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We Had A Fight Last Night....

My husband and I had a horrible fight last night. As I am not a submissive wife I spoke up and asserted myself when he completely disregarded my feelings.
I still breastfeed our 1year old daughter, but occasionally we do give her a bottle of formula as a supplement. She is consuming solids ( 3 meals a day) and has been for 6 months or so. The breastfeeding and/ or bottles are for comfort typically prior to bed.

Last night I was breastfeeding our little one, but she was still very cranky. My husband suggested giving her a bottle to help settle her for the night. I agreed. he proceeded to remove a bottle of formula ( which she had consumed half of the night prior) from the fridge and then place it into the microwave to heat it. I lost it, he knows because I have educated him regarding the dangers inherent in both these practices.
1. Once a child places her mouth on a bottle she introduces bacteria into the formula ( to be safe formula should be used within 1 hour) and should never be placed into the fridge to be given to the child at a later time.
2. Microwaves are not to be used to heat bottles ever as they can produce uneven heating and hotspots which can seriously scald a child.

I am a RN whom works in maternal/ newborn and I teach both of these concepts to new parents. I have a university degree in Nursing and hold a Bachelor's degree. I know that I am right.

I spoke up and asserted myself and my husband became defensive and rude. He completely disrespected me and our daughter and fed my daughter the bacteria ridden and likely dangerously over heated formula. Words were exchanged. It wasn't pretty and I am so ANGRY!!

Now had I been a submissive wife I guess I just would have let him go ahead without saying a word, there wouldn't have been a fight, but I would have died a little inside and felt extreme resentment.
That is the danger in being submissive, what if the husband or dominant wife is dead wrong??? How utterly and completely insane to allow just 1 person to make all of the decisions!
I will fight a 1000 fights to protect my children! My husband is no god, he is a mortal human being capable of error. I find his judgement lacking at times and his ego gets in the way of his ability to respect me and my education.
gumshoejane2 gumshoejane2 36-40, F 74 Responses Sep 18, 2012

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I agree with Ebbmilkmaid who said, "there is a difference between submissive and being a doormat." I agree with you that your husband needed to handle himself way differently than he did.

Applauding you again.....!!!!!

If you are
Worried about uneven heating it's called shake well and test before feeding.

You go girl! (1) never reuse past formula... Just commen sense
(2) never allow someone even your spouse to put you down or try to tell you what is completely incorrect. FYI EMT here so people all ways think they know more etc


Anyways that's my two cents what it's worth lol :)

Rob

you are absolutely right to speak up on your daughters behalf. her health and safety far outweight any other situation at home..best to always throw out bottles so husband not tempted ( i had one like that too)

However we will have to agree to disagree about submission..there is a difference between submissive and being a doormat..Also a difference betwwen dominance and being mean or a total ****. For those who cant tell they should not be involved in the lifestyle.

I guess I would have to ask why did you not throw the bottle away, but rather let it sit in the fridge if you knew it was a bad idea, and why did you allow him to feed it to your daughter knowing all that? On the flipside, I agree with you in being upset, speaking your mind, and letting him have it!
Married couples will often disagree - it's how you handle those disagreements that matter. Hopefully it is water under the bridge. My wife tends to hold onto things when we have a disagreement and build it up into something much more than it is.
I much prefer a woman that speaks her mind than one that sits passively and takes everything, right or wrong.

Being a "submissive" wife has been so misused and misinterpreted (primarily by the churched population) that it has gotten out of control and has turned men into neanderthals and women into mouses, hiding who they are and riddled with guilt if they speak out. Here's the real deal........When the Bible tells wives to submit to their husbands, I wish people would read the rest of that verse. The husbands are required to submit to Christ. Funny how that slips through the cracks. How do husbands submit to Christ? By allowing Christ to live through them and receiving His love and what He says about them. If you are a believer, the Bible tells that as Jesus is then so are we. Who was Jesus? What was He like? He certainly wasn't a neanderthal and He had great respect for women. A woman will naturally "submit" to a husband who is allowing Jesus to show up in how he talks to his wife, responds to her and treats her. Jesus gently woos us to Him. He never demands, yells, demeans or guilts us into anything. He always treats us with love. Even those who may not be Believers, He is still wooing them. Submitting isn't meant as a domineering act, it's an act of gentle love. The church has screwed up it's meaning for far too long. Think about it, isn't it easier to submit to someone who speaks kindly to you, shows you respect and treats you like you matter?

