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We Had A Fight Last Night....

My husband and I had a horrible fight last night. As I am not a submissive wife I spoke up and asserted myself when he completely disregarded my feelings.
I still breastfeed our 1year old daughter, but occasionally we do give her a bottle of formula as a supplement. She is consuming solids ( 3 meals a day) and has been for 6 months or so. The breastfeeding and/ or bottles are for comfort typically prior to bed.

Last night I was breastfeeding our little one, but she was still very cranky. My husband suggested giving her a bottle to help settle her for the night. I agreed. he proceeded to remove a bottle of formula ( which she had consumed half of the night prior) from the fridge and then place it into the microwave to heat it. I lost it, he knows because I have educated him regarding the dangers inherent in both these practices.
1. Once a child places her mouth on a bottle she introduces bacteria into the formula ( to be safe formula should be used within 1 hour) and should never be placed into the fridge to be given to the child at a later time.
2. Microwaves are not to be used to heat bottles ever as they can produce uneven heating and hotspots which can seriously scald a child.

I am a RN whom works in maternal/ newborn and I teach both of these concepts to new parents. I have a university degree in Nursing and hold a Bachelor's degree. I know that I am right.

I spoke up and asserted myself and my husband became defensive and rude. He completely disrespected me and our daughter and fed my daughter the bacteria ridden and likely dangerously over heated formula. Words were exchanged. It wasn't pretty and I am so ANGRY!!

Now had I been a submissive wife I guess I just would have let him go ahead without saying a word, there wouldn't have been a fight, but I would have died a little inside and felt extreme resentment.
That is the danger in being submissive, what if the husband or dominant wife is dead wrong??? How utterly and completely insane to allow just 1 person to make all of the decisions!
I will fight a 1000 fights to protect my children! My husband is no god, he is a mortal human being capable of error. I find his judgement lacking at times and his ego gets in the way of his ability to respect me and my education.
gumshoejane2 gumshoejane2 36-40, F 65 Responses Sep 18, 2012

Your Response


You deserved a spanking for being disrespectful and NOT submitting as you should. As a Christian you should know to submit to your husband. Shame on you.

I miss the point of your fight if your child was given the suspect formula anyway. If you had prevented this action, the fight was worth it. Being that you did not prevent it, all you did was make noise. Choose battles wisely, then fight for all you are worth.

As a submissive, a good dominant always listens to health concerns. A sign of a healthy relationship is teamwork; dominant/submissive relationships just have a different team dynamic. If I was in the situation you described, I would remind my husband of the dangers, and remind him that I had the expertise in that field. Submissive =/= doormat. Dominant =/= omniscient.

submissive is a two way street...if you are using it in a Christian context, don't forget it says submit one to another...

But he gets the final say. But yes, he should listen to her and take her concerns very serious. He should have net gone ahead and place the bottle in the mic as is. He should have put the formula in a glas and then in the mic then in the bottle. BUT she was SO WRONG by disrespecting him and NOT being submissive. As a Christian wife she should know that the bible says for her to submit, obey, him and not disrespect him. they were BOTH wrong. But she was wrong in how she reacted.

I agree with Ebbmilkmaid who said, "there is a difference between submissive and being a doormat." I agree with you that your husband needed to handle himself way differently than he did.

Applauding you again.....!!!!!

If you are
Worried about uneven heating it's called shake well and test before feeding.

That's exactly what I was thinking... To be honest the mothers concerns seemed a little OTT...

Edit: Sorry about necro-ing this post xD Though it was 2014.... xD

you are absolutely right to speak up on your daughters behalf. her health and safety far outweight any other situation at to always throw out bottles so husband not tempted ( i had one like that too)

However we will have to agree to disagree about submission..there is a difference between submissive and being a doormat..Also a difference betwwen dominance and being mean or a total ****. For those who cant tell they should not be involved in the lifestyle.

Being a "submissive" wife has been so misused and misinterpreted (primarily by the churched population) that it has gotten out of control and has turned men into neanderthals and women into mouses, hiding who they are and riddled with guilt if they speak out. Here's the real deal........When the Bible tells wives to submit to their husbands, I wish people would read the rest of that verse. The husbands are required to submit to Christ. Funny how that slips through the cracks. How do husbands submit to Christ? By allowing Christ to live through them and receiving His love and what He says about them. If you are a believer, the Bible tells that as Jesus is then so are we. Who was Jesus? What was He like? He certainly wasn't a neanderthal and He had great respect for women. A woman will naturally "submit" to a husband who is allowing Jesus to show up in how he talks to his wife, responds to her and treats her. Jesus gently woos us to Him. He never demands, yells, demeans or guilts us into anything. He always treats us with love. Even those who may not be Believers, He is still wooing them. Submitting isn't meant as a domineering act, it's an act of gentle love. The church has screwed up it's meaning for far too long. Think about it, isn't it easier to submit to someone who speaks kindly to you, shows you respect and treats you like you matter?

You were right to speak up to your husband because your baby was in danger. Don't ever apologize for being who you are. Just talk to him the way you would like to be talked to. I often use a calm and firm voice with my husband when I feel he is doing something I don't agree with. I point out that I may know a little something about what he's doing and I don't like his decision. But I also remember that I am not his mama or his Holy Spirit. Sometimes you just have to trust Papa God with your baby during your husband's moments of stubborn stupidity (after all, don't we all have some of those moments?). When I treat my husband with respect, I often get it in return. Sometimes he listens and sometimes he doesn't. Sometimes he gets all caveman on me. I just let him be. It's hard in your case because your mother instincts and every medical training you ever kicked into high gear but I trust that baby ended up unscathed in the end.

or make sure 1/2 used bottles a tossed daily

I enjoy your writing and find you to be a very intelligent woman. I guess my debate here is that the word submissive seems to have been bastardized in this discussion, as I hear it that way many times. Many confuse submissive with doormat. Woman, with work, family, responsibility, seem to want those times of letting go, loss of control, but at times, usually more sexual in nature. But the key is, woman are more dimensional then men, so they can more easily be submissive in the bedroom, coy, and so on, yet can also be 50 percent of a strong relationship and perform any job a man can. Further more in true relationships where there is dominance and submission - the submissive is usually the one who is more confident, where if there is trust in the dominant, can let go - that takes tremendous confidence and self awareness. So, to me, I love when I have earned the trust of a woman, to where she can let go, and be submissive, allow herself to lean on a shoulder and let me take the lead - because I have excited her mind and proved that I can be multi-dimensional as well. All I am trying to point out that submissive is not bad, doormat is. You knew better then to let that formula be used - any true submissive would have fought just as hard.

What if the husband or dominant wife is dead wrong?

Simple. "mistress/master I wish to have my objection noted I do not believe that this is a wise choice of action, I only feel the need to object because I feel strongly on this matter, please I beg of you may I have permission to prepare the bottle myself?"

IF you have a very dominant/submissive relationship that would work it't not about not being heard being weak or not communicating at all.
Forgive me for saying but, I don't think you comprehend the dynamics at work in those types of relationships, although you know your milk lol.

Thank you for your comment!
Since writing this I have come to much better understanding of D/s dynamics. I was very wrong to imply that submissive wives are weak and don\'t speak up when needed.

Thank you for taking the effort. That says volumes for you.

where have you been hiding? I\'m interested in understanding the dynamic if not necessarily related to self esteem or so

true we can’t generalize, nice of you to open up and perceive other then

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You are very right in what you did and asserting yourself. He put your child in danger and should be taken to task for it!!

