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Let's Be Real

I just heard about the shooting in Aurora, CO. That hit me harder than most of these do. I've been to Aurora ... more than a few times. Hell I may have driven by that theater. Two of my kids were at a Batman premiere last night .... that shooting could have happened anywhere. My heart is still racing .... and I feel sick. Now i have no idea how or where this maniac got these guns, semi automatics for christs sake, I'm sure more will come out in the next few days, but the result is sickening.

Now i support the right of every american to own a gun. No problem there at ALL. I just think it would be reasonable to have a NATIONAL standard that everyone buying a gun has a criminal background check and is subject to a short waiting period. I realize that won't stop all nuts but it is a reasonable, prudent step. I also believe that semi automatic weapons (essentially machine guns) , cop killer bullets, hell anything armor piercing, should be not available to the general public. What the hell does a guy defending his house or hunting a deer (both legitimate and worthy reasons to own and use a gun) need a machine gun with armor piercing bullets for... WHAT? That is insanity. A few simple reasonable steps may (I would never say would) make mornings like this morning a thing of the past. We can only pray.
deleted deleted 26-30 12 Responses Jul 20, 2012

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Just had to revisit these after whats happened in Newtown - I know someone who has suffered there because of this in Newtown. I wondered if anyone who thinks it's okay to have weapons made easily to everyone, if the same thing happened to someone in your family you may think differently.

I feel that a gun is like a spare tire in your car, you hope that you never have to use it, but its there if you need it.

armor piering bullets would have been for someone to stop the shooter at Aurora

You are aware that it is illegal to own a machine gun (fully automatic) for the vast majority of America's populace (lots of bureaucracy to get the necessary permits, costs lots of money as the legal automatics are rare and therefore valuable), and has been since 1934 (The FBI got tired of mobsters with tommy guns.), right? Most hunting rifles are (body) armor (and motor vehicle) piercing with a standard bullet, and in fact have more powerful bullets than the average assault rifle. To ban semi-automatics would be to all but ban handguns (which are almost all semi-auto, because they're better than revolvers). If one excludes handguns, all it takes is a bit of molded plastic to turn it into a very easily handled shoulder-fired weapon, and a bit of sheet metal and spring to extend a magazine. A light semi-auto hunting rifle with a bit of modification is an assault rifle (or, with a little bit of work, one can make a mechanical action fire nearly as fast). <br />
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Let us be realistic. The perpetrator in this case spent months preparing for his rampage, and had the brains to rig his apartment (which had to be disarmed in a controlled detonation by EOD) to explode (We see the effectiveness of bomb control.), and the surplus of body armor suggests a big budget. Given that, there is no reason to believe he wasn't capable of acquiring a semi-auto carbine, a shotgun, and a couple of pistols illegally had it been required of him. <br />
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There is nothing that can be done to disarm crazies with massacre on the mind. Anders Brevik lived in Norway, which regulates guns precisely as you suggest. As far as America goes, we are among the most complex and diverse societies on the planet, with a violence problem that goes far deeper than guns (Children, for example, are at greater risk of dying of abuse at their parent's hand in America than any other first world country.). I'd argue that our population owning enough small arms for every man, woman, and child is more a manifestation of that than the cause. As it is, those 300 million guns are a genie that isn't going to be put in a bottle anytime soon (even if trying to take them doesn't provoke armed rebellion, a 99% success rate still leaves plenty of guns for the wackos), and the words "gun control" are the answer to every gun store owner's prayers, as those two words (or the election of a Democrat who is merely expected to utter them) invariably causes sales to skyrocket. <br />
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I am also a bit surprised that not one journalist/writer/whatever has noted that, while we are better armed than ever before, and in the middle of the worst economy since the Great Depression, our murder rate remains in a downward trend, and is lower than any point from Reagan on. One cannot be real and fail to note that living in America is currently safer than any time in the past 20-30 years.

I tend to think its a cultural "fear mongering" epidemic which encourages and feeds the american penchant for uber violence.

I agree with both of you... 100%

I don't own a gun. I am not a gun rights advocate. I think it's silly to own a high powered rifle.<br />
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That said, guns don't kill people. People kill people. The Oklahoma City bombing was carried out with fertilizer. Are we going to regulate the purchase of fertilizer? What about kitchen knives that are longer than 6 inches? (I have 4).<br />
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What we need is to take a good long look in the mirror as to why we have so many young people who are killing themselves and their peers, why we have an obsession with instant fame. FOMO (Fear Of Missing Out) is running rampant to the point where people don't talk to their neighbors anymore because there's something way more interesting on the internet.<br />
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This kid had NO warning signs. NONE. He was a great student who experienced life's first struggle as a graduate student. He was in the process of getting kicked out of school. I'm guessing that, for him, failure wasn't an option. So, he buried himself in creating an artificial reality for himself. He snapped.<br />
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We all need to own this.<br />
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More regulations won't protect us from each other. We need to talk to each other.

