Just Wanted to Open This Up For a Mature Discussion

 

Unfortunately I could only find this story on the religious web site. I live in Virginia Beach, VA only 45 minutes from where this happened. I remember when this happened. I am not some far right conservative, Yes this article came off a religious web site and has religious gander in there. I just wanted to tell what happened. I wanted to know what you guys think about this and should their be a point where we say this is not OKAY.

A lot of media personel felt sorry for this woman. Me I wanted her to go be punished. TO me this was an act of hatefulness. All hate crimes deserve a punishment.

 

http://www.catholic.org/featured/headline.php?ID=3283    Again sorry for the biased web page all the local newspapers have retired it from their websites

 

 

 

On May 8, 2006 Tammy Skinner, 22, stood before the Judge in Suffolk, Virginia. This court hearing was the culmination of events that occurred on Feb. 23, 2006. On that fateful day, Tammy called police from a car dealership. She told them that she had been shot in the stomach and pushed out of her car. Police found blood in Skinner’s red compact car, and a gun. Tammy was carrying a baby within her; a little girl who was to be delivered that very day.

Later, Tammy changed her story, claiming that the father of Baby Girl Skinner had killed her. Finally, she told the authorities the truth - she had shot herself in the abdomen with the intention of killing Baby Girl Skinner. She did this on the very day she was to have delivered her baby girl. Tammy has two other daughters. However, she did not want this one. So she killed her.

Tammy Skinner was charged with inducing an abortion. However, since she actually fired the gun herself, General District Court Judge James A. Moore decided that she could not be charged with inducing a miscarriage or abortion. After all, abortion is legal in America, throughout all nine months, under the holding of Roe v. Wade. Her lawyer, known for his “civil rights” work- and for his representation of the People for the Ethical treatment of Animals (PETA)- argued at a preliminary hearing that the charge of inducing an abortion or miscarriage is intended for use against a third party.

He contended that the Statute did not apply to a mother who shoots herself to commit an abortion. “A strange irony for a civil rights lawyer”, you might ask? Well, in America, Baby Girl Skinner had no civil rights. Mother Tammy has them all. She also has a “right” to kill. Given the state of the law in this nation, the other person involved, the one who died as a direct result of the gunshot, Baby Girl Skinner, had no voice and no legal standing. She, along with all children in the first home of the human race, their mothers’ womb, had been reduced to the status of property.

The charge of inducing an abortion was dismissed. That’s not all. Tammy Skinner had also been charged with using a firearm in a felony. However, that charge was not prosecuted. Under Virginia law, it must occur during the commission of a specific felony. Tammy’s intentional killing of Baby Girl Skinner was not a felony. It was viewed as an extension of her “right” to take the life of her own child, as long as the baby was still in the womb. However, there was a prosecution. She was convicted of filing a false police report. General District Judge James A. Moore Jr. ordered her to pay the cost of the police investigation, $750. If someone else had shot Tammy Skinner and her daughter on the day she was to have delivered Baby Girl Skinner, they could have been prosecuted. However, Virginia’s fetal homicide law doesn’t seem to apply to the mother. It refers to killing “the fetus of another.” Prosecutors might still ask a grand jury for a charge. However, one of the Commonwealth’s Attorneys, Phil Ferguson, said: “We are dealing with a woman who, by her own hands, killed her child on the day of its birth…This was a nine-month fetus, clearly in the realm of viability. Whether it meets legal tests to constitute criminal conduct – we’re reviewing and exploring our options.”

Tammy Skinner’s attorney, who apparently recognizes the civil rights of animals and fish, did not concern himself with the preeminent natural and human rights of Baby Girl Skinner. He said he was happy with the decision stating: “It was clear to me, and clear to the judge, that you cannot convict when an expectant mother does this,”

Last year, I wrote an article concerning 16-year-old Erica Basoria, the pregnant teenage mother from Texas and her boyfriend, 18-year-old Gerardo "Jerry" Flores. Flores faced capital murder charges for killing two unborn children when he beat his girlfriend in the abdomen. The bizarre twist, Erica requested the young man to punch her in the abdomen repeatedly, precisely in order to kill these children. Jerry Flores was charged under the Texas Prenatal Protection Act. Erica Basoria was not charged at all.