You were right to speak up to your husband because your baby was in danger. Don't ever apologize for being who you are. Just talk to him the way you would like to be talked to. I often use a calm and firm voice with my husband when I feel he is doing something I don't agree with. I point out that I may know a little something about what he's doing and I don't like his decision. But I also remember that I am not his mama or his Holy Spirit. Sometimes you just have to trust Papa God with your baby during your husband's moments of stubborn stupidity (after all, don't we all have some of those moments?). When I treat my husband with respect, I often get it in return. Sometimes he listens and sometimes he doesn't. Sometimes he gets all caveman on me. I just let him be. It's hard in your case because your mother instincts and every medical training you ever kicked into high gear but I trust that baby ended up unscathed in the end.

or make sure 1/2 used bottles a tossed daily

You are so right on this issue. Even as the submissive one in a relationship, I would speak up on issues such as this. Of course, I have to do it tactfully and don't raise my voice, but I still make my point. It has happened of course, as I am a MUA and there have been discussions regarding makeup hygiene.

I enjoy your writing and find you to be a very intelligent woman. I guess my debate here is that the word submissive seems to have been bastardized in this discussion, as I hear it that way many times. Many confuse submissive with doormat. Woman, with work, family, responsibility, seem to want those times of letting go, loss of control, but at times, usually more sexual in nature. But the key is, woman are more dimensional then men, so they can more easily be submissive in the bedroom, coy, and so on, yet can also be 50 percent of a strong relationship and perform any job a man can. Further more in true relationships where there is dominance and submission - the submissive is usually the one who is more confident, where if there is trust in the dominant, can let go - that takes tremendous confidence and self awareness. So, to me, I love when I have earned the trust of a woman, to where she can let go, and be submissive, allow herself to lean on a shoulder and let me take the lead - because I have excited her mind and proved that I can be multi-dimensional as well. All I am trying to point out that submissive is not bad, doormat is. You knew better then to let that formula be used - any true submissive would have fought just as hard.

What if the husband or dominant wife is dead wrong?

Simple. "mistress/master I wish to have my objection noted I do not believe that this is a wise choice of action, I only feel the need to object because I feel strongly on this matter, please I beg of you may I have permission to prepare the bottle myself?"

IF you have a very dominant/submissive relationship that would work it't not about not being heard being weak or not communicating at all.
Forgive me for saying but, I don't think you comprehend the dynamics at work in those types of relationships, although you know your milk lol.

Thank you for your comment!
Since writing this I have come to much better understanding of D/s dynamics. I was very wrong to imply that submissive wives are weak and don\'t speak up when needed.

Thank you for taking the effort. That says volumes for you.

where have you been hiding? I\'m interested in understanding the dynamic if not necessarily related to self esteem or so

true we can’t generalize, nice of you to open up and perceive other then

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You are very right in what you did and asserting yourself. He put your child in danger and should be taken to task for it!!

But....I disagree in that defining "submissive" as being one who doesn't defend herself or what she believes in. Of course.....it's stupid to argue over labels.

Your conviction and protecting your child were right on. Defend the defenseless at all cost. Your child is lucky to have a mother as loving as you.

gosh, I remember you

awhitedot

I may have written a story for him no awhite? Mayhem in room 69 or something related to why I like giving bj\'s and explained Freud

It has been a while!! I do remember. I think that was on my very first profile here.

I wondered why you were not in my circle, let me go smoke a blunt and back verify the 2 stories I

Hahahaa!!! Go for it!

Thank you white dot!
I have grown in my understanding of D/s dynamics since writing this.
I completely agree with you, subs do speak up when they feel strongly.
Thank you for your comment!