But....I disagree in that defining "submissive" as being one who doesn't defend herself or what she believes in. Of's stupid to argue over labels.

Your conviction and protecting your child were right on. Defend the defenseless at all cost. Your child is lucky to have a mother as loving as you.

gosh, I remember you


I may have written a story for him no awhite? Mayhem in room 69 or something related to why I like giving bj\'s and explained Freud

It has been a while!! I do remember. I think that was on my very first profile here.

I wondered why you were not in my circle, let me go smoke a blunt and back verify the 2 stories I

Hahahaa!!! Go for it!

Thank you white dot!
I have grown in my understanding of D/s dynamics since writing this.
I completely agree with you, subs do speak up when they feel strongly.
Thank you for your comment!

Omg I found the story, Feb 12, 2011 you wrote Mayhen Room 69 and I replied, its a hot story...posting on ur Wb

I cant post on ur wb since we not friends yet but here it is

Wow! I remember that one. Whew....steamy!

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the longer the kid is breast fed, the stronger his immune system becomes and so they almost never get sick

So very true. I breast fed both my kids for as long as they were willing.

In American or occidental societies breasts are perceived on sex compared to Africa per example, they have no correlation with sex and breasts. They belief is breast are made to feed. Do animals stimulate the female breast to conceive?

Well this one is cut and dried, you have far more authority in this area because of your qualifications and experience.
my wife and I never argue these days , not the stand up shouting kind anyway...but I remember those and laughing afterwards about it ....and the making
One argument ended in her storming upstairs and sitting in the bedroom. After an hour or two I went upstairs and started running a bath. I got undressed and walked into the bedroom to get some clean underwear. She gave me one of those smiles that says..sorry let's make up...and I leaned over to kiss her. Bear in mind I was stark bollock naked at this point. One thing led to another and half an hour later we were cuddling on the bed trying to avoid a rather lath wet patch when I suddenly remembered... The ******* BATH!!!!!
Water had poured over the top of the bath, through the ceiling into the kitchen, the stairs had become a mini niagra falls and the living room carpet was under 2 inches of water.
Funny, I remember everything except what the argument was over.

Oh noes!

Sometimes its not about (THE) speaking up or standing up for being right....but rather the way (body language), your tone of voice and or gestures used to bring across your point. Regardless of being dominant or submissive.

Once again I am in total agreement with you. However, a submissive wife (or husband) who held your knowledge would not have quietly acquiesced. Submissiveness, should not be synonymous with stupidity, whenever the submissive partner has specialist knowledge only an idiot would ignore that. Also if a natural submissive is moved to 'speak up' then this should never be ignored.

I never understood the idea some people have that men should be the head of the household. Everyone has strengths and weaknesses. As couples it's to our benefit to allow each other's strengths to rise to the top. To me it's not about making it exactly 50/50, it's about allowing each other to best utilize their strengths and to help cover their weaknesses. I'm sure somewhere inside your hubby knew he was outmatched and dead wrong. Hopefully he had the wherewithal to apologize.

I do believe the man is the head of the household. Now before anyone freaks out, hear me out. Being head of the home doesn't mean disrespecting, disregarding our spouse. In fact, my belief on a submissive wife is this. Submission is a gift of respect by the wife, submission is GIVEN, not taken. My wife is wonderful, I am the head but she is my queen. I don't make decisions without taking her thoughts/feelings into account. when I do make the decision however, it is made. She doesn't try to over rule that decision. If she disagrees with my decision, she discuss it with me and we converse with each other. I respect my wife and I love her the more for being who she is. I am very respectful to her and would never say or do anything to degrade her. I worship/honor her it is a mutual respect. Now back on topic. Phew! LOL. Mothers have been doing what your husband has done for decades, it has never killed anyone. Why was this the wrong thing to do? I am no medical professional just inquiring. BTW, I think you're awesome ;)

777 it's a rarity that I actually overrule my wife. 99.5% of the time, we make decisions together with me being the chief spokesman for our family, but there are times when we do not agree on something. I listen to her opinion and thoughts, then I weigh them to make the best decision for the family. Thank you for your comment.

Who put the half consumed milk back in the fridge in the first place here ?

My wife always used microwave for bottles. She just swirls the bottle to mix it well. I tried arguing with her on that point, but no listen. Mother knows best.

I am a father and grandfather and I agree with you 100%.

OK, tell me I am wrong here..... but did this go from a Mother (+RN) knows best issue, to an issue of who really wears the pants in the family? Do women really have to get to that level of anger, step on a man's ego in order to protect a child from that bacteria? Is there a way for a woman to let her man have an ego and feel like the man in the family but still communicate when you disagree? If you find it, you'll be much happier with the "Man" that you live with as opposed to the alternative. Just my 2 cents.

You do not have the right idea of a Submissive is in a relationship. Maybe in some cultures, but I know for a fact that when "Mama" Daddy listens when it comes to children. Bravo for coming to the rescue..

I know this is very late in the game to respond but I wanted to make one point. A person is able to be submissive and still protective. Just because some chose to have a dominant and submissive relationship shouldn't mean they leave their brains at the door. Yes I know too many do that kind of thing but when it comes to one person understanding the risks I know many submissive women who may of been sorry later but wouldn't be mad because their child was fed from an old bottle. They would of taken the lumps but prohibited the bottle to be used one way or another. Even if it means dumping the contents at their feet. Submission doesn't mean brainless or without a soul.

I have no medical background, but totally agree that was not safe. I usually advocate the man being the leader in the home, but they are not always correct. You have to speak up. You can't follow when it is an issue of safety.

Thank you for your comment. I mostly agree except I do not advocate the man being the leader simply because he happens to be the man.

There is no excuse when a child's well being is at stake. Tell him you won't stand by and watch him do anything that could put her health at risk, that what moms do, it has nothing at all to do with submissiveness.

Thank you and I agree!

Here's what I think:

Expect to receive no more than you are willing to give.

Let him know that you notice everything he does for you.

Be quick to acknowledge the best in each other and never point out the faults.

Hold hands at the movies.

Lock arms together when taking a stroll. Walk slowly and enjoy a conversation.

When the fall colors are at their brightest, rent a convertible and go for a ride. It’s a good time for a picnic too.

Sing a love song when you are in the shower.

Encourage her to talk about the events of her day before you talk about yours.

Always sit close enough so that you can touch each other if one of you wants to.

There is no such thing as the wrong time to say, ‘I Love You”. Say it with conviction---say it often.

Let him vent freely about what is on his mind whe he needs to relieve the pressure.

When holding hands, squeeze three times to say “I love you”.

Share good news with each other first.

Avoid withholding bad news. Its best to just get it out and get it over with.

Be honest about what you are feeling and be willing to share all of your feelings.

Take care not to minimize each other’s feelings.

Demand nothing from each other, and gratefully accept whatever is given.

Whenever you leave the house, always explain where you are going and when you expect to be back.

Be sure to keep your cell phones on when you are apart from each other.

Call as soon as you realize you will be later than you expected.

Find a reason everyday to call and say, “Hey there. I miss you.” “I love you” wouldn’t hurt, either.

Never mock or make fun of each other.

Try no to be the center of attention. Share the spotlight.

Strive to give more to the relationship than anything else in your life.

When you are needed, drop what you are doing and give your best effort as long as necessary.

When you are setting the thermostat, be considerate of her preferences. Putting on a heavier or lighter shirt isn’t a big deal.

Always do more than what you think is your fair share of the household chores.

Call to say you are on your way home and ask if you can stop pick up anything along the way.

Be as thoughtful to each other at home as you are in public.