The twins, like Baby Girl Skinner, are dead.

That Texas Act was passed in 2003 in order to protect unborn children. It is similar to the "Unborn Victims of Violence Act", or "Conner’s Bill", the Federal legislation named for Conner Peterson, the slain unborn child of Laci Peterson. The Act defines "individual" as, "a human being who is alive, including an unborn child at every ...

 

missing missing
22-25, F
41 Responses Mar 25, 2009

Why the hell wait until the day of birth to "abort" it?? No one would have looked sideways if she had decided to adopt the baby out!! I'm pro-choice, but this is taking it too far, and I think it's absolutely ghastly that she got away with it because of some bullshit law. I think a line needs to be drawn, she should have been punished for her irresponsibility. In my country I believe abortions are 'allowed' up until 20wks (at a push) but that is ample time to decide whether you want to have the baby or not. Maybe if people took having children more seriously then stupid acts like what was mentioned above may happen less.

O'Reilly had a girl on his show who aborted a baby at tiller's clinic who was perfectly healthy. She hid her pregnancy from her parents, they found out when she was past the point where anyone in her state would do it, so the parents took her to tiller. He spoke with her, she told him that her having the baby would cause her "mental problems". He classified this as "mental health for the mother" and bam, it's legal and he kills her baby who was well past the gestation for viability. He gave her baby an ultrasound guided shot of dioxin in the heart to kill him and then she gave birth to her dead baby in a special toilet that is used for this over and over. Sometimes the "dr" misses and these babies are born alive and left in these toilets to die. That is not propaganda, that is a fact. Who cares if it's rare, it happens and isn't that enough? We do this to these defenseless human beings and then scream that "we just want peace man" and go recycle something. This is just pathetic. Also, there is absolutely no evidence to indicate when a baby feels pain. The nervous system is in place by 8 weeks, not developed but present. The director from pp who just resigned watched the 13 week old baby jump and literally "fight for it's life" on the ultrasound, this is what caused her to resign.<br />
<br />
Yes, some babies killed there (at tiller's clinic) did have defects but who are we to decide what is "normal" enough to rate to be born? This man was a heartless monster who God would have, or is dealing with....the wak job that killed him is also horrible and senseless to use killing as an answer to killing....Revenge belongs to the Lord and to say your a Christian and then take revenge like that in your own hands is not trusting Him at all.<br />
<br />
Either way, he was a big boy and you cannot blame someone else for his actions. Look at the twits who followed manson. They went to jail for what they did even though he was brainwashing them. They killed those people, not charles manson.

I am not a fan of abortion. Hence, the name of this group. We just differ on our opinion of how great it would be to call it murder and ban it accordingly. <br />
<br />
We of course love our daughter very much. No, I personally couldn't fathom choosing to abort her, since we have been planning for years to have her, and after a couple of months of trying, finally conceived. <br />
<br />
I am under no illusion that everyone goes through such meticulous planning. For the young people who are not ready but accidentally get pregnant, it's a totally different situation. <br />
<br />
Later term abortions are harder to accept for obvious reasons. At a certain point it does cross into 'murder' territory, especially if there is a chance that the fetus could survive outside the mother's womb. Late term abortions are thankfully rare, despite whatever pro-life propaganda you pay attention to. It's an absurd argument that a sizable number of women just can't wait to be pregnant for months and months only to stroll into a doctor's office to end it on a whim. <br />
<br />
Tiller the baby killer was killed because Bill O'Reilly and other right wing wackos fanned the flames of hatred toward him and misrepresented what he really was about. The late term abortions he performed were because of horrible birth defects, not the whim of a girl who just can't make up her mind about whether or not she wants to be a mom. <br />
<br />
The majority of abortions are done very early, when the nervous system has not even developed, so there is no pain, unless you know of some other way that pain is transmitted. Perhaps through the soul.