Omg I found the story, Feb 12, 2011 you wrote Mayhen Room 69 and I replied, its a hot story...posting on ur Wb

I cant post on ur wb since we not friends yet but here it is

Wow! I remember that one. Whew....steamy!

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the longer the kid is breast fed, the stronger his immune system becomes and so they almost never get sick

So very true. I breast fed both my kids for as long as they were willing.

In American or occidental societies breasts are perceived on sex compared to Africa per example, they have no correlation with sex and breasts. They belief is breast are made to feed. Do animals stimulate the female breast to conceive?

Well this one is cut and dried, you have far more authority in this area because of your qualifications and experience.
my wife and I never argue these days , not the stand up shouting kind anyway...but I remember those and laughing afterwards about it ....and the making up...lol.
One argument ended in her storming upstairs and sitting in the bedroom. After an hour or two I went upstairs and started running a bath. I got undressed and walked into the bedroom to get some clean underwear. She gave me one of those smiles that says..sorry let's make up...and I leaned over to kiss her. Bear in mind I was stark bollock naked at this point. One thing led to another and half an hour later we were cuddling on the bed trying to avoid a rather lath wet patch when I suddenly remembered... The ******* BATH!!!!!
Water had poured over the top of the bath, through the ceiling into the kitchen, the stairs had become a mini niagra falls and the living room carpet was under 2 inches of water.
Funny, I remember everything except what the argument was over.

Oh noes!

Sometimes its not about (THE) speaking up or standing up for being right....but rather the way (body language), your tone of voice and or gestures used to bring across your point. Regardless of being dominant or submissive.

Once again I am in total agreement with you. However, a submissive wife (or husband) who held your knowledge would not have quietly acquiesced. Submissiveness, should not be synonymous with stupidity, whenever the submissive partner has specialist knowledge only an idiot would ignore that. Also if a natural submissive is moved to 'speak up' then this should never be ignored.

I never understood the idea some people have that men should be the head of the household. Everyone has strengths and weaknesses. As couples it's to our benefit to allow each other's strengths to rise to the top. To me it's not about making it exactly 50/50, it's about allowing each other to best utilize their strengths and to help cover their weaknesses. I'm sure somewhere inside your hubby knew he was outmatched and dead wrong. Hopefully he had the wherewithal to apologize.

I do believe the man is the head of the household. Now before anyone freaks out, hear me out. Being head of the home doesn't mean disrespecting, disregarding our spouse. In fact, my belief on a submissive wife is this. Submission is a gift of respect by the wife, submission is GIVEN, not taken. My wife is wonderful, I am the head but she is my queen. I don't make decisions without taking her thoughts/feelings into account. when I do make the decision however, it is made. She doesn't try to over rule that decision. If she disagrees with my decision, she discuss it with me and we converse with each other. I respect my wife and I love her the more for being who she is. I am very respectful to her and would never say or do anything to degrade her. I worship/honor her it is a mutual respect. Now back on topic. Phew! LOL. Mothers have been doing what your husband has done for decades, it has never killed anyone. Why was this the wrong thing to do? I am no medical professional just inquiring. BTW, I think you're awesome ;)

It is obvious that you love your wife Wolv1j. But my thinking is this: That decisions regarding a marriage or a family should be made 50/50 by each spouse. Then, as the husband / father, it is his responsibility or JOB to be the spokesperson. But he doesn't overrule his wife.

777 it's a rarity that I actually overrule my wife. 99.5% of the time, we make decisions together with me being the chief spokesman for our family, but there are times when we do not agree on something. I listen to her opinion and thoughts, then I weigh them to make the best decision for the family. Thank you for your comment.

Who put the half consumed milk back in the fridge in the first place here ?

My wife always used microwave for bottles. She just swirls the bottle to mix it well. I tried arguing with her on that point, but no listen. Mother knows best.

I am a father and grandfather and I agree with you 100%.