When together in the car, be considerate of his preferences. Listening to sports or talk radio once in a while really can be quite entertaining.

Always call when you said you would, especially when you are traveling.

Wait to start eating until both of you have been served.

Don’t bring the newspaper to the table unless both of you are going to read it.

Flirt with each other in public.

Learn each other’s body language.

Lie on the lawn together at midnight and watch the stars overhead.

On the anniversary of your first date, take turns reading your old love letters to each other.

Never stop writing love letters to each other. Save each and everyone.

Keep a scrapbook of the places the two of you have been together. Use it as a memory jogger when you’re in the mood to reminisce.

Send a surprise “I miss you” text message now and then.

Read romantic poetry together, especially when times get rough.

Write love notes on Post-its and leave them on the bath mirror.

Only play the games that each of you has a fair chance of winning.

Remember to be playful. Having fun together is a great way to strengthen your relationship.

Turn off the television some nights and just talk, talk, talk. You’ll be surprised how much you enjoy it.

Show gratitude for everything she does for you.

Understand where both of you are weak and try to be strong there for each other.

Be sure to tell each other the things that make you happy in the relationship.

Compliment each other’s appearance. Do it often.

Never give a self-improvement book, but if you receive one, read it.

It is never too early to say “I’m sorry”. Say it as soon as possible.

Before you get analytical, let her express her anger the way she wants to. She’ll appreciate it later.

When you are wrong, admit it ---and mean it.

When you get an emotional response that surprise you, ask why.

Before you get angry, let him explain. There usually is a reason for everything.

If you are feeling defensive, realize that acting on it is probably not the best course of action.

Read to each other at bed time.

Let a goodnight kiss be the last event of every day.

If one of you can’t sleep, don’t disturb the other.

If both of you cannot sleep, sit up and watch your old home movies.

Take a long walks together on the beach.

Go for a ride together on a bicycle built for two.

Have a picnic in a rowboat.

Share secrets with each other that no on else knows about.

Always keep your mate’s confidence private---it is a matter of character and fidelity.

Always speak to each other with respect. Never shout at each other.

Whatever the problems may be, work for harmony, not just peaceful coexistence.

Be transparent in the way you live. Never do anything you wouldn’t want the other to know about.

Make a commitment never to correct each other in front of others or argue in public.

Give other couples watching reason to say, “I wish we were like that.”

Go on a picnic together on the first warm weekend of spring.

Play footsie under the table.

Reach across the table and hold hands while toasting each other.

Order one really decadent dessert to share and feed it to each other.

Bring him lemonade while he is cutting the grass.

Keep a calendar of special moments in earlier years, and celebrate those moments each time that date comes around again.

Wash the car together.

Buy matching coffee cups the next time you go shopping.

Help her fold the laundry.

Play each other’s favorite CDs when you go for a ride.

When you’re on a long trip, take turns driving and sleeping.

Go out dancing on a Saturday night. If you can’t dance, learn.

On a snowy evening, go outside together and catch snowflakes on your tongues.

Never pass up a ride through the Tunnel of Love.

When you are walking together in the rain, hold most of the umbrellas over her.

When you’re in a setting where you should be quiet, mouth the words I love you.

Learn how to say “I love you” in a sign language.

When he is stressed out, massage his head and neck.

Compromise quickly, never as a last resort.

Emphasize the things about each other that make you happy rather than those that might not be as endearing.

When the bathroom door is shut, don’t try to enter---if she shuts the door, you should, too.

Just ignore each other’s weird noises.

Understand that she will use more than half of the closet space and bathroom counter. Just accept it and move on.

If he likes to sleep later on Saturday’s snuggle up and learn to like it, too.

Understand that he will collect lots of tools and obsess about the grass. Just accept it and move on.

When spending the day together, leave the watches at home.

The best-laid plans can be a bore. Leave a little room for something unexpected.

Always cherish the moments you share. You never know how many more you will have.

From "Play Footsie Under the Table: And 499 More Ways to Make Love Last"
By Gregory E. Lang

I can't help but notice the roaring silence this post has received. I'm pretty sure, though, that had I said something even remotely anti-feminist or pro-masculanist all the harpies here on EP would mob me and rip me to shreds.

I guess it's true after all, "Haters just wanna hate!"

Seeee? What did I tell you, lol :)

I think this is good advice max.


**GASP!!!** An actual compliment? jk jk jk kjk he heheeh ee hhe h

:) :) :)

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More importantly, if you make it a habit to violently explode with your husband over perceived slights or disagreements your children will suffer most for it. As a health care professional, I'm sure I don't need to highlight all of the research demonstrating how regular fighting, yelling and screaming in an emotionally violent household is absolutely detrimental to children.

If you truly love your children make having a peaceful, tranquil home your number one priority.

wow max you stalking all my friends.what up with dat!

Max - I agree completely with all your insights about household discord. However, I do not agree with the following implications:

Firstly, threatening somebody with divorce will not go very far towards maintaining domestic peace. It shows that what you really want is fearful acquiescence, not understanding. Moreover, I'm sure Jane will agree with me that divorce, though unpleasant, is still better than enduring an egoistic partner. And thankfully, nowadays, women don't have to come off much worse after a well-needed divorce.

Secondly, Jane was not trying to "always getting her way", and she wasn't reacting over a "perceived slights or disagreements". She was arguing for her children about a very real mistake on her husband's part.

Don't you think that Jane's husband should also take care not to instigate fights, knowing how detrimental it can be for the children? Do you believe that the burden of compromise and of maintaining household peace lies more on women than on men?


The continued success of a marriage is only possible when both the husband and the wife fulfill the responsibilities they have towards one another. When either one fails to do their job the marriage is poisoned. If the poisoning persists, the marriage will eventually die, hence, why divorce is so prevalent.


I was just shocked you had any friends and was simply verifying that the profiles in your circle weren't fakes, lol :)


You misunderstand, I'm not justifying Jane's husband's actions. I'm simply pointing out that if Jane angrily explodes every time a disagreement takes place she's going to single handedly wreck her marriage. She's also going to ruin their kids' lives for very few things are worst for a child than an emotionally violent environment.

Bottom line, she could of handled the situation with more humility and kindness, instead of arrogance and rage, which should be at the very heart of the love she supposedly professes for him - unless of course this is one of those wacky BDSM marriages, in which case, she can disregard everything I've shared :)


Oh stop it! :) It's just playful banter. Kinda like what you and I have, lol :)

i get under most peoples skin..... i dont take it personal, but they think i do ......... that is the fun part....

max you could of made it easy on ur self.... to find out more about me... just ask me .......... excuses excuses ....glad you find me interesting.

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A house divided cannot stand.

Even if you're right if you treat him like the enemy whenever he goofs he will resent you for it. Keep it up and, sooner or later, he'll be serving you with divorce papers.

Just helping her appreciate the very real cost she'll have to pay if always getting her way trumps the need for a peaceable, tranquil home for their children.

777 hell yeA, HE jumped ... he must not of had any long term relationships.....or any serious relationships, there are always up/downs to living with a loved one...

max ann .......... ok i took the bait ur full of ****

max u did not read the story she was protecting her child dum ***


Typical first time parent jitters. She overreacted. Her baby was not in any mortal danger whatsoever.

He goofed, that's all. Besides, I seriously doubt she would very much enjoy being dehumanized every time she goofed.

I'm curious, would you provide the same advice to husbands or is it only women who must concede?


As I posted earlier, the continued success of a marriage is only possible when both the husband and the wife fulfill the responsibilities they have towards one another. When either one fails to do their job the marriage is poisoned. If the poisoning persists, the marriage will eventually die, hence, why divorce is so prevalent.