Again, obviously our views are going to be completely different. I believe in God and you don't. We do agree on women getting multipal abortions though. There are more of them than you think. I have found this out, not by statistics, but by reading personal accounts and just being around a pregnancy center where post abortion services are offered.<br />
<br />
You are correct, sometimes that does happen and I don't blame anyone but I do know that it is God's doing. This is however way less common than abortions though. But as a Christian, I believe He has a purpose for everything that He does, so if He does it it's completely different than us doing it.<br />
<br />
I looked at your pics of your baby (beautiful, congrats). Come on man, you saw her early ultrasound pics....that was a person, not a "product of conception".<br />
<br />
This is all I'm saying. It is really great to be against abortion personally, but I just can't sit back and know that over 3,000 innocent lives are taken every day in our nation. It is a serious injustice, without even bringing God into the picture....atleast these are my views and I think it's bullshit that I am forced to pay for something that I wholeheartedly consider outright murder.<br />
<br />
As far as divorce goes, each marriage I feel is unique and special and only the two involved can decide if it's worth keeping or not. I grew up with a mother and father. A father who was a devout heroin addict and sometimes put us both through hell. Everyone said that my ma should have divorced hom, even me. I used to beg her when things got really bad. He died last April on Easter Sunday and she was right next to him. Even though my home growing up was far from leave it to beaver, I knew that my dad adored me and as a girl, this helped me in life tremendously. I also learned that life is not perfect, you have to take the good with the bad and I really saw the true meaning of loyality. So yeah, if she divorced him, our lives would have been a lot easier but going through things has made me a stronger person ya know?<br />
<br />
Sorry for the rant I just view divorce differently after watching my ma. Sometimes I think people now get divorced for stupid reasons and back in the day, that didn't happen as often.

You're wrong about God not having his own version of abortions. <br />
<br />
If a pregnant woman tries her best to do everything right, reads all the right books, eats all the right foods, listens to her doctor's advice... and still ends up having a miscarriage or a stillborn, that is God's version of an abortion. If the woman does everything she is supposed to and fails to successfully have a baby, then who else besides God could you blame? Oh wait, I guess she probably should have prayed harder or some bullshit like that. Such a loving God that allows miscarriages and stillborns. Or maybe we're supposed to blame the devil. <br />
<br />
Any woman who gets more than 1 abortion, and where there isn't rape or horrifying birth defects involved, I'll slap her myself. But why shape your policy based on the actions of a small number of retarded sociopaths who can't stop having abortions? They are statistically irrelevant. Anyone that uses abortions for birth control obviously needs to learn about other options for birth control, ones that don't require a medical procedure. That's a big 'Duh'. <br />
<br />
Many of the arguments focusing on # of abortions are obviously misleading. Comparing today's abortion statistics to previous decades is worthless, for many reasons. The populations aren't even close, so instantly you can throw out any statistics which name totals and not per capita percentages. With much greater populations you are going to have much greater occurences of everything, abortion included. <br />
<br />
Also you have to account for the much better records kept on everything now. In the 1920's you didn't have entire organizations which did nothing but track statistics such as this. <br />
<br />
Look at divorce. Today everyone ******* and moans about the divorce rate of 50%, as if that number alone explains society's ills. It's only an explanation to someone who doesn't ask more questions. Such as: which is worse? A high divorce rate or a low divorce rate and higher number of marriages which have no business continuing?

