NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOT

 "I understand and have compassion for a single woman to want to have A child. One. But when Nadia decided to go back to the fertility doctor for IVF number 2 and beyond, it was immoral. She made the decision each time to be implanted with embryos from her eggs and her 'friend' who donated *****. Nadia's father claims "It's God's will!" which is a heresy against religious beliefs in the first place and a ridiculous justification.

 

Then he claims that Nadia thinks of the frozen ***** as "her babies". Frozen ***** are not fertilized embryos yet and are not babies for 9 months after implantation under the best conditions. And still, there's perhaps 250,000 individual ***** in a donation so does that mean she, herself, intends to populate an entire ******* province in China?

Nadia's father, who seems to be seeking fame and fortune (donations) on Oprah, doesn't appear to know Nadia from everything he's said so far. Certainly hasn't been involved in her daily life since her second pregnancy, if living overseas, being surprised she was pregnant with a litter when told on the phone. And his proclamation that he's going to help raise them all, but has $100 in his bank at 67 years old is pointless. While in the next breath, he says he's not sure about his daughter's mental situation.

"Major failure of professionalism," says Dr. Oz. "You risk those lives by implanting all of them at once." Another doctor specializing in infertility spoke on Oprah saying the birth of 8 babies at once is NOT a "good outcome" or one that we'd hope for."

Nadia's entitlement to have a child is not in dispute. Having 6, is in dispute and already pushing it, especially with one autistic child that requires an exceptional amount of attention and finances individually. But telling your quack of a doctor that "yes, I'd like all the embryos implanted, please" is a decision she is not entitled to make. And tells me she is not entirely stable nor is the doctor considering the welfare of his patient let alone the outcome. And who's paying for these IVF treatments which run $30,000 per attempt?

She already needed State and Federal assistance to pay for the costs of raising her well children and SSI for her autistic child. AND she's attempting to get a psychology degree? To treat herself? A single person dedicating every moment and dollar they have to that scholastic endeavor has a difficult time at best. How is it possible to raise 6, now 14, children and go to school for a degree and do well at both? I say that it is impossible.

I think science in America has broken some moral boundaries. I think there's licenses in need of being issued after lengthy testing for anyone wishing to become a candidate for implantation including a background check and credit verification as well as job security. If all that's necessary to hold a menial job at KFC why not for becoming a parent which is perhaps the largest job in the world? Adoption of children already breathing on the planet should be a priority over IVF.

A friend I accompanied to an abortion clinic had to endure hateful, angry religious protesters shouting terrible things in a time when clinics were routinely being bombed. So full of the Love of Christ were they, they felt it was necessary to blame my 15 year old friend for the bloody pictures on their posters. I was quite vocal after some particularly nasty comments shouted at my responsible friend and tried to hurry her inside while shielding her bodily. It is hard enough to make a decision for your own life first before having a full term pregnancy but why didn't any of these protesters offer to take her in, shelter her while she brought it to full term and take the financial burden from her if they want her to just have it and give it up for adoption? But she chose not to have a child that young, to finish school, work, marry and have 2 beautifully healthy children later when they could be properly raised and cared for.

I also know a couple who seek to take in foster children for the assistance monies received, not because they truly care for and love them as much as their own biological 3 year old child. Each actually said this to me, unparaphrased. They consider it a temporary 'arrangement' and it enabled them to afford moving into a much nicer large home while these kids wear Wal-mart clothes and eat no-frills brand foods. They were 10 year old twins from Thailand who spoke no English. I don't think there's a big demand for alternative schooling in Arizona to accommodate Thai children. Where's the Christian morality and logic in any of their actions?

Fourteen babies born to one single woman, a college student, all under 8 years old and she's unable to be financially independent to raise them all? What's wrong with this picture? "God's will" would not be to medically intervene and force these beings into life through such means. Don't religions consider this abomination? I thought "God" wanted birth to be from love, for procreation. Be the fruit of a man and woman's loving bond. Not a clinical procedure on the way to daycare. Reprehensible."

What I want to to know is how this person plans to decarve the 666 out of their forehead

What I want to know is how we bash someone for having 8 children when they set out to have 1 child and their own reproductive history put the statistics in the .00 decimal point percentile

What I want to know is why is is so wrong to expect the same standard of support from the public as was given to the others parenting multiples

Why we have such a double standard when it comes to reproductive rights; we support the right to abort children without question or explanation but when the woman decides to keep her children she is subjected to the insanity of the American public and media

Why this woman is treated as if she is a drug addict who went sleeping around with 14 different men when the truth is all of the children are said to be from the same donor, when she did not begin or stay in an unhealthy relationship, she wants to get off the "welfare" she is receiving and be a productive person- which is more than parents who have kids for the purpose of the government money they can get 

EVERYBODY you have 2 choices help the woman; donate to her or SHUT UP!!!  

tulick tulick
31-35, F
245 Responses Feb 26, 2009

are you sure those faculties are still intact

I'm glad your faculties are still intact, VendettA.