So much for not taking things personally, smh, lol :)

maxx i see ur are reading what i say ... hmmmm yes when people like ur self pick on jane, i take it personal.... but towards me..... i dont care what you or others think. i know my self well enough to know who i am.......and im happy with that


So, how long, exactly, have you been Jane's attorney? smh, lol :)

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given your education and experience, it's clear that you are correct and i would think that your hubby would know that. not being right all the time doesn't make a man less of a man but that seems hard for some of them to accept.

I am a nursing mom to and I so agree with you. If we need a bottle and I try using stored breast milk first but if I have to use formula we mix it fresh every time. My stored breast milk is also fresh and not just but back to reuse. I too some times, well most times, speak whats on my mind and my husband does understand that I am not submissive. I do think that's why he stays with me. Good luck and I do hope your husband gets the point. My husband sometimes says a good 2x4 along side the head helps change the attitude. I don't think violence is the key but understand the thought

I am really sorry to hear this… I wish your husband will understand the value of a strong partner like you… It’s a pity that most Men do not recognize their wives fully.

Have you explained to him why it is important to not do the things you argued about it ?

If the formula was placed in the refrigerator the night before and it should not be reused, why was it not thrown away and the bottle washed ?

You were right to take up for your child, but the way to eliminate the argument is to eliminate the reasons behind it. You should have thrown away the formula during the day and explained why.

Jane, I really believe that you should thank the anti-feminist men and women who have replied (retorted?) to your article... It only proves what we have been trying to say all along to all those individuals who still seem to think that the Men's Rights Movement has anything to do with *promoting equality between the sexes* and *supporting the rights of children* (Ha!).

You are so right (as usual).

It is clear that the de-facto female supremacist are coiled to make slanderous implications against the milktoast weaklings of the "mens rights movement" for daring to even want a fair shake. The truth be told, those guys are much more on the side of feminists than real men like myself. Not to mention that I would never wanted to be counted amongst the "mens rights movement". I do not plead for equality, I firmly grasp and embody and exercise masculine supremacy. By knocking "mens rights advocates" you show your true colors and also alienate the only males that stand for TRUE equality. Its ok, were it not for mistakes feminism would be inconsistent at everything.

777Heaven - Don't bother replying to Him... Actually I never thought we'd agree on anything, but it seems KMK and I do agree about the MRAs being 'milktoast weaklings'! I couldn't have put it better myself!

Real men don't play by your rules 7.

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Thanks for sharing .. Thoughts of wisdom reflected here . We should fight for the right purpose .if ur heart says u r right then never look back . I appreciate and respect u . Nice meeting u ...

Aww thank you Sandy! It's very nice meeting you too. :)

Whats funnier that Dozer and Kayl agree ... or that they are big tough know it alls that resort to using the "block" button as their mainline of defense???

Hello Jane....I hope your daughter is doing well and the mother that you will never stop diffending your child... :)

If God gave you milk within you to feed your baby then no one on earth should try to stop you...the mothers's milk is beyond being just " food " most men don't know what women go through while pregnant..those nine months and all the pain...your Man should simply let you feed the child to whom you gave birth...and for you being the mother of his child he should be kissing your feet every day...the mother stands on top of everything and comes before any one. If that baby could truly speak amd had a choice about what to is obvious that she would choose her mothers's breast without hesitation.

Thank you very much!

I completely understand your reaction. I know a lot of people have a very 'relaxed' attitude to feeding their babies. For me, it was by the book. You were absolutely right to be cross with him. Oh i suppose some would see me as a control freak over my babies. But i dont care, because my only thought was to protect them. Now its loads easier, they are independent and sensible. Bless 'em. The only thing - was because (mainly in the night) my husband was incapable of making sensible decisions (eg not leaving them on the top of changing tables where they could roll off), I ended up doing the lions share of the work. Because i couldnt /didnt trust him. I do resent that a bit now. I dont know how i could have done it differently though.

Does't sound to me that there should have been a fight what you told him about the formula was right i mean your a nurse and what you said taught me a thing or two also so he should be grateful you showed him right from wrong on this!!

Sounds almost like a 'castrating' offense....

Here is the truth you don't want to hear.

1. So much of what they teach in nursing school is anti-truth but you think you are a 'health care specialist' and are a generally self righteous egomaniac to boot.
2. Babies need germs to become strong (hence eating boogers-you dont have to believe the Wolfman/Kayvman, there are studies).
3. Microwaves are bad in general (equally bad as soy based formula) but those hotspots go away with one little shake to mix them with the cooler liquid ALSO I doubt he put it in the microwave long enough to make it that hot anyway.
4. You entirely negate his own experience and know how as a father, I bet he has fed her like that hundreds of times and you never knew it, but the child is fine, even without your henpecking.
5. If the child is his, he has as much right to say what goes as you do (actually even more).
6. You are a picky know-it-all ninny that will drive even the most "liberated" husband up the wall until he cant handle it anymore and he either A. leaves B. cheats C. dominates you D. takes up a vice E. has a disabling coronary event or F. commits suicide/homicide
7. Your husband does dominate you, he may say you are his "equal" and you surely give him gray hairs with your behavior but he still does what he wants when he wants to and only by bringing in other MEN can you ever stop him.
8. I would bet good money that one day you will wake up and regret your own bullshit for all these years, you will have to become more self aware for that though.

As a misogynist who has admitted to hitting women, your opinion means nothing to me.

Au contraire, the fact that you have been following my posts around for about a year now tells me otherwise. As for hitting women, it occurs to me you are more sexist than I am, wanting special treatment, encouraging unfair doublestandards, singlehandedly trying to prove female inferiority, but I digress. If you really don't care what I think then don't comment on my stuff anymore. As for me, unless I see you pop up in my notifications I will likely forget you exist. However if you continue to follow me about like my number one groupie I may continue to take an interest in the topics you raise as well but I would personally be happier to let this be sayanara. You should just consider me and my kind to be a different species altogether and stick to worrying about trying to parch the last vestiges of humanity out of the new artificial species you belong to and leave us 'cavemen/women' to our time tested eternal ways. And btw, being "equal" is a whole lot of programmed 'nurture' painted over nature, keep pushing that husband of yours and you will see nature rear its majestic head. Goodbye.

KayvemanKayl I have never met you here on EP before, but isn't this a bit harsh? On the other side I do have to admit you have a way with words... But please let's respect each other, and everybody is entitled to their own opinion and their own way of life.

Thank you IQplusfun!

IQplusfun, while I do not agree with your opinion concerning 'rights' I do appreciate your concern. I actually originally came here with a fairly polite attitude, but my beliefs are very unpopular with some people and when they took the gloves off I did likewise. Gumshoe is one of a few people who zealously oppose my views here on EP, they tend to follow my posts fairly consistently and have been dogging me around EP for a long time. Honestly I would be happier to never encounter gumshoe or any of the others like her again (except maybe in Heaven - sincerely hoping they and I do somehow make it there) but since they insist on weighing in on much of what I say and also since gumshoe insists that she is my 'equal' I am inclined to respond to her with the level of blatant candor she generally entreats me with. She claims to be a 'big girl', she rolls up her sleeves and tells me not only what she thinks but often insults me as well, if she cant or doesn't want to handle dealing with me, she can simply ignore my posts and commentary and I would be very likely to do likewise with hers. These are adult issues being placed in a public forum for the commentary of others and I really see no harm in discussing them with an adult level of honesty, but (I know you can read this too gum) I am ready to either hear an admission from my detractors that my statements have been correct or to be finished corresponding with them perhaps entirely, but that is a tango I am not willing to dance alone. If the little dumplings desire the absence of my opinion in their posts they must be willing to bless me with the absence of their own in mine. Take care IQ.