God does not have a version of abortion. It's the other way around. If a woman aborts through a miscarriage, something is usually wrong. Quite different from sucking a perfectly healthy baby out of a womb.<br />
<br />
Look man, I care a great deal about women who are scared and pregnant. I volunteer some time at a pregnancy center and love our girls to death. We are also a liscenced medical clinic with RNs who actually show our women their babies, unlike planned parenthood. 94% of all women who view their baby end up carrying to term. I love these women and help them to see that abortion is not their only option just because the pregnancy was unplanned. There have been many women who regret their abortion but I've yet to meet one who regrets having her baby instead of abortiong. Sometimes I think that we don't realize that we wanted something until we get it, then we can't imagine our lives without it.<br />
<br />
We would not be able to know the difference between real and fake miscarriages. It is extremely difficult to kill your baby inside of you and live through it. What would happen is illegal abortions. They were just as "safe" as the legal ones. Women used to do it, the coat hanger thing is a lie made up by people trying to jam abortion down our throats during those times. Did women actually attempt to self abort? Yes, but it was very rare. Much more rare than the #of abortions that legally take place today. <br />
<br />
All I am saying is that killing your child should not be an option. It is thouroughly abused and is used as a crutch by some. Some women get 5, 6, 7 or more! Whether you see it spiritually or not, it is the taking of a life...abortionists have admited this outright. They just feel that it's "justified killing". We brutally kill our most defenseless and then scream that there's no peace.....makes complete sense.

My question wasn't about what your feelings were towards women who choose to abort, my question was how do we know? I get that you don't give a **** about girls that end up pregnant and scared. How do we know what's an accident and what's a genuine miscarriage (God's version of an abortion)?

Saratoga girl I live in the viewing area of where this happened. She shot herself right before her due date then lied to police saying someone else shot her. Further investigation showed she did it to herself, then she admitted so. Like I said in the beginning this was the only site that still had the story up. Yes it is a biased source but the facts are still true. Sorry to tell you that.

I thought that I made it clear that if a woman chooses to murder the life inside of her then she should be on her own. Heroin addicts need heroin or they become violently ill and can even die if they don't get heroin. My father was one for 25 years, so I know this first hand. Heroin is still illegal but the government found a different route to cash in on heroin addiction because they recognized the gold mine in it. They created methadone clinics and heroin addicts can go use synthetic heroin (methadone) and the government gets the revenue instead of heroin dealers. In the realm of abortion, the gold mine was recognized and abortion was legalized based on a lie and is now a billion dollar industry. <br />
<br />
If these cases of women trying to self abort increase then so be it. There wouldn't be over 3,000 lives taken every day in America, that number will dramatically decrease. However this won't happen because then the only ones who would profit would be the "dr.s" who are willing to perform illegal abortions, which is how it used to be before 1973.<br />
<br />
It's just like anything else, when people recognize that others are making mad money, they organize and get in on it. They crept abortion through the back door in 1973 very strategically. If you watch the video at abort73.com, the one on the legalization of abortion, ( no abortion pics), you will see how this was all planned out.<br />
<br />
If a woman is trying to kill her baby, I have NO sympathy for her and if she dies in the process then so be it.

What is off the wall in what I wrote? There is a huge difference between a genuine miscarriage and an abortion, but my point is that if you make abortions illegal, you will get many more miscarriages, and they won't be genuine, they will be deliberate. <br />
<br />
Even with abortion being legal, today you still get women drinking poisons trying to abort the baby and you have women injuring themselves. Imagine if legal abortion were no longer available. Are you gonna sit there and say that those 'accidents' aren't going to multiply vigorously? If so, you're kidding yourself. <br />
<br />
If you acknowledge that those cases are going to increase dramatically, then we're back to my previous post, what are you gonna do about all of these murders? Do you favor the CSI route or the padded room route?

That's a bit off the wall, don't ya think?? A miscarriage is different than a "dr" going into the womb and ripping out a growing baby. Most miscarriages occure because something is wrong with the development of the baby. That is not intentional murder...come on get serious here. If a woman decides she wants to murder her child that is growing in her then she should have to face consequences. There should not be legal murdering sites readily available. This is just pure enabling. Deep down, most people know that abortion is in fact murder, they just won't look at it and try to justify it. Roe from Roe v Wade is now pro life herself and admits that she and her scum bag lawyers lied about the rape. She was never raped, the sex was consentual. Those greedy bastards just saw dollar sighns and advancement in "womans lib" and couldn't help themselves. She is an advocate for the unborn now and deeply regrets her case being the mark for legalized abortion.<br />
<br />
This is an industry that is founded on a lie.... Abortion is not "liberating at all, it is exploiting.