I considered the banging head option early on, but since then I've only been bemused and bewildered.

Repeated banging of one's head on a wall, can lead to serious brain damage.

i addmitted nothing just conceeded much of the public thinks she is undeserving but i again come back it its not about her its about those kids

You said "whether she deserves it or not" which admits that it's questionable that she deserves it, or else why would you say "or not"? Thanks for admitting that, it's a small step. Perhaps someday you'll be able to admit some of the bigger glaring truths about this stupid woman. <br />
<br />
I am not judgemental of a woman that wants kids and is unable to have kids and wants to do IVF. As long as they approach it responsibly (you know, as in having crazy things like income and a stable home. crazy stuff that Nadya didn't bother herself worrying about)<br />
<br />
You make it sound like all 14 were just an accident, as if they happened from 1 treatment. Nothing could be further from the truth. I don't oppose the right of a woman to get an IVF treatment to have a child, but if she already has 6? And she has no income? And she's living on borrowed time in a house she's about to lose because she's behind on the mortgage? (Don't bring up your tired argument that Nadya might not have known about the mortgage payments or that it might have happened after she got the treatment done... it takes a while to get $25,000 behind on a mortgage. Duh)<br />
<br />
Well, if that lady already has 6 kids and no income and about to have no home, well then I'm very judgemental about her trying to have more kids. Why would she want to? Only if she's mentally ill. Her mom was the one busting her *** taking care of Nadya's 6 kids. Is she just gonna continue raising Nadya's 6 while Nadya concentrates on the new 8? <br />
<br />
Pathetic.

you would be asstouned at the number of kids molested raped beaten and abused in foster care <br />
<br />
i did not say that she does not deserve help but the focus should be on the kids and how deserving they are not how deserving or not she is <br />
<br />
i don't know what i would do if i wanted kids having found out i coould not have any having been through a failed marrage <br />
<br />
and i'm geussing you don't know what its like to want to have kids and not be able to or perhaps you would be a little less judgemental

I know you don't want kids, you've said so before. But what if you did want kids? What if you wanted a huge family? Would you be in a position to start paying a fortune to get yourself knocked up? In Nadya's world you'd be all set, since you have no job. Of course you can see how ridiculous it would be for you to have IVF treatments. You can see that when it's your own situation, but you stubbornly refuse to admit how bad Nadya's decisions are. It's very hypocritical of you. <br />
<br />
At least you now admit that she doesn't deserve help. Good for you. OF COURSE the kids do, they are the innocent victims in all of this. They need help. Preferably the octuplets should be taken away from her. Nadya deserves nothing but scorn for her decisions. <br />
<br />
I like how you make it sound extremely probable that her kids would be raped if they go in foster homes. Possible? Sure. Probable? Of course not. But by all means continue with the hyperboles.

she is not my heroine i do not want kids i am looking for work <br />
<br />
but based on the president of what happened with other parents of multiples the public should be mre willing than it is to give <br />
<br />
and the kids NEED it whether she deserves it or not

Oh, so you're saying you are living on the edge of poverty with no spare money? Well if you have a job at the moment, quit. Then you'll be in a perfectly responsible position to start your IVF treatments, like Nadya. Imitation is the sincerest form of flattery.

not really

You're not donating money to her, what are you choosing to spend your money on? I assume from your last comment that you don't drink lattes. Coffee? Tea? Kool-aid? Tic-tacs? Surely there is something unnecessary that you spend some of your money on that you could donate to your heroine.

does it really yanking 6 kids away from their mother putting them in foster care to be bounced home to home beaten raped neglected and abused because those are all possibilities no one will want them because they are onlder <br />
<br />
much has been made about the fact that one pf her kids has autism well you think the giant upheaval and possible insituationalization is good for him???? the other 2 with disabilities are likely to strike out too becase no one wants a child who is defective<br />
<br />
even the infants are likely to get a raw deal because of the potential for horrific health problems to say nothing of there has been no neglect on the part of this mother<br />
<br />
what she needs is the resources to take care of her kids and be the loving parent she has been to the 6 <br />
<br />
and why do i get the distinct feeling that most of the people unwilling to give a cent to this wonman want to instead spend it on theit next latte

It isn't just her lack of wealth that makes this an issue, it is her lack of responsibility. The need for more children when you already have 6 is not completely ridiculous but she knew full well the extent of her financial turmoil but she chose to go through with it anyways and now it is time for the government to step in. Don't get me wrong, I'm not big on government interference in domestic situations, but this is an exception and her irresponsibility should bear consequences. I do feel for the children and what they will have to go through in this imperfect system, but the benefits of doing this will far outweigh the pros of staying with their mother.

thats why she needs the help rather than those kids being split up and scattered left with a sense of needing to know where they came from

The help they need is not something this woman can give. She does not have the wealth or the resources and it would definitely be in their best interest to be taken out of her irresponsible hands.