Yes wantingspankings, I agree with you, except on these details. Firstly, while I know many people dont really clean their microwaves as they should, there is nothing specifically unhygenic about microwaves, germs are killed off in mass by their radiation. Secondly as for uneven heating spots, I do know that occurs and so do most adults, including I would wager gums husband. I would be willing to bet that he has getting it to the right temperature down to a science and probably gives it a good shake to mix in any uneven spots and then tests it himself before giving it to the daughter that I am fairly confident that he loves and cherishes every bit as his wife does. I would also wager that as I said, he has probably done that hundreds of times and he apparently has the wherewithal to prevent any harm from coming to his child from excessive heat. But as you said, right or wrong, you dont address your husband in such a way, you behave with respect, not only because you are your husbands wife (though that is plenty of reason enough) but because that is how polite mature people do. She has the classic American 'womens studies major' (I dont know if she is - but she acts like it) attitude that women are the most important and most knowledgeable parent, wrong, women are just the most available and as you said, directly nurturing parent (fathers indirectly make any and all nurturing possible by protecting and providing). Anyway, I like your attitude and I appreciate your practicality and I am sure you and your whole family is much happier for it. Our species, like most mammalian species (though I know us to be more than animals) is naturally patriarchal, so much so that even people who deny masculine superiority still manifest its actuality whether they realize or approve of it or not. Just as with Eve in the garden, the enemies of humanity attempts to isolate and subvert the weakest link in the chain, to get them to act contrary to nature and correctness and thereby cause instability and 'soften' their target. When women choose not to be susceptible to unnatural delusions, merely by safeguarding themselves against foolishness they do a very great deal to secure the society they live in and even though that is every womans duty to do this, it is getting so rare I want to just salute every woman that I see doing it. I salute you wantingspankings for being conducive to a healthy, strong, harmonious, natural and orderly family. Couples must always face challenges but they should stand unified against them, not be the 'cause' of them.


First of all please do NOT apologize to the kaveman on my behalf. He deserves no such gesture, in fact he is the one who should be apologizing as he is rude and nasty. He is a horrendous misogynist who likes to hide behind religion.

I do have to say that just because YOU may be happy in your relationship, doesn't mean that I or other women ( or men) would also be happy and fulfilled in such a relationship. We are all different. I had to laugh when you asserted that I wouldn't last 5 seconds with your husband... honey your husband wouldn't last 5 seconds with me, in fact he would have lost me at "hello" as I am not interested nor attracted to men like your husband. Trust me.
When have I ever called women like you "morons"??????? I don't call women names. I don't feel sorry for you either as you "want spankings" and clearly your marital dynamic turns you on.
Eric doesn't stand up for women, he degrades, bullies and threatens harm to them ( said i was the kind of woman he would hit).He is a polygamist who twists the word to suit himself.
If you are looking for support for your marital style I suggest you befriend some of the other wonderful submissive women on this site, there are many on here who are intelligent, caring and RATIONAL. You will not find these traits in eric the kaveman.

Eric the kaveman:
Do NOT came back to this story to spout your nonsense and misogyny. I have had enough of you and your mouth.

wantingspankings thanks to all of your family for being one more bright example of sanity and happiness in this crazy world. But always be so careful, the loonies are out to get people like us through any means necessary and they are striving to outlaw us and the natural way of life and to a great extent they already have - and mark my words, that is where the willing cooperation of the woman makes a very huge difference: the enemies have inverted society, giving the influence to the weakest and suppressing the strongest, all it takes is one temper tantrum or one act of defiance or one display in public to have a man arrested by the brainwashed cows and then fined and forced to go to expensive classes and get court imposed restraining orders and for the woman to be blackmailed into going to psychobabble anti-male classes and maybe even prescribed brain rotting drugs, meanwhile the kids go off to the child services to stay with potentially ********* foster 'parents'. A woman that is in harmonious agreement with her Husband and accepts his direction and especially his benevolent discipline without fuss or betrayal shows true loyalty and also spares her whole family and even her whole community a lot of sheer tragedy and stops the enemies from having another excuse for further intrusions into yet more families lives. Once again, I salute both of you, he for being a real man and you for being a real woman who truly appreciates that real man. As for gumshoe, she has been after me since I got here over a year ago, actually her words to me in this post are some of the least insulting she has ever posted. Be well and be with GOD.

What do you hope to accomplish gumshoe, giving me orders? Do you think I will follow them? You sure never stopped harassing me when I wanted you to, but I am not here to harass you, I am just standing up for the truth in this public forum. I will stop when and if I feel inclined to do so or you find a way to block me from your posts, which, if there is a way to do such a thing, I will be very glad to know it and will quickly do likewise to you and your cohorts in my own posts.

why, in your opinion, does a father have more right to say what goes concerning the child than the mother? this should be good lol

a man like that wouldn't know what to do with a woman like you, jane, nor would he even be worthy.

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You are right, stand your ground.

jane>>>>> That is actually reassuring to know. I should stop with my DD bashing i guess as I really don't know much about the dynamic and it just seems to go to the worst possible place in my head for me

gypsy >>>. Jane maybe don't give up the Domestic Discipline, why? from my experience, there are many Doms who want the title- not the reasonability... in other words they are > fake !

You don't have to become a submissive wife to change things. In this incident, I would have walked up to my husband, given him a kiss and thanked him for his well meant support or told him that his idea of the bottle of formula is exactly what's needed, then taken the bottle from his hand and poured it down the drain before making a new one. I am sure, he would have felt good, as he got praise, and if he inquired, why you empty the bottle, he probably would have accepted your explanation calmly.
I suspect however, that you might have been stressed, as the baby wasn't calming down with breastfeeding alone and that you reacted in an angry voice, when your husband took the bottle from the fridge and placed it in the microwave. So he felt attacked instead of respected and the situation escalated from there.
I am not saying, that you are at fault, just explaining, how so many situations turn nasty because of the lack of 'diplomacy'. This is why I don't want to describe myself as submissive, it's not that we women should shut up all the time (especially like in this case, when the health of your baby is at risk), but we should learn to treat our husbands with decency and respect and this involves diplomatic and inventive behavior. After all, your husband meant well and supported you in the first place, didn't he?

Oh I feel like we are so alike! But wait. When ever you say something like this, you're automatically the feminist b*tch who has total disregard for male life. I love this site, but the people here just drive you INSANE! Anyway I'm happy that you protected you're child :) Their so fragile when there young! I bet she's adorable :)

I know! There seems to be a lot of misogyny on this site and what's most disturbing is that many of them are female! It shocks, saddens and appals me to see so many women sticking up for men whom clearly hate females.
Thank you for your comment and keep speaking your mind!

i thought it was a partnership your daughters well being comes first. He wouldnt eat dinner that was left on the table all day. You do whats best for your daughter hopefully he will learn. I remember feeding my daughters baby food, and when half a jar was left my wife would put it back in the fridge. When i would take it out later it would be mushy and watery, like you say bacteria had started to grow so i would just throw the jar out and feed her from a new jar or put it in a bowl first so not to contaminate the jar.. my daughters were weaned by about a year. and i only made enough formula up as my daughter would drink at a feeding. You are your daughters protector you go girl!!! let him get up if your daughter gets sick and say i told you do but he probably wont.. i did everything for my girls after all i want the best for them... they are now 18 and 15 and still walk with dad in the mall and go off on their own..