Assume Roe is overturned and abortion is now considered 'murder'. Should every miscarriage be investigated by a CSI group and should the surviving parents be put on trial in front of a federal jury and face life in prison and a possible death sentence? Outlaw abortion and the number of fishy accidents concerning pregnant women skyrockets. Guaranteed. Who decides whether the woman is committing murder or if she actually slipped on the ice or down the stairs? Should we put you in charge of that? You'd probably fry all the victims in the electric chair. <br />
<br />
The only logical conclusion to making abortion murder is to lock every pregnant woman in a padded cell for 24 hour surveillance until she gives birth. Anyone else think this sounds like an Orwellian paradise?

well if you were to look, you would clearly see why abortion should be outlawed...because it is clearly murder. Murder is illegal, is it not? This is why the whole debate of who gets them is not the one to be had. It completely ignores the fact that murdering your child is an option. Abortion pictures (especially these ones) should have to be faced by everyone who believes its ok to get one. Everyone should have to look at what they are defending. They won't because deep down they know that it is in fact brutal murder and ignorance is bliss.

I have no interest in looking at pics of abortion, just as I have no interest in looking at pics or vids of what goes on everyday in slaughterhouses. I am against abortion, but I know that outlawing it is not the answer, just as prohibition is not the answer to drunk driving.

People who call themselves Christians and then take revenge into their own hands are clearly not Christians at all. Senseless killing is not the answer to senseless killing. However, I don't see how you can blame O'Reilly for something that some wak job did. O'Reilly just simply had a girl on his show who explained what happened to her at Tiller's clinic. He gave his opinion on what Tiller was doing but it's a commentary show....that's what you do right? We are all responsible for our own actions. Tiller was murdering full term babies at his clinic, but as a Christian, I believe God would have handled him for that.<br />
<br />
As for the article, I read it and still feel that your missing the mark. Regardless of who get's an abortion, it is murder. Do you know that since sex ed has been taught in schools and contraceptive has been given out, teen pregnancy has tripled? It is not pp's responsibility to teach my girls about sex. I do not agree with it and know that by selling our girls "sex ed" they are also selling abortions as part of the package. The numbers indicate the same.<br />
<br />
Can you please check out the following link and tell me what you think? I would appreciate your imput on this...<br />
<br />
http://mttu.com/abort-pics/index.html

It's a little fringe for me. (how many socially and economically conservative republicans are also atheist and pro-life?) <br />
<br />
Even though I disagree with one of the major proposals of that site, namely that abolishing abortion is a good way to prevent abortions, I respect that he advocates peaceful means. The problem, of course, is that the pro-life movement is filled with far too many people who don't care if it takes violence. They are mostly religious zealots, and religious zealots are easily pushed to violent acts, such as Bill O'Reilly causing the death of Tiller the baby killer.

ok....I will. Did you check out that site?

That's a cop out. Fine then, google "Red sex Blue sex" and pick a website you don't disdain, and then read it. Then you can tell me why it's wrong and maybe even find a study from some conservative rightwing thinktank that 'debunks' it.

yeah right...like anything in the newyorker is worth my time.....except for the story on Michael Savage.