when i say you missed the point intrely i mean simply this it does not matter how foolish irresponsible or whatever people think this woman is <br />
<br />
HER KIDS NEED PEOPLE'S HELP

Singer follows Dedre...and slams the door behind them

*sigh* okay tulick, for what it's worth this is my last post on this story (because I honestly have a fear of being a "hate-stalker/meanie/brute/flamer/troll) unless you want me to post here, I usually don't pester a post without a damn good reason and you know what I realized today? This chick is not a good enough reason, whether she and her children get eaten by the media wolves or survives and each and every child grows up and becomes president I stopped caring enough to post as of this moment.<br />
I will happily concede differences of opinion as the reason, as I am apt to do whenever it seems someone is throttling the internet throat of someone else, I mean, not everyone in the world thinks the same, no? Okay, case closed!<br />
BTW: you said I missed the point entirely, and that does intrigue me, so I am offering you to message me and explain how you mean by that.<br />
Otherwise, ciao fellas, may the wind always be at your back

ala britney spears ahh no

Tulick, you should make a "LEAVE NADYA ALONE!!!" video and post it on youtube.

you missed the point intirely

well she's sure as hell not doing anyone any favors with her actions of succeeding children she can't afford to take care of.<br />
Let's just have thousands of other pychos do the exact same thing and swell our already swollen welfare system until every single person can in fact follow his taxes to every recipient of said penny so we can start throttling some sense into them.<br />
BTW: Tulick, way to go and take my last sentence in what i view as a plethora of oppositional opinion in the total message and only apply to it (though I will admit, I am administering nothing new to this argument, arguing on the internet is like special Olympics, as they say)

oh yeah she's down right eveil and should be burned at the stake *roles eyes*

Thank you my Dear.....For hearing and understanding what I was trying to say......

no tulick, that would not be ironic, that'd be a miracle; all actions a person makes is dictated by their previous actions, so in all justification all that means with her is that she'll continue to suckle the teat of welfare and family with her multitudes of offspring, getting a book and/or movie deal in the process, and live life off of her deed, which was nothing more than pushing biology to its limit.<br />
While I will not track her down and offer any donation for her star-studded approach to celebrity-life, neither will I lift four fingers for her lifestyle despite whatever I hear from the news about her, her children, or her family.<br />
If she ever asks me personally for donations, I will spit in her offering hand and tell her to get a job and raise HER children HERSELF. If she ever does get a tv reality show, I'll make damn sure I'm not part of the audience. If she ever breaks down and realizes how selfish she is for wanting to bring so many children into the world when she could never humanely support a fraction of them, I'll laugh over her huddled body and say (as singer quoted), "sorry, but you made this bed, now lay in it" while I go and cash my paycheck for a hard days work and spend it on myself, because I earned it for MYSELF and not some child-hungry girl who is trying to justify her existence as a human incubator to a startling number of offspring who, honestly, I could care less about (not saying anything bad about the children, but jesus christ! If I go around and plant 16 babies in women, be damned sure every penny I'd earn would go to them, courts action or not!!!!)

"And the worse things that we can do for them is to teach them that If you want to live the good life...Then just do something to mess up your life.....and then ask others to clean up the mess"<br />
<br />
as opposed to work hard say in school don't do drugs get an education that leaves people w/ masters degrees flipping burgers <br />
<br />
as opposed to those kids reading stories similar to this when they are old enough and seeing that the American public was so angry and self rightious that it was willing to throw them under the bus to make an example of their mother

People keep calling her a student.....But she admits that she has not been in school for almost 10 years.....each time she was ready to go back to school after a birth...Well she would go and get preg. once more....She is noit wanting to get an education.....and raise her kids....She is wanting to be another AJ...(Angileni Jolee)....I mean look at the work she had had done on her face......Youi know that she has had stuff done....Far too different in the piucs. of her now...as when she was in High school......And what about the latest....She was given an offer of ropund the clock care for the kids....in house....Medical bills picked up....And what does sshe do.....Says NO!!!!....so now they might take all of the kids....And at this point I think that they should....She is not stable....Or is just looking for a hand out....<br />
<br />
When my oldest was born...My husband made $500.00 a month...He was in a training program....Then when the VA Bill finally caught up to us...(VA Bill....good thing) it gave us another 300.00 a month.....We payed all of the bills for the dilivery....(GOvernment loop hole)...and when I asked for help.... I was told that I had to divorce my husband...and I would get help.....But as he was working a full time job.....(training program) we did not qualify....<br />
<br />
So do I feel for this woman....No....She made her bed....and not she has to live with the mess.....But I do feel for the kids....They did not do anything to deserve what they are living with.....But most of us did nothing to deserve the life that we led as kids....We just learned from it.....And the worse things that we can do for them is to teach them that If you want to live the good life...Then just do something to mess up your life.....and then ask others to clean up the mess

what would be ironic is if she beat all the odds and slapped all of you in the face with her sucess <br />
<br />
what would be more ironic is if they all grew up completely healthy not a thing wrong with them and went on to do great things