You sound like an awesome and very caring father. Thank you so much for your very kind and supportive comment. I appreciate you.

no problem, you sound like a mother who knows best and wants the best for her daughter, dont compromise... i remember taking my daughters to ballet, highland dancing alone, i was the only father waiting for his girls. i took them alone to class trips, dr app, to the zoo, museums, parks, i was there for their first steps, first word (first word was dad) i cant remember ever not having my daughters with me. you are a good mother never doubt or second guess yourself. sounds like your husband needs to grow up, my father would say stand up like a man, put away childish things you have a family and they come first. treat your wife well because when the kids are gone its just the 2 of you again..

Hey Jane! I’m glad you stand up for your children – you owe it to them. Kudos to you, you seem like a great mom! I was reading some of the other responses to your article –

1. Some people say that as your husband’s intentions were honorable and he was only trying to help, you shouldn’t make a fuss.

Well, personally, I couldn’t disagree more. You aren’t complaining that hubby was trying to poison your baby, are you? You just wish that he was a bit more careful. (After all, being stuck at the bedside of a sick, howling baby is going to be way more unpleasant, for both of you, than taking a few easy preventive measures.) In other words, you are not complaining about his intentions – only about the discrepancy between his intentions and his actions. If our good intentions were the only things that mattered, the world would be a very different place – even the most hardened criminal only wants a better life for himself – very rarely do people act out of purely evil motives. For example, even the terrorists who currently occupy so much of our mental space only want to propagate what in their opinion is a superior belief-system and eradicate what they honestly believe to be evil. Would we be equally forgiving of their actions? There is a saying – ‘The road to hell is paved with good intentions.’

2. According to another comment, children in underdeveloped countries are perfectly happy to have anything at all to eat, so why should ours complain? After all, generations have thrived without medical care like ours.

That is true, but what is their quality of life? Under-Five Mortality Rate? Adult Life Expectancy? Jane, this argument is nothing but an excuse for laziness – don’t let it affect you. I’m sure neither you, nor your hubby would not like to go without the computer/TV, air-conditioning, adequate food or warm baths. When daddy isn’t living in the Stone Age, why should baby?

3. Some others say that the issue is minor and well, you shouldn’t make a fuss over such a simple thing. One incident is not going to kill your baby, right?

Wrong. One incident of carelessness, left unchecked, is enough to kill anybody (as I am sure, people involved in the field of medicine are taught extremely rigorously). What may be a small germ for a healthy adult, may be the difference between life and death for a baby. And if you, the baby’s mother, does not stand up for her baby, who will? The neighbor?

4. Someone said that had it been them, they would not have kept the bottle in the fridge in the first place – they would have discarded it right away, i.e. they would have the whole routine planned out. And maybe you should have taken over preparing the bottle.

Well, but this doesn’t answer your question. If only everyone had enough foresight, there would be no problems in the world – no bad marriages, no messy divorces, no spoilt children, no unhappy adults, no corruption, no wars, and so on. But what if you did not have the foresight to discard the bottle right away? Does it mean that the stale formula should be fed to your baby? And life is not a routine that can be planned out – there is always something, somewhere that crops up unexpectedly. Today is was the bottle, tomorrow it might be something bigger.
And as for taking over preparation of the bottle, by extension, you should be taking over everything – feeding, dressing, diaper-changes, entertainment, etc. – at the slightest hint of discomfort from hubby… which leads us comfortably back into the Medieval Ages, when men fought wars while women stayed at home and cooked.

5. Someone said that both you and your husband are far from perfect.

True. But our aim is not to let those imperfections thrive unchecked.

Also, I think that this has everything to do with your Dom/Sub issue.

Moreover, you, and only you are the correct person to decide how to react to a situation that confronts you – not a pageful of comments from people you don’t know. So Jane, don’t let the negativity of some of the comments affect you - its your life, your choice, and the results of your actions will have to be faced by you alone.

Phew! This was a long comment... hope you don't fall asleep reading it!


Awww Cameron thank you so much! You are a very intelligent and your comment here is very well thought out and right on the money. I thank you for your kindness and support. I appreciate you, my friend.

You're welcome :)
Keep in touch!

I am going to look at this in a different light. Disregarding the S / D part of it. I think that does not have any bearing on the core of your post. As a RN who works in a hospital ones ideas are more "white" (How it should be.) As a former First Responder/ Firefighter. My time was spent not in the "white" but in a "Gray" enviroment. You see the worst of the worst at times. And you work thru it.

I fully understand the view point of not reheating a used bottle and NOT using a microwave oven to do it. But after seeing what I have seen in 30 some years in the field. That would have been one of my least worries of using a 24 hour old bottle.

I have seen children eating food out of bowls days old at room temp. Just happy to have something to eat. Dirt and filth ? Very. But it did not kill them.
Okay so he became stubbern and gave your ( both of yours) child a bottle that was 24 hrs old. But it was clean, It was not bug infested. And it was not kept at room temp.

Be upset. But pick your battles. I am sure he would never do anything to harm his own daughter or son. Explain why you were upset. But don't push the issue into another fight. Don't let it eat away at you. It is minor and not worth the extra harm that it will do for the two of you.

He cares. Other wise he would not be there to feed and help. He made a mistake. But sometimes it is hard to admit that you have.

I am going to offer a simple thought on this...I am going to disregard the D/s side because I believe it has nothing to do with this subject at all. ( and should never have a place in this arena of life in my humble opinion)

I being a mother and preschool teacher know all about the things you speak of when expressing that formula should not be heated in a microwave....I as well know the rules on putting formula in the refrigerator. The bootle should not have been used was an entire day you said it was from the day before. Formula CAN be put into the fridge but should be used within an hour of previous use. IF the formula is made and not used it can last for up to 24 hours after being refrigerated ( if not used )

You speak of the bacteria and dangers of this.....while these are valid concerns and valid consequences of such actions like heating it in the microwave or using it after the time period reccomended ....I do not think one incident is going to harm your baby to the point of severe sickness or death.....

your only human you say...and humans make have educated him on these things but that does not mean he won't make a mistake or a not so great decision..why did you ned to get SO angry about it....I think he was proving a point to you that you are not god either. You are FAR from is he. He gave that bottle to the baby because you were over reacting to the situation. Instead of reaming him a new A**hole do you not think it would have worked out better in your favor to simply say

" oh remember we cannot use that bottle it is too old and you should never heat it in the microwave...can you do me a favor and make a fresh bottle of formula , I would feel much better with a fresh bottle"

When a man is faced with a woman who is angry and tearing him down for his bad decision he is going to lash back at you and this is what your husband did...he did not appreciate you tearing him apart over something he did not need to be torn apart essentially treated him as though he were an idiot...and men do not take well to that...neither do women for that matter....

maybe your approach was off base...and being a submissive wife or not a submissive wife has nothing to do with this at all....

Just my respectful thoughts on this ....

I love your answer. And may I say, my 4 year old son eats dirt.

But I don't let him. It just happens.

LOL.... I am sure I have eaten some dirt in my life...unbeknownst to my mom....haha

Perfect Minxy... I was looking at this after the fact. But you are right. :)

I love your response on this one. D/s was never a part of this particular argument, and it seemed like quite the stretch to try to make it apply.

Minx, you rock! I want to save this bottle stuff for reference, I did not know this stuff! (Ahem, sorry kids I used to babysit! ;-P)

Feisty, I humbly agree.