Pssst... Ronan... you know when you put alka seltzer in water and it fizzles...? Well, your story is fizzling now...

Actually other countries aren't consuming the same media ... and America doesn't have lax gun control in relation to many countries.

And no, I'm not kidding. Norway is a classic example of a society that has some of the strictest gun control legislation AND one of the most effective prisoner reform programs and was still victim to this kind of violence. Government regulation won't fix this. Only people talking to people can fix this.

The right to bare arms goes back to the paranoia or clever forethought depending on who you ask ... For American's to have arms so that if necessary they can form militias to either protect themselves or if needed over throw a corrupt government regime ... Of course our founders likely were overly influenced by their recent past... The civil war and freedom from The English ... I wonder if they would have written it as they did had they realized what it would devolve into in the future ... <br />
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That said I don't know that any amount of gun control wwould stop homicidal maniacs ... This particular type of villain usually smart enough to find and exploit weaknesses and loopholes ... This thug had no record and did get the items legally (passed background check and waited the days required) he didn't send out any typical red flags .... And to me this only makes the incident more scary ... <br />
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Really though in practice the idea of stricter gun laws really don't seem like they will help... Because people who engage in gun violence are typically people who have no problem with breaking the law... So laws will only affect those people who are law abiding and those people aren't the ones murdering people .... <br />
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I think people need to start being taught about the value of all life instead of this whole "it's all about me " groupthink that's passed off as a mantra to happiness

The creep had one semi automatic and a regular handgun and regular rifle ... His semiautomatic actually jammed ... Without missing a beat he used his handgun and rifle ...

America has gun control so maybe what causes other countries to do better isn't their gun control but something cultural ...

Just to be clear I'm not in favor of guns ... But as stated previously the constitution allows American citizens to bare arms so that they may protect themselves and allows them the ability to form militias ... The implication being that they should have firepower that could effectively fight in a army like manner ...

I am sorry this is probably not what you want to hear and this is coming from a Canadian gal, but I think your constitution or whatever it is which gives any one the power to take a person's life so flippantly should be revised. <br />
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For heaven's sake something should be revised; folk have WAY too much POWER to wield weapons and take lives, it's like a nightmare which as far as i can tell, tragically, has no signs of abating...Something's gotta give.<br />
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How many more murders will it take, I just wonder when I watch TV coverage of US massaces, always. <br />
IS ease which allows people to obtain the weapons in direct correlation/ratio with the number of killings?<br />
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I suppose that if an intruder went at me with a weapon I would hesitate very little to fire a weapon to protect my life or the life of my family..wow huge and difficult questions here.<br />
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In general I think guns should be banned , period, from everyone but that is another world I am dreaming about, not this reality but a Shangrila which may never come to exist...? Or like John Lennon said <br />
"I'm a dreamer, but I'm not the only one."

On my way home from work yesterday I was listening to the talkie, talkies on the radio, and I had the thought that it will turn out that this guy is crazy. Some sort of delusional mental condition has on set and led to this. That's what happened with the terrible shooting in Arizona and other places. So, how do we identify this on setting condition in people and separate them from weapons and get them the help they need?

I too have been to Aurora visiting friends who lived there a while ago. I agree with you, Incidents like this should be a HUGE concern for all parties!

Would be interesting to compare, other countries that do not allow possession of guns to the general public except for hunting vs. the US. Most European cops do not carry guns on the street or the general public do not feel the need to carry them. Wonder what the stats are for incidents like this in those countries.

Wow well there's our answer!!

These people are convinced that President Obama has an agenda to seize their weapons. I remind them that the President is a constitutional scholar who knows just as much about our rights to guns as any attorney the NRA has on staff. They never thought of that. Then tell them that the President is a politician who knows better than to threaten anyone's gun possession and ownership. (disclaimer - I own a handgun, rifle and a shotgun. All are legal by Texas law. I also hold a concealed handgun permit). Military grade ammo is unnecessary for the public to possess. They are paranoid.

I just recently had a discussion / fight with a person defending his right to own 24 guns including an assault weapon which apparently is a "blast" at the range. I was never going to make him understand that although I supported his right to own A weapon, that multiple weapons and assault and automatic weapons were indefensible, especially when stored in a private residence. It was an argument I was never going to win, so I walked away. So you and I have to just learn to live with stories like the Aurora one ( I have family in that city) as this, as an issue, is not going away any time soon. In fact they are trying to get Obama out of office because they feel that he is cramping their gun-toting lifestyle. God help us.

It IS nuts. Their obsession with needing to feel ready in the event of civil war and riots and the zombie apocalypse that are all imminent is frustrating when you are attempting to have a discussion about the need for strict regulation concerning background checks and quantity. I believe that they are making themselves look a little paranoid, and not in a good way.