Is that your opinion or is that a fact verified? Verily, the doctors they interviewed could be tooting their own horn and whatnot, but it was unanimous that the procedures were incredible overboard, I remember hearing at least 4 different doctors saying so within two days of the occurrence.<br />
<br />
But in my opinion, it IS overboard when she was unable to successfully take care of what she already had, even 1 birth would've been too much. Granted it wouldn't have hit the news or anything, but if I walked up to a woman who couldn't (on her own without assistance from the government or from her family) take care of the many children she already had and was pregnant, I'd do everyone in the world (except her, of course, because it's what she wants) a favor and try my damnedest to convince her of the negligence she is doing to her already born children, to the unborn child(ren), the negligence to her responsibilities as a productive member of society (instead of just an incubative member of society), and her negligence in being a responsible human being and not reproducing just for the sake of indulging her "loving" factor, loving a child does not teach them discipline, loving a child does not put them through college, loving a child does not show them and teach them the rules of life.<br />
<br />
Lol, it'd be ironic if one of those many offspring (and considering statistics it's quite possible nowadays) ends up on the top of a bell-tower spraying angst-filled vengeance until a lucky cop with a scope takes them out and the last words they uttered was "mommy didn't love me"<br />
What a miracle then!

considering her reproductive history it was not overboard

and that's why multiple doctors, within days of the occurrence, have all basically stated it was unethical, unheard of, and unsafe in the field of IFV? I recall many such interviews, with many people saying all but short of calling her doctor a "quack" for taking it sooo overboard.

she set out to have 1 more not 8 more and the odds that she would end up w/ 8 is .00 percent only 6 embyos were implanted 2 became identicaal twins <br />
<br />
somewthing that is nearly unheard of particulrly given this womans history that it took 5-6 implatations to get 1 <br />
<br />
this is why she is on what the other commentor called a media bender she has been forced to combat the negaative perception she and her publisist have been forced to go out and beg for what was freely given in other instances

Damn this post is still being discussed??? Damn if this were ubersite I'm sure it'd top "most heated" immediately...<br />
...Okay, a chick who has 6 kids, lives at her moms, has no job and already suckles from the government benefits-teat, but is a student (good on her on that ONE point), decides to get super-fertilized and have 8 more.<br />
I recall many doctors statements that the procedure she went through was 'over the line' and 'experimental' and such. I recall the mother of the mother, within a day or two of her delivering the litter (yes I'll call it a litter, humans aren't meant to have THAT many in one push, sorry that's my POV...hey, at least I don't call them all "crotchfruit"), talking about how "she just wants to love them all and wants as many kids as possible." and some such nonsense.<br />
Sorry, not when it's on my dime, if you want my two cents. If I ever have a child, be damned sure I'll make sure I'm in a capable position to take care of it, unlike her; I'll make damn sure I can offer substantial care, love, affection, and means to have them grow up and procure a life of their choosing. She has done nothing but show love, and I'm sorry, but I've realized it is NOT true that "all you need is love"<br />
THAT is why I am disgusted....sure it has happened before with all the families tulick keeps mentioning, but it never hit limelight with the media like it did this time. To any family with however many kids; if they are trying to make it work, if they had plans for the upbringing and **** went south...you have my condolences, but if you bring a child into this world (much less 8) when you're already unable (or barely able, thanks to the government) to sustain those you've already brought into this world, that's just being an irresponsible baby-making-machine; and to me that constitutes disgust!

and part of making sure these kids get the care they deserve is leaving them with their mother rather than ripping them away to foster homes where the odds are they stand to be beaten raped molested neglected the existing 6 are not likely to find homes and will likely be bounced from home to home age out of the system the autistic child will likely end up aging out of the system and/ or being insttutionalized depending on the other disabilities they are screwed <br />
<br />
should the octuplits have any such problems well there goes their life or we can donate give this mother a chance and maybe she'll get sutible housing and enough things or $ to provide for them until she can get off welfare

not as much as you might think in that without the donations given their quality of life would have been dastically different <br />
<br />
especally considering that in 2 of those cases one of the donations was a costom built home <br />
<br />
when you cconsider the McCauhey's got free childrens clothing for something like 3-4 years <br />
<br />
when you consider that the diley and the mccauhey houshold were a maze of cribs baby suppies and kids until they moved

so i guess you think the dilleys the the McCaugheys the Gosselins shoud not have recived donations either- whatever <br />
<br />
and who said anything about donations takking over parental resposibilites

wrong donating to her will give these kids a chance without having to be given away without the existing 6 being ripped away from their mother <br />
<br />
I understand why their petty anger is detremental to these kids i understand there is a giant double standard being employed here in that when selective reduction wasn't used in other cases the mothers were respected for their decision <br />
<br />
i understand in the US we can abort life no question but this woman wants to keep her kids and she's mentally unstable <br />
<br />
and untilizing the system is NOT cheating it

"to say nothing of the folks who would find a way to cheat the system to get what they wanted anyway" - Tulick<br />
<br />
That is just exactly what Nadia has done thus far from the first pregnancy till this litter.