OK, tell me I am wrong here..... but did this go from a Mother (+RN) knows best issue, to an issue of who really wears the pants in the family? Do women really have to get to that level of anger, step on a man's ego in order to protect a child from that bacteria? Is there a way for a woman to let her man have an ego and feel like the man in the family but still communicate when you disagree? If you find it, you'll be much happier with the "Man" that you live with as opposed to the alternative. Just my 2 cents.

You do not have the right idea of a Submissive is in a relationship. Maybe in some cultures, but I know for a fact that when "Mama" Daddy listens when it comes to children. Bravo for coming to the rescue..

I know this is very late in the game to respond but I wanted to make one point. A person is able to be submissive and still protective. Just because some chose to have a dominant and submissive relationship shouldn't mean they leave their brains at the door. Yes I know too many do that kind of thing but when it comes to one person understanding the risks I know many submissive women who may of been sorry later but wouldn't be mad because their child was fed from an old bottle. They would of taken the lumps but prohibited the bottle to be used one way or another. Even if it means dumping the contents at their feet. Submission doesn't mean brainless or without a soul.

I have no medical background, but totally agree that was not safe. I usually advocate the man being the leader in the home, but they are not always correct. You have to speak up. You can't follow when it is an issue of safety.

Thank you for your comment. I mostly agree except I do not advocate the man being the leader simply because he happens to be the man.

There is no excuse when a child's well being is at stake. Tell him you won't stand by and watch him do anything that could put her health at risk, that what moms do, it has nothing at all to do with submissiveness.

Thank you and I agree!

Here's what I think:

Expect to receive no more than you are willing to give.


Let him know that you notice everything he does for you.


Be quick to acknowledge the best in each other and never point out the faults.

Hold hands at the movies.


Lock arms together when taking a stroll. Walk slowly and enjoy a conversation.


When the fall colors are at their brightest, rent a convertible and go for a ride. It’s a good time for a picnic too.


Sing a love song when you are in the shower.


Encourage her to talk about the events of her day before you talk about yours.


Always sit close enough so that you can touch each other if one of you wants to.


There is no such thing as the wrong time to say, ‘I Love You”. Say it with conviction---say it often.


Let him vent freely about what is on his mind whe he needs to relieve the pressure.


When holding hands, squeeze three times to say “I love you”.


Share good news with each other first.


Avoid withholding bad news. Its best to just get it out and get it over with.


Be honest about what you are feeling and be willing to share all of your feelings.


Take care not to minimize each other’s feelings.


Demand nothing from each other, and gratefully accept whatever is given.


Whenever you leave the house, always explain where you are going and when you expect to be back.


Be sure to keep your cell phones on when you are apart from each other.


Call as soon as you realize you will be later than you expected.


Find a reason everyday to call and say, “Hey there. I miss you.” “I love you” wouldn’t hurt, either.


Never mock or make fun of each other.


Try no to be the center of attention. Share the spotlight.


Strive to give more to the relationship than anything else in your life.


When you are needed, drop what you are doing and give your best effort as long as necessary.


When you are setting the thermostat, be considerate of her preferences. Putting on a heavier or lighter shirt isn’t a big deal.


Always do more than what you think is your fair share of the household chores.


Call to say you are on your way home and ask if you can stop pick up anything along the way.


Be as thoughtful to each other at home as you are in public.


When together in the car, be considerate of his preferences. Listening to sports or talk radio once in a while really can be quite entertaining.


Always call when you said you would, especially when you are traveling.


Wait to start eating until both of you have been served.


Don’t bring the newspaper to the table unless both of you are going to read it.


Flirt with each other in public.


Learn each other’s body language.


Lie on the lawn together at midnight and watch the stars overhead.


On the anniversary of your first date, take turns reading your old love letters to each other.


Never stop writing love letters to each other. Save each and everyone.


Keep a scrapbook of the places the two of you have been together. Use it as a memory jogger when you’re in the mood to reminisce.


Send a surprise “I miss you” text message now and then.


Read romantic poetry together, especially when times get rough.


Write love notes on Post-its and leave them on the bath mirror.


Only play the games that each of you has a fair chance of winning.