Sterotype much? How about keeping it simple and reviewing the facts.<br />
<br />
I am first off, not a "typical" anything. You may be a "typical" something or other but I am not.<br />
<br />
Since "sex education" has been introduced in our useless waste of a public school system, the # of abortions has TRIPLED, the # of teen pregnancies has TRIPLED. Coinsidence? The bottom line is that there is absolutely no form of birth control that is 100% effective, not one, so if you are taking the chance and having sex, you should be ready for the direct consequence of that sex....a baby.<br />
<br />
Do not decide AFTER the sex that you "are just not ready to bring a child into the world". That should have been considered before sex, since whatever method of bc being used is not 100% effective.<br />
<br />
So your #s are wrong, the exact opposite is true. You know, it's funny that you mention this. There is a new documentry out that people are trying to get into theaters, it talks about this exact issue. Former planned parenthood workers are interviewed and they speak about how much $$$ is raked in through abortions and they even admit to having goals and quotas. Their way of accomplishing this is through "sex education". You should watch the trailer on the site or go to youtube, it's called Blood Money. It is NOT PPs responsibility to teach our kids about sex, they will never get their bloody little hands on my girls, I'll tell ya that. That is mine and my husbands responsibility and we will fully assume it when it presents itself. Giving a girl bc pills and saying "don't have sex" is like giving a 13 year old a bong and a bag of weed and saying, "don't smoke it". Think about the logic here. Maybe if sex wasn't so glorified and abortion wasn't presented as the quick fix that it is, things would be different.<br />
<br />
As far as the welfare, I am NOT a republican, but I am however conservative and believe that welfare has it's place. It is supposed to be TEMPORARY. If a woman is faced with an unplanned pregnancy, she should of course be able to get government assistance until she is on her feet and able to support herself and her baby. I would much rather pay for that temporary care than pay for killing babies with my hard earned tax dollars.<br />
<br />
Please don't tell me that I support any policy that leads to more abortions, your facts are wrong and you have clearly bought the pp "sex education" lie. This is a straight up lie to produce more abortions and the #s say, it is working.<br />
I am not opposed to anything that allows a baby who wasn't planned to continue to live. I am opposed to taking 1 life in order to supposibly better another. <br />
<br />
Abortion is about 1 thing and that is money. It exploits women and kills innocent babies.<br />
<br />
I have stated this before, 50 million+ since 1973 is not "rare but safe" which is the sloagen that they parade themselves around with. This is a multi billion dollar industry. Make no mistake about that.<br />
<br />
So, I cannot speak for others and what they support, but I support life not death. I see abortion and that dirty industry for what it is. Simple as that.

I'll own up, if you'll do the same. Will you own up to the reality that people who are pro-life support policies which lead directly to more abortions? A typical pro-lifer (yes, I realize there are exceptions to every rule, but this doesn't mean there isn't a rule) is a good little Christian, and supports abstinence-only sex education, instead of comprehensive sex ed, which is typically supported by nasty left wing atheists. Abstinence only sex ed doesn't work, the only thing it does is breed ignorance of natural human sexuality. <br />
<br />
Which leads to more unplanned pregnancies, and hence, more abortions. <br />
<br />
A typical pro-lifer opposes easy access to birth control for teenagers, since they see this as a temptation which would promote more sex. Unfortunately, the typical pro-lifer is too dense to realize that having access to condoms doesn't promote more sex, the amount of teenage experimentation and sex is the same. The only difference is that the pro-lifers position ensures that the sex will be unsafe. <br />
<br />
Which leads to more unplanned pregnancies and hence more abortions. <br />
<br />
The typical pro-lifer is also a Republican, since that is the 'pro-life' political party. Republicans oppose all forms of social safety nets, such as government programs for single moms and low income individuals, and they also oppose universal healthcare. <br />
<br />
If a teenager becomes pregnant, one of the most obvious problems is the cost of having that baby. The typical pro-life Republican opposes all forms of welfare and aid available to single pregnant moms. If a pregnant teen can see that there's no way for her to have and properly care for a child because of a lack of resources and aid, there's a greater chance that she will not want the baby. <br />
<br />
Which leads to more abortions. <br />
<br />
What are your positions on these points? Are you a typical pro-lifer? IF SO, you should shut your pie hole, because that would mean you support policies which lead directly to more unplanned pregnancies and hence, more abortions.