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Why is there such an overwhelming need to label everything? Not just Jane, who has acknowledged that this isn't really about submission at all, but everyone. If D/s is about being submissive when you choose to be submissive then it isn't about anything at all. What JennaR describes, and what most other self-described submissives distance themselves from, is about something real. Frankly, it scares me but it's a big world and it takes all sorts.

here here!!!! Bravo sir!

Thank you Garcia, you always offer a thoughtful and supportive comment. I appreciate you. :)

pen u changed ur name

You certainly are unnaturally fixated on dominance & submission Jane... Otherwise you were of course completely in the right, & anyone in your position would have blown their top at such blatent disregard.

Thank you Sonnet, I do appreciate your support.

While I am a submissive wife. I would have respectfully explained why that would be wrong. I also had to educate my spouse on how to warm and use bottles. I am not stupid. I also would have already found that bottle and have discarded it. I raised a house full of children. One of whom did take bottles as she did not bond with me as a nursing partner.

Submission does not mean being a door mat, being unable to stand for my children, not able to do the right thing. My husband is willing to listen to me when I do speak up. I am not saying it is because I don't argue with him. However, the fact that I choose not to argue, and only would speak up when it is important likely makes a difference.

There is no reason to put down the submissive woman in this situation. I am not saying you were wrong in how you handled it. Just that like you we submissive ladies are intelligent and do know when we need to speak up.

While I appreciate where you're coming from, I would argue that submissive does not equal 'ignorant' or 'thoughtless.' True submission does not come from a place of subservience, nor does it involve silencing common sense. And, women are not always submissive. Sometimes, it is the man in the relationship who submits and even then, it is a position of choice, not one of degradation or demeaning humility.

Being dominant does not equal 'more intelligent' either. A man who would argue with your logic is not being dominant, he's being embarrassed and annoyed at the situation. As a woman who has provided prenatal, labor, postpartum and breastfeeding support for more than two decades, I can very much appreciate that your knowledge base is to be respected and on this matter, your spouse should always cede to your authority. After all, we can not be experts at everything, can we? Perhaps in your marriage, there are things at which your husband excels, where you do not. In those instances, he is not dominating you, nor are you submitting to him -- it's a simple matter of both of you respecting each others gifts and strong-suits and learning to partner in the responsibilities you share. Having an open discussion about the fact that you clearly are more knowledgeable on this topic than he, and therefore, should lead the way, is really important.

Submission is not about silence. Submission is not about being silenced. Such ideas about the 'good little wife' are really destructive to the dynamic between two people. Why does one person have to assume a lesser role? They should not. I WILL speak for all groups of people -- the needs of the child come before the needs of the parents. Before any submission, or assertion, your child comes first and you were trying to do just that. This particular argument is not about yielding to some superiority or learning your place or any of that ridiculous garbage. It's about a moment of laziness where someone tried to cut a corner for simplicity's sake and got caught and was expected to correct himself. How you and your husband choose to express yourselves sexually isn't relevant. That's my humble opinion.

She said everything and I agress with her humble opinion.

I love you Trust. I just do. Agree with every word. Some people are very confused about submission in general.

Thank you Trust, I understand and respect your comment. Thank you for providing me some perspective and clarity regarding sub/ dom relationships. I am sincerely sorry if I insulted anyone with my story. I was still very angry when I penned it.
You are right, I shouldn't have brought "submission" into the story, and I admit that I know precious little about the D/s dynamic. Please accept my humble apology.

No need to apologize at all. It's easy to see a link there because of the vast amount of misinformation. Media loves to misrepresent the BDSM world. I usually post my thoughts without reading any other comments. I'm sorry you ended up with a vat of similar responses. There are many who value the subtlety of the D/s and of the BDSM worlds. I hope you aren't feeling like a bunch of us shoved unwanted information down your throat! As it turns out, I'm not a submissive. I appreciated your incredulousness that anyone would argue with sound logic. I never used the micro for stuff for any of the kids because I was more than concerned about hot spots--I felt funky about irradiating their food! An electrical engineer had to explain how microwaves worked before I felt like I could heat up the veggies that way.

Aww... Rubies, I love you too. You're a dear friend!

i did not see this post before making my own comment but i think you made great points trust...

Thank you. Nice avatar.

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Jane: subs don't turn their brains off. Subs expect the doms to make decisions and direct. But, in the end, it's about trust and respect.

Any couple where the needs, opinions and knowledge of one are ignored and disrepected by the other is a couple experiencing a level of dysfunction.

I understand the anger you felt. But, you should never use that as an excuse to compare your behavior to someone else's that you don't fully understand.

For anyone that takes offense to this, they need to get over themselves, because it clearly wasn't meant to be inflammatory. But, when you come to EP to vent, ask yourself: what am I really venting about?

FWIW, you were completely correct. Bottles should NEVER be heated in a microwave and unused formula should be discarded... at least if it won't be used within an hour...

+ 1 to all of this Penn!

Thank you Penn.


Hiya Jane,Sorry to hear about your fight... that is hard and I can understand your extreme frustration. I also understand it as you are a nurse and know your stuff so it's especially annoying when someone doesn't listen to you in this regard.<br />
<br />
I can't speak for the Taken in Hand dynamic which has been given, (which is going to differ from a D/s one in a lot of areas) but I can tell you that as a D/s submissive, I would have been pretty pissed off too. I've never had a problem communicating with a Dom in this regard; in fact due to the unique bond, I have found that Doms listen MORE than men in traditional vanilla relationships.<br />
<br />
Trust me, I would have spoken up too. I speak up a lot and unless I am really out of line, it is never a problem. A strong Dom doesn't want a weak sub; you may have heard the term "Submissive doesn't mean doormat" and it's true. Remember.... lots of people claim the "submissive" title who are not actually submissive, so take what you read sometimes on EP with a grain of salt.<br />
<br />
This argument did not have anything to do with being submissive or not; more so that your husband didn't listen to you in an area that you hold expertise in. I'm sorry about that; I understand where you are coming from and I hope you can reiterate the dangers to him again and that he realizes you were just being cautious. (And correct, ahem.)

as always... spot on.

Awww.. thank you my friend! *kisses cheek*

I respect your comment and agree.

Thank you Trust. Likewise!

Thank you Ruby! As always you provide an intelligent and thoughtful perspective which is very much appreciated.
I can tell that you are a very strong woman who holds her own and yes I can see that there is a distinct difference between D/s and taken in hand relationships. I am still learning and admit to being rather clueless when it comes to any relationship other than vanilla though. lol

Awww thank you! That's kind of you. You are very welcome Jane. I know you have been trying to understand the dynamic and I agree that it is tricky if you are not a Dominant or submissive. ;-)

Rubies, you sound like such an expert on every word that comes out of your mouth. I am new to this site, but not new to BDSM. You are right, a strong DOM does not want a weak sub, but a miss know it all, pain in the *** is worse than a weak woman. Get a reality check and stop trying impress people. You are also right about about listening to people on here with a grain of salt, I hope people reading your comments realize this.

Awww Redneck, thank you for the compliments.. Oh I am FAAARRR from any expert on anything, you give me too much credit :-D. I understand the need for caution/safety in various areas, however, and the depth and connection that D/s can provide. I think a lot of people miss out on this aspect by rushing to "play" rather than working on the foundation. It's really important to be careful. Welcome to EP :-)

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First of all, great self expression Jane.

I would like to clarify the submissive wife notion from MY point of view.

In my opinion, there are many iterations of being submissive or dominant. It can be a woman dominating her mate too. I think it is just more common for the woman to be more submissive than men. My lesbian sister has a life partner of many years and there is a dom/sub dynamic between them.