Remember to be playful. Having fun together is a great way to strengthen your relationship.


Turn off the television some nights and just talk, talk, talk. You’ll be surprised how much you enjoy it.


Show gratitude for everything she does for you.


Understand where both of you are weak and try to be strong there for each other.


Be sure to tell each other the things that make you happy in the relationship.


Compliment each other’s appearance. Do it often.


Never give a self-improvement book, but if you receive one, read it.


It is never too early to say “I’m sorry”. Say it as soon as possible.


Before you get analytical, let her express her anger the way she wants to. She’ll appreciate it later.


When you are wrong, admit it ---and mean it.


When you get an emotional response that surprise you, ask why.


Before you get angry, let him explain. There usually is a reason for everything.


If you are feeling defensive, realize that acting on it is probably not the best course of action.


Read to each other at bed time.


Let a goodnight kiss be the last event of every day.


If one of you can’t sleep, don’t disturb the other.


If both of you cannot sleep, sit up and watch your old home movies.


Take a long walks together on the beach.


Go for a ride together on a bicycle built for two.


Have a picnic in a rowboat.


Share secrets with each other that no on else knows about.


Always keep your mate’s confidence private---it is a matter of character and fidelity.


Always speak to each other with respect. Never shout at each other.


Whatever the problems may be, work for harmony, not just peaceful coexistence.


Be transparent in the way you live. Never do anything you wouldn’t want the other to know about.


Make a commitment never to correct each other in front of others or argue in public.


Give other couples watching reason to say, “I wish we were like that.”


Go on a picnic together on the first warm weekend of spring.


Play footsie under the table.


Reach across the table and hold hands while toasting each other.


Order one really decadent dessert to share and feed it to each other.


Bring him lemonade while he is cutting the grass.


Keep a calendar of special moments in earlier years, and celebrate those moments each time that date comes around again.


Wash the car together.


Buy matching coffee cups the next time you go shopping.


Help her fold the laundry.


Play each other’s favorite CDs when you go for a ride.


When you’re on a long trip, take turns driving and sleeping.


Go out dancing on a Saturday night. If you can’t dance, learn.


On a snowy evening, go outside together and catch snowflakes on your tongues.


Never pass up a ride through the Tunnel of Love.


When you are walking together in the rain, hold most of the umbrellas over her.


When you’re in a setting where you should be quiet, mouth the words I love you.


Learn how to say “I love you” in a sign language.


When he is stressed out, massage his head and neck.


Compromise quickly, never as a last resort.


Emphasize the things about each other that make you happy rather than those that might not be as endearing.


When the bathroom door is shut, don’t try to enter---if she shuts the door, you should, too.


Just ignore each other’s weird noises.


Understand that she will use more than half of the closet space and bathroom counter. Just accept it and move on.


If he likes to sleep later on Saturday’s snuggle up and learn to like it, too.


Understand that he will collect lots of tools and obsess about the grass. Just accept it and move on.


When spending the day together, leave the watches at home.


The best-laid plans can be a bore. Leave a little room for something unexpected.


Always cherish the moments you share. You never know how many more you will have.


From "Play Footsie Under the Table: And 499 More Ways to Make Love Last"
By Gregory E. Lang

I can't help but notice the roaring silence this post has received. I'm pretty sure, though, that had I said something even remotely anti-feminist or pro-masculanist all the harpies here on EP would mob me and rip me to shreds.

I guess it's true after all, "Haters just wanna hate!"

well good morning Merry Sunshine!

Seeee? What did I tell you, lol :)

I don't know. what did you tell me?

I think this is good advice max.

@gumshoe

**GASP!!!** An actual compliment? jk jk jk kjk he heheeh ee hhe h

:) :) :)

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Jane...be sure to take Max's advice...cuz he/she know better than anybody what arguing and discord can do...ya know?

More importantly, if you make it a habit to violently explode with your husband over perceived slights or disagreements your children will suffer most for it. As a health care professional, I'm sure I don't need to highlight all of the research demonstrating how regular fighting, yelling and screaming in an emotionally violent household is absolutely detrimental to children.