All of those are cop out answers to avoid examining how deeply irresponsible and offensive Nadya's version of child abuse is.

the dog has to be liccenced ie shots and tags not the person <br />
<br />
and even if you had to have a lkicence for parenting (which is horrible) there are people who would not pass it but would make excelllent parents and likewse people who would pass that ened up being horrible parents <br />
<br />
to say nothing of the folks who would find a way to cheat the system to get what they wanted anyway

We'll try this again...try to pay attention: I didn't say that donations didn't make a difference. <br />
<br />
I'm trying to explain to you WHY people are so angry at Nadya and therefore much less likely to donate to her because of those feelings of anger. You keep bringing this up and saying it's hypocritical for the people who donated to the other families to NOT donate to Nadya. Because you are slow to understand the reasons why people are treating her differently than the other families, I'm explaining to you the differences. <br />
<br />
Circumstances that you say don't matter between Nadya and the other families makes comparing them RIDICULOUS. But of course that doesn't stop a ridiculous person from making those comparisons, to someone such as yourself those comparisons seem totally legit. <br />
<br />
lol

Way to go MizzBlue72! Welcome aboard the crazy train.<br />
<br />
Excellent points made. Great voice. I agree and concur wholeheartedly.

Way to say in VendettA - <br />
I understand and will ALWAYS put women and children first.<br />
In my opinion - She needs to put her new 8 kids up for adoption. End of discussion. <br />
<br />
I am a mother - how can I say this? Children do not chose to be born. EVERY child deserves more than falling in the cracks. Children need love - LOTS of love. This mom may have love to five, but being a single mom, with 14 children. Her love will be stretched WAY too thin to help these children. How many couples out there would DIE to have just one child. <br />
<br />
What about all the gay and lesbian couples that would LOVE the chance to bring their love to one of these children??? <br />
<br />
The mother had a terrible, TERRIBLE lapse of judgement here. <br />
<br />
last word from me: I have one child. Yes - I would LOVE to have another child someday, will I? NO. WHY? <br />
1. I have no mate to raise said child with <br />
2. I want to ensure that my child is loved and cared for in a fashion that he deserves; since I am a working mom - I need to devote as much time to him as possible <br />
3. College - I want to ensure my child has a great education in life <br />
Yes - I could put caution to the wind and say - 'Yep - I feel like having another child' and go get invitro -- but COME ON!! With the list above, any SANE person would never do it. <br />
<br />
You have to have a license to own a dog - but not for a child.

it doesn't matter what the situations the donations or in this case lack there of is what is going to matter to those kids <br />
<br />
and if you don't think that the donatons give to the Dilley's the McCaugheys the Gosselins made a difference in their qulity of life you are the dilusional ones not me

Ahhh, V....<br />
<br />
The defender!<br />
<br />
That is what you represent to tulick. She made me recount all my beliefs and points again too.

Ah yes, back to that old canard of saying Nadya is comparable to those other families... As far as talking points go, this is one of your golden oldies. Nevermind that Nadya's situation and choices are so alarmingly different from those other families that it's ridiculous to even compare the situations. Maybe if Jon and Kate had started with 6 kids, and then made sure they had no income and got $25,000 behind on the mortgage, and then decided to go in for MORE kids and gotten 7 or 8 embryos implanted and lucked out with octuplets... well, then they're situation would be comparable to Nadya. But even then, they would be married so the work that each of them do is multiplied for Nadya who of course is alone. <br />
<br />
Ya, I can see how a person might think these situations are basically the same thing. If that person is mental, that is. <br />
<br />
hahahaha

If you're not going to donate to Nadia's family then why don't you stop telling everyone else to give their money to her.

i do not have the money to put where my mouth is <br />
<br />
but on the flip side i am not bashing the woman <br />
<br />
i DO care about these kids and the conditions they will live in that is why i point out the double standard in terms of abortoin/ selective reduction and this woamans choice to KEEP her kids <br />
<br />
that is why i remind the ever forgetful public that it donated to the other families and it is those donations that made the childrens lives as good as they were

On a site for writing stories, it is assumed you are bright enough to spell and communicate clearly. Stop saying the comments need spell check, it is silly.<br />
<br />
WOW. "not doing that bad". Way to aim high for quality of life. They're better off in the hospital than with Nadia. Ever.<br />
<br />
Again, No, YOU shut up. Neenerneenerneeeeeener!!!!!!! What, now I'm not allowed to get as immature as you've been to me and everyone else opposing this sitch? HA!<br />
<br />
Lacey, you are thoughtful and caring, thank you for saying what I was about to about sleeping around/getting knocked up or CHOSING IVF for this atrocity. Sad sitch.