Now, the way this occurs to me is that your Husband ****** up and you got all bent out of shape. Rather than quietly and lovingly point out that refrigeration and microwaving already used baby bottles is not a good idea, you jumped to the conclusion that He somehow did that deliberately (maybe He did? - passive aggressive behavior?). He probably needed a reminder since you are an RN in the maternity ward - good god, how could he not know?

One thing that I learned is that there is no right or wrong, good or bad, stupid or smart, should or shouldn't. It is how it occurs to you. It what works and what does not work.

Try to build Him up rather than tear Him down. I promise, your life would be free from your anger and frustration - really. It is a form of submission, makes Him feel loved; educated by a smart woman like you. It will give Him a sense of pride and love to know and be with you. He will remember next time. He will treat you differently. I promise.

And I am sure He would fight a thousand fights to protect his children and wife too.

Awww, thanks Wes. I will consider your wise words and take them to heart. Thank you for your comment.

At first you amused me, then you annoyed me. But now I am grateful I have you in my circle and can communicate with you. I challenge you to discuss this submissive/dominant issue with me more. I also challenge you to check you anger at the door and work on observing (all this stuff) from above, so to speak, and react appropriately after you have seen it from outside of yourself.

Ok here goes this story got me a little agrivated as it seemed as though it was written only to make those who are submisive to be stupid scared people who are incapable of standing up for theirselves or their children wait ! I mean no disrespect to the author so please hold the gunfire. I am submissive I am smart I am respectful to and respected by my man which means He listens to me and takes my opinions seriously before making decisions whether they effect out family or not. In this case my qualities would out do His so He would of listened to my input and adhered accordingly. There would have been no need for shouting or arguing of any kind.

I am sorry but I truly did not intend any insult. I wrote this when I was still very angry. Thank you for your comment.

I am also considered a submissive wife. However I too am a well educated, experienced woman with similar educational degrees to the ones you mentioned. I am also a mom. My children are older, but I do remember the days of bottles and diapers.If I was in this situation you were I would have spoken up. I would have not let the half bottle be reheated and fed to my child. This has nothing to do with submissive or not. It has to do with safety and respect. It appears your husband did not respect your educational knowledge in this area. He also did not follow your desires and instructions on this either. Did you ever ask him why he was reusing the formula from the night before or why he was using the microwave? Perhaps he doesn't really understand how serious this can be. When we had an infant we were caring for a few years ago, I had to educate my husband on things like this. He listened and asked questins and he respected what I told him, no left over bottles saved and no microwaves used for bottle prep. Being a submissive wife does not mean you let the safety and wellbeing of yourself or your children become endangered. If in a situation where it could be that way it is all in the presentation of how we step in to prevent something from happening. Good luck

Thank you for your comment and for clarifying that submissive wives ( and husbands) do assert themselves appropriately.

My husband listens to me more now that I have submitted and these power struggles do not exist. We have clear roles and responsibilities in our relationship. Child care is one of mine as my Husband understands that I know best in that area. The bottle wouldn't have been in the fridge in the first place because I would already have the routine planned ahead of time for me to follow and my husband would just leave me to it... but at a year old, are you not making a bit of an issue over this? You know she will be fine, generations have survived, even with no sterilising! At a year old she can drink cold cows milk straight from the fridge but if you are careful with the microwave and give the bottle a good shake. It would be rare to cause a burn. Personally I think you gave your hubby an ear bashing for little reason, you made you both feel upset and probably argued in ear shot of your daughter which would have upset her too. I really don't think it was worth arguing over.

Thank you for your comment Robbo. I see now that perhaps I overreacted at the time. I really felt quite disrespected and I see now that i likely made him feel small as well.

Suck it up and say sorry but you know you need to look after yourself... golden rule of caring for others is to make sure you make the time to top up your own jug cause you cannot care for others if you are at rock bottom and sleep deprived yourself!

I think being a submissive wife has NOTHING to do with this situation but what you put in your mind. I WAS NOT a submissive wife when I had my child, (this was from a different marriage)as well as a young mother. First and foremost the baby is the #1 priority here.

Thank you and i agree.

I'm sorry Jane. You know I really like you and I empathize with your feelings but the whole situation has nothing to do with being submissive or not. I have twins, so you can imagine how I relate.
Kids are definitely my field and my husband respects and trusts me enough, so this would have never happened. Besides I must express my mind respectfully. This requires me to be calmed and so I make better points. The way I express myself is crucial. He would have listened and more important: the baby would have never been fed with that formula.
Being submissive doesn't mean you don't have a say. You do!!! It's the way you say it what changes.
Anyway, I don't think your baby is at risk. Fortunately he is big enough. Let's hope he doesn't get sick. Now he is one, maybe you should want to stop giving him milk at night. Dentists recommend to quit that habit as soon as possible.
Maybe you should talk about this later. You were definitely right! He should have listened to you. It's important to discuss these situations so they won't happen again. Try to be calm this time and he will listen, I'm sure! ;)

Thank you for this very nice comment and for your perspective. I very much like you as well :).

That was a great response Anonimacy :-)

With ur knowledge he needs to listen to you and quit being an *** its his child to and he needs to take the right steps

Thank you for your support, I do very much appreciate it.

good for you for speaking up... my spouse does such things... i ask him, how many times do i need to tell you? i sometimes think he feels like im trying to control him when i speak up on certain issues, god for bid he does what i ask ...

He fed her the formula AFTER you told him that was a "no go"?

Yes!!! Can you believe the nerve? I am so pissed right now!

DID he do that in front of you or what?

Yes right in front of me. I feel very disrespected. I feel he is a bully.

Jane, I'm sorry your hubby and you have this misunderstanding. I've been married for 40 years, long enough to know, it's not what you say, but how you say it. I truly believe your husband would not have given your baby bad milk. I can't believe he would something like that if he thought it would make your little one sick. Men can get so defensive if they feel their wives are putting them down with what they wives say to them and how wives react to it. It's not a matter of who is right, it's a matter of what's right. Mother's are protecters of their offspring and believe me, they will fight to the death for them as well you know. There is no such thing as a perfect marriage. There will be times when husbands and wives will have misunderstandings and different emotions. What is the matter with agreeing to disagree and leave it at that? Life is so short, so talk it over, forgive each other, enjoy each other, enjoy your family, and be happy for each day that God gives you to live on earth. You will have many ups and downs in marriage, and it's always better if you let yourself calm down, chill out and let go of the anger, so you can think clearer and have a better frame of mind and then take the time to count your blessings before you confront your husband and tell him how what he said and did and why it hurt you so. Think of how Jesus was disrespected and treated. He never said or did anything wrong and they crucified him. Then you need to hear what your husband has to say and why he got hurt enough to get upset with you. Men are logical and think with their brains, women are more emotional and think with their hearts and their brains. Women will remain the weaker sex just as long as they're smarter. Some men work so hard to make good wives that they never quite manage to make good husbands. Some women work so hard to make good husbands that they never quite manage to make good wives. Marriage is a partnership, there will good days and bad days, because we're human and we all have to realize that. A diamond cannot be polished without friction, nor man perfected without trials. We need to learn to live, laugh, love and forgive!!

Seriously ... That is out of line ... Of course you can't really use force, it's wrong and even more dangerous with the baby right there... I'm saying this because of the other comment where someone is claiming you "let" it happen... Of course the firey part of me wishes you would have taken the bottle from him and then dumped the contents on him....but as adults we don't do are you guys going to handle the feeding now? AS it currently stands you really can't trust him to do it.

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