If you truly love your children make having a peaceful, tranquil home your number one priority.

wow max you stalking all my friends.what up with dat!

Max - I agree completely with all your insights about household discord. However, I do not agree with the following implications:

Firstly, threatening somebody with divorce will not go very far towards maintaining domestic peace. It shows that what you really want is fearful acquiescence, not understanding. Moreover, I'm sure Jane will agree with me that divorce, though unpleasant, is still better than enduring an egoistic partner. And thankfully, nowadays, women don't have to come off much worse after a well-needed divorce.

Secondly, Jane was not trying to "always getting her way", and she wasn't reacting over a "perceived slights or disagreements". She was arguing for her children about a very real mistake on her husband's part.

Don't you think that Jane's husband should also take care not to instigate fights, knowing how detrimental it can be for the children? Do you believe that the burden of compromise and of maintaining household peace lies more on women than on men?

That's what I WANTED to say Cameron, lol. Good job.

@Cameron

The continued success of a marriage is only possible when both the husband and the wife fulfill the responsibilities they have towards one another. When either one fails to do their job the marriage is poisoned. If the poisoning persists, the marriage will eventually die, hence, why divorce is so prevalent.

@Gypsy

I was just shocked you had any friends and was simply verifying that the profiles in your circle weren't fakes, lol :)

LOL You know she was in the right. She made the right choice...bottom line. You can keep arguing because that's what you do best Max, but in the end you know she was right....

@777

You misunderstand, I'm not justifying Jane's husband's actions. I'm simply pointing out that if Jane angrily explodes every time a disagreement takes place she's going to single handedly wreck her marriage. She's also going to ruin their kids' lives for very few things are worst for a child than an emotionally violent environment.

Bottom line, she could of handled the situation with more humility and kindness, instead of arrogance and rage, which should be at the very heart of the love she supposedly professes for him - unless of course this is one of those wacky BDSM marriages, in which case, she can disregard everything I've shared :)

And Max...that was just plain mean. Usually you circumvent a great deal more. I guess Gypsy's really getting to you..

@777

Oh stop it! :) It's just playful banter. Kinda like what you and I have, lol :)

i get under most peoples skin..... i dont take it personal, but they think i do ......... that is the fun part....

max you could of made it easy on ur self.... to find out more about me... just ask me .......... excuses excuses ....glad you find me interesting.

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A house divided cannot stand.

Even if you're right if you treat him like the enemy whenever he goofs he will resent you for it. Keep it up and, sooner or later, he'll be serving you with divorce papers.

I think you just jumped the "conclusional Grand Canyon" Max. . .

Just helping her appreciate the very real cost she'll have to pay if always getting her way trumps the need for a peaceable, tranquil home for their children.

777 hell yeA, HE jumped ... he must not of had any long term relationships.....or any serious relationships, there are always up/downs to living with a loved one...

max ann .......... ok i took the bait ur full of ****

max u did not read the story she was protecting her child dum ***

@Gypsy

Typical first time parent jitters. She overreacted. Her baby was not in any mortal danger whatsoever.

He goofed, that's all. Besides, I seriously doubt she would very much enjoy being dehumanized every time she goofed.

Max,
I'm curious, would you provide the same advice to husbands or is it only women who must concede?

@Gumshoe

As I posted earlier, the continued success of a marriage is only possible when both the husband and the wife fulfill the responsibilities they have towards one another. When either one fails to do their job the marriage is poisoned. If the poisoning persists, the marriage will eventually die, hence, why divorce is so prevalent.

@Gypsy

So much for not taking things personally, smh, lol :)

maxx i see ur are reading what i say ... hmmmm yes when people like ur self pick on jane, i take it personal.... but towards me..... i dont care what you or others think. i know my self well enough to know who i am.......and im happy with that

@Gypsy

So, how long, exactly, have you been Jane's attorney? smh, lol :)

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given your education and experience, it's clear that you are correct and i would think that your hubby would know that. not being right all the time doesn't make a man less of a man but that seems hard for some of them to accept.