tulick is so funny. Her concern for the children ends at "but don't say anything bad about the kids mom, you'll hurt their feelings". She's not at all concerned about the living conditions that her brood will have to deal with, the lack of a home and income, the lack of love that will come from a single person running around like a headless chicken trying to watch 14 kids.... No, all of that is fine. But DON'T CRITICIZE THE MOM! WHAT ABOUT THE CHILDREN? hahahha. As if the kids will even have access to the internet. <br />
<br />
Only tulick could trick herself into believing that she's the protector and defender of these kids... when everyone else can she that she only cares about defending the delusional decisions of an obviously deranged woman. Only an impaired woman could think it's a good idea to have more kids when she has no income and already can't handle the 6 that she already has... <br />
<br />
Tulick keeps offering two choices to people, either donate to them, or S.T.F.U. and move along. Tulick's obviously not going to S.T.F.U. since she thinks her stubbornness is a virtue, so I assume she's going to donate to the family. Or will Tulick not put her money where her big mouth is? Hmmmm.

I never claimed to be able to spell or more apply in this case type <br />
<br />
what would REALLY help is if EP got some spell check in the comment section <br />
<br />
you can argue all you want about the definiton of life support but the fact is one of them is in the process or preparing to come home so they cannot be doing that bad <br />
<br />
I did not say anything about respecting Nayda Suleman what i said was people need to do one of 2 things help or respect the CHILDREN and shut up <br />
<br />
and who is the imture one now

Debatable. I'll go start that group with your quoted statement.<br />
<br />
Like I just said, Americans will be donating by way of higher insurance rates and not being able to file claims. Respecting the children's lives and care and upbringing is the point of MY STORY to begin with. No one respects Nadia Suleman.<br />
<br />
No, YOU shut up. Neenerneenerneeeeeener!!!!!!!

i am far from too angry to fuction in society and DO NOT need to be caged drugged up because of it <br />
<br />
if people were truly concerned they would donnate to this woman and if they could not they would respect the children enough to SHUT UP about their mother

you said: "but if you are right and the tubes are for breathing it is to suplement oxegyn not like a ventalator that helps in breathing or breaths for them (the true definition of life support)" That's not true. First, you need a dictionary because your spelling is atrocious! Second the definition of life support is anything to sustain life and that includes food (or IV's or feeding tubes) to sustain life! Pure and simple. Why so you think the Terry Schiavo case was such a big deal? I don't recall her being on ventilation life support, she had a freaking feeding tube which was removed (after all of those Senators left DC to scream on her behalf and Senator Frist diagnosed her over the TV!). It kept her alive for a few days and she perished without it. So, get your definition right........... Now, back from the commercial break.............

And Americans will be donating through our raised insurance rates, inability to file our own claims due to lack of funds and NOT by choice. But because this narcissistic woman sought to produce so many kids she cannot take care of.<br />
<br />
Thank you Moto. :)

Plagerizing is when you don't credit the author of the material you're quoting, without permission.

These life supported octuplets receive: Their nasal tubes are left in and are ventillator-respiratory, they cannot breathe or swallow on their own yet. That's how premature they are, as 8 in one litter will be. Just a fact. Not my opinion. And when feeding, they insert, feed, then remove the tube, it does not stay in.<br />
<br />
Unlike Octopupmom's IVF doctor, we in the real world do not leave a patient's treatment up to them to decide. Especially when someone is too angry to function on society. They are committed and kept medicated. Anger is an illness to be treated in America.<br />
<br />
I think 2 people stuck up for you here, but not with facts about my story or all the comments contradicting your views; but just immature lashing out and name-calling. My story got quite a few recs and positive feedback, as yours has not.<br />
<br />
Look, honey, I am compassionate about the lives of the litter and how awful that woman is for seeking all this narcissistic attention to herself, ignoring the care of her 1st six kids. SIX KIDS is far too many to to right by given she is unemployed and on disability for a phantom back injury and on welfare and on and on.<br />
<br />
She's repulsive and the 14 children are/will suffer for her selfish neglect of their future and present care. I'm concerned for their upbringing. I've said it over and over...

acctually no they are the ones who brought up the plagerism and if you actually read the comments you would see the one that stated that just because people agreed w/ her doesn't mean they are right <br />
<br />
and QUOTING MATERIAL IS NOT PLAGERZING <br />
<br />
and here is a fact for you the bottom line is Americans have a choice to either donate and help the woman giving her a chance to raise these chilren or cause all 14 to be put in the foster care system and cost MORE money to the tax paying public

She is not the ONLY one stating that you plagerized her story! Not by a long shot, you did it, outright. That is taking the focus from any kind of argument that you could make about this story, although you are not and cannot make one. Your statements are non-sensical and not based on any factual information. Qazral is posting factual information which you continually chose to ignore, vintage Tulick.<br />
You are the one making this into something else besides the original story, instead of staying on topic.

