needed the numbers. However, the muslim schools exist in a different non secular environment. They are exclusively muslim, they do not teach in the medium of english and they offer less opportunity for integration than state schools. Without scaremongering it is still possible to see how these schools present opportunities for extremists to impose their own moral code and only too often that moral code includes a pejorative comparison with the <br />
British moral code. It's a short step from there to more extreme reactions. I need to say that I only refer to a minority of these faith schools where their resistance to the national curriculum and the associated inspectorate and benchmarking standards makes them suspect.

They believe in a right and wrong that is set down as a rule of law. God and believing in him is "right". If that is their belief then we are "wrong" in their eyes. They can think I am wrong or evil, or whatever else, it doesn't matter. The only thing that matters is that no one forces beliefs onto me. That is why I become heated over teaching creationism in schools or banning abortion. The rest is just people wanting to find a reason and a person to feel superior to. I really don't care what people believe happens when they are dead or whether they think I am somehow evil. Thoughts and feelings are just that, thoughts and feelings. Actions on the other hand are a completely different ball game. This is the issue that the atheist community is wrestling with. Should we try and convince others to believe like us because religion is by its very nature harmful to humanity or do we not care because religion isn't the cause of the harm? I am of the belief that it isn't religion that does the harm, it is humanities need to have an authority to follow. If it isn't God it will be something else. Personally, the goal I want for humanity is the breaking free of the idea that following something that you haven't thought about and come to the conclusion of on your own is an admirable thing. I want them to believe that it isn't moral. Think of when Rome changed to a single leader under Ceasar. It wasn't that Ceasar was beyond wonderful and they just couldn't resist. It was that they wanted a God. They wanted someone to tell them how to live and who they were. The people were struggling and in times of struggle they need to be told how to make their life better because they can't handle both the struggles and the need to figure out how to solve it on their own.

I love you both! What a great thought, Resem! If that isn't the truth, I don't know what is. I've been saying this for years.<br />
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Krypton, they have a different set of rules for morality and everything else. Tolerance and if you don't believe as they do, you're wrong. Persecute us! Judge us! I'm sick of it! I'm so appalled to read someone on another thread today; I'd rather believe in God and be right................... Jebus! It sounds like they're saying "I believe in God because if I'm wrong, I don't want to go to hell, like you! Sounds to me like if their God knows their heart, they're doomed! Pathetic!

Let us pretend that one of your morality codes is to follow the wiser and more experienced "authority". The authority is Dogma. The mere act of following those rules without question is part of how you are moral. Then there are these other people that reject both the "authority" and the idea that following one is an admirable moral at all. Well, right there we have an understanding of how they perceive us to be less moral. The compassion and "treat others as you wish to be treated" need not apply. They don't have a backward philosophy, they have a different set of rules for morality.