I can tell you this that i do not need theraapy or medication of ANY kind just because i am stuborn anger is NOT a disease <br />
<br />
the tubes in their noses look more like nazal gastic tubes to me and those are for feeding <br />
<br />
but if you are right and the tubes are for breathing it is to suplement oxegyn not like a ventalator that helps in breathing or breaths for them (the true definition of life support) <br />
<br />
just because people agree with you that i supposedly plagerized your horrid story doesn't mean they are right i clearly did things to diferentate the 2 points of view as belonging to 2 differnt people and as i said before that is the end of the burden at least for this site <br />
<br />
why do i have to say things to you over and over

I know they still are. Tubes up their noses are for breathing, that's called respiration. And they cannot yet on their own. Nor can they swallow, need to be fed thru tubes directly into their stomach, they can't nurse either. That means they would die, no eat + no live. I didn't think I had to repost my understanding of the sitch every time I write.<br />
<br />
It is a pity you are so stubborn. I'm sure it keeps you from fully enjoying life. As all your experiences say about you, you continue being sad, angry and alone. Yes, you do need professional help and meds.<br />
<br />
Several readers have commented for me that you did indeed plagerize. And why does every detail of everything have to constantly be repeated to you over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over..........

well at least you stopped claimng the octuplets in question are on resperators thats a start <br />
<br />
i don't need a phychitrest or a theripist a shrink a life coach or anything like that people lke you far far away from me will do just fine <br />
<br />
and i see you have NO answer as to why you are the ONLY one crying plagerism i see you have NO comment as to what i gave as the reason for NOT including your name <br />
<br />
and it doesn't matter now anyway because EVERYONE now knows you are the author of the quoted mess at the top of the story

I haven't done any name-calling here, that was YOU and your immature pals sticking up for you having nothing else factual to say.<br />
<br />
I said I counseled, not that I am a counselor now. No guise. But you need a psychiatrist. Quickly.<br />
<br />
Ten years ago, The Simpsons had the Apu character and his wife have octuplets. The family is shown having a horrible time raising them. IVF producing 8 kids at once was considered ludicrous, part of the comedy. NOT a chance of actually happening in real life.<br />
<br />
That's an example of how ridiculous this situation is.<br />
<br />
And you plagerized without my permission, without notating my name. You are offensive, and sad. Get professional help.

actually as long as the words are quoted and people know they are NOT your own the most you are going to get is a warning to say nothing of what i said about why i did not nclude the authors name that i did not want my susequent opintion to be percived as an attack and be in violation of the terms of use spesific to this site<br />
<br />
this is no different than the posting of song lyrics that i see here all of the time i have quoted other authors material for the same reason why are you the only one crying plagerism???<br />
<br />
and this is NOT a student site or an accedemic one so the burden is to simply show the words are not your own- as i have done and you had troubble seeing that <br />
<br />
and LEAVE INERPID TRAVLER ALONE she is absolutly right anyone who touts they are a couselor then says the kind of things you said to me should have their crdentials pulled and not be able to inflic their crap on people never mind under the guise of a professional

THANK YOU BETTY. IT WAS PLAGERISM .<br />
<br />
AND INTREPID TRAVELER IS THE NAME CALLING SMALL MINDED INDIVIDUAL HERE. NOT I.<br />
<br />
If you didn't see I was trying to be kind to the damaged person who lifted my story for her own attention (much the way Nadia seeks attention) then I feel just as sorry for you. This has gone far off point and into the gutter. Pitiful.

:)))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))

okay I'll be honest, I only read half-way through your post before I started yawning and dozing off...I'll check it in the morning, so forgive me if I speak outta turn...<br />
...but from what I read, yea I agree; sure it's a cool thing to have accomplished...but to have state (or fed) pay for it all to some chick who has no job, no reasonable aspects of a job and whatnot...hell no!!!<br />
I didn't get born into this country and pay its taxes so some chick can have so many kids and get government aid!!<br />
Reminds me of the sinful (to me) quote: "From each according to their abilities, to each according to their needs."

its not stealing thats the whole point

it got old for everyone but 3 people long ago and quoting is not stealing

it is not that obvious much less obvious than what i have been saying

Well my original use of it wasn't cryptic, it's pretty obvious what I was talking about. Unless a person is slow on the uptake, that is. Sorry!

oh i have more than 6 opperating brain cells and have proved it by in nothing else staying on point <br />
<br />
and YOU assumed i did not know whaat the saying meant rather than the fact that i was indcating a need fore you to futher explain yourself which 99% of others do when they see a comment like that one

In a single post you manage to ask me to explain something to you...but then you turn around and make a snarky comment about people being slow on the uptake... never realizing that it is you that is slow on the uptake and needing an explanation...<br />
<br />
When you dish out insults or descriptions of people that actually apply more to yourself, that is known as the pot calling the kettle black. You have made plenty of insulting comments (6 brain cells, slow on the uptake, etc) which actually apply to yourself more than the ones you are talking about.

huh?

i understand the saying i just would lke you to explain how you think it relates to what i said ant you wonder why i make comenta bout people being somewhat slow on the uptake

It's a metaphor known around the world. <br />
<br />
If you don't understand it, I can't help you.

"It's been a while since I've seen so many demonstrations of the pot calling the kettle black."<br />
<br />
WTF???

Why keep trying to bring other people into it? Concentrate on Nadya, the lady with 6 kids and no income who thought the best use of $30,000 was to have another kid. So much for college funds for any of them. So much for lots of things.

Lacey, you must be one of those that are "slow on the uptake" according to tulick lol... It's been a while since I've seen so many demonstrations of the pot calling the kettle black. <br />
<br />
Carry on.

where did i say anything about resposible i said if the house was not that far in debt or in debt at all at the time of treatment then she was free to do as she chose <br />
<br />
the same goes for if she did not know of the mouting debt <br />
<br />
qand people have found far stupider uses for $30,000

Yes, I know it's her mother's house. Thank god she has a mom, or else who would have given her a home and taken care of her first 6 kids? lol<br />
<br />
Does any of that change any of the points I made about responsible use of $30,000? <br />
<br />
No.

she lives there but it is not her house her its her mothers house <br />
<br />
she may not have know about the deliquent payments at the time of treatment or the money racked up could have done so durring her pregnacy i don't know and i'm guessing neither do you

Dah? You mean duh? <br><br />
<br><br />
"for those a little slower on the uptake" <br><br />
<br><br />
hahaha, seriously, you are a barrel of laughs. You have no shame, dishing out comments that fit you so much better than the people you are trying so feebly to lash out at. It's borderline pathetic, but it's not quite there so it's still ok to laugh at. <br><br />
<br><br />
Nice splitting of the hairs re: the house payments. I'll try to explain this, you know, since you seem to be slow on the uptake. You don't get over $20,000 past due immediately, it takes a while, you know? Even IF she were current on the mortgage at the time of getting IVF, how is that an even remotely responsible use of money? Since they're now leaving the house, I'm assuming that she doesn't have enough in savings to make the mortgage current. If you're current on your bills and have no savings and six kids, you would have to be seriously mentally handicapped to think the best way to utilize $30,000 is to have at least another kid. <br><br />
<br><br />
So funny how you cannot grasp such basic ideas. I'm sure that after this thread, if I were to look up cognitive dissonance I'd see a link to your profile.

i did not rip off the story says the quotes around the material that is NOT mine ssys the diferentation of italic material vs. not and in case those 2 things weren't clues enough the next line after the quoted material is <br />
<br />
"What I want to to know is how this person plans to decarve the 666 out of their forehead" cleaarly indicating that the above material is NOT mine it is not my fault that this person as well as your own reading comprehension is so low<br />
<br />
to say nothing of by leaving the authors name out of it but quoting the material it keeps me from being sactioned for attacking another user becaause you are not supposed to use another persons user name in such a way DAH!!!

and my question about the house payments was- WAS IT THAT WAY AT THE TIME OF HER IVF TREATMENT the point being if it was not then she was free to do as she chose for those a little slower on the upatake <br />
<br />
THEY ARE NOT ON RESPERATORS says ever peice of media footage and every picture all you see are moniters and the feeding tube one is even shown sucking on a pasifier <br />
<br />
the doctor who was head of the dilivery team or at least part of it even commented that all some needed was oxgyen through the nose and that was only for a maatter of hours or days <br />
<br />
there have been NO reports in major media outlets that indicate that any of them are suffering from organ failure or EVER did it is the SAME with the claimes on brain damage

Tulick you did ripoff Qazral's story, your denying that is pure bs. Anyone who has ever quoted someone else's story on EP starts out the story and states very clearly "This is a repost from . . ." Nowhere in your post did you indicate this was not written by you. Besides your irrelevant points and your ignoring the facts presented, your reposting without acknowledging the original author is reprehensible.

lol at tulick whining about not having claims responded to... the irony. She's the queen of ignoring facts and questions, as this 170 post thread proves.

THEY ARE on respirators and feeding tubes as the report discussed in detail, at length. You know nothing factual about the reality of anything to do with this case.<br />
<br />
This litter WILL HAVE brain damage, organ failure and mental/developmental problems, most likely will be seen.<br />
<br />
You still cannot answer anything directly addressed to you, Tulick. <br />
<br />
Please respond to these facts: These preemies have/will have brain damage, organ failure, developmental problems. What can you say regarding these facts?<br />
<br />
And you keep ignoring that I answered you: Her house payments are behind by $25,000 (about equal to the cost of the IVF that gave her this pregnancy) and will be foreclosed March 1st because she won't/can't pay it.<br />
<br />
What do you say to defend Nadia about not paying for her house, where are all 14 supposed to live? A 3 bedroom house wasn't big enough for the 6 she had and IS BEING FORECLOSED March 1st....hello? Still think all of her decisions are OKAY?

they are NOT on resperaters <br />
<br />
yes they haave what look like feeding tubes <br />
<br />
ALL premies are in incubaaters <br />
<br />
these babies COULD have brain damage organ failure and /or developmental problems that remains to be seen <br />
<br />
and no one caares about my question or assuretion about was the house in forclousre or did that happej in the 6-9 months she was pegnant