It is very simple, you are either for or against murdering an unborn child. I'm not saying these abortions are "celebrated", I'm saying that this is what you reap when you have sown legalizing murder in all 9 months of pregnancy......what a wonderful "choice". I'm sorry, but since when are we allowed to murder and call it choice and get away with it? This is sick, and killing a baby in the first trimester is sick also. A life is a life.<br />
<br />
Every single method of abortion is sickening and brutal. NOBODY deserves to be sucked through a tube, ripped out limb by limb through "surgical procedures", or flushed down a toilet through a "medical abortion". If you all don't believe these victims are people, do some research on fetal development. Please do not argue that it isn't killing, instead stand up for your precious belief that it is OK to kill them since they have been dehumanized by our society and are not called "persons".<br />
<br />
Own up to your choice to support abortion for what it really is......own up.

Oh please... enough with the accusations that all people that are pro-choice are pro-abortion. As if pro-choice people celebrate every abortion.

Oh God forbid, they called the baby....."baby girl" Those bias bastards! They should have refered to her as an "it" or "fetus" would this have been unbias enough? Give me a break, the fact is this crazy wakjob murdered her baby and got off because well, murdering your baby IS technically legal in this country. <br />
<br />
All hail abortion, legal MURDER<br />
<br />
sick. I hope you pro-aborts are happy, this is a victory for your precious "choice".

I think I would totally reserve judgment until I read an account of this that was published in an unbiased source. I have a strong feeling that this newspaper is reporting ONLY what it wants to have us read -- not necessarily the facts at all! Doesn't it say something in itself that you could only find this reported in a biased source? Hmmmm... makes me wonder what REALLY happened.

that woman is not well.

In both cases, these children were able to live outside<br />
their mothers. Somebody would've been happy to adopt them. This was outright murder and they should've been punished. If they get away with it, others will think it okay to do it,too. There are plenty places for mothers who don't want their babies to receive help. Just because something's inconvenient at a particular time gives nobody the right to dispose of it like property. These are human beings.

I find the facts in this article appalling. While I grew up in a family that is pro-life, I tend to lean to the side of pro-choice. Another one of my rebellious moves in life in the eyes of my family. <br />
While I believe an expectant mother has the right to decide to carry or abort her unborn baby (I will never, however, use the term fetus), I also believe that if she decides to carry past three months, then she is also deciding to take full responsibility for the health and well being of that unborn child, considering there is the choice for adoption thereafter. <br />
Also, while I recognize that an expectant mothers state of mind and emotion can play havoc on her during, and after, her pregnancy, I do not believe those circumstances should be considered when an act so heinous is committed. <br />
If someone else kills her baby, they are charged with murder because, at that point in time, the baby is completely viable. The fact that a mother is capable of doing the same thing and not be charged the same way, and ordered some kind of punishment here on earth, disgusts me. The attorney in this case is nothing less than hypocritical and indirectly is now aiding other mothers ability to act in the same manner toward their viable unborn babies.

I don´t want her to be punished. I don´t know why she shot herself instead of making abortion - it is legal in US, after all - but I don´t want her to be punished, either.

Supposedly it would have been a violation of her "Civil Rights". I'm tired of all these mothers getting off for killing their babies ( not talking about abortions necessarily). How many mothers are getting off with "Temp Insanity"? Screw that, they knew what they were doing.

"abortions after fetal viability must be available if the woman's health or life are at risk; state governments can prohibit other abortions"<br />
<br />
So if this statement is tru... why was nothing done... IF the government wanted to they could have... they is out right "WRong" to be polite... If you put that gun in anyone elses hand... we would not need to have this conversations... I remember another story... think it was about the chick from iowa... who killed her kid after giving birth but since the baby was still attached to the umbilical cord "something happen, im thinkin she didnt get in much trouble" not sure I was young when I heard bout it... so I'll have to look that up to find out what happen... but its just crazy...

My perspective is that abortion should simply not be a means of birth control. If you wish to have sex, it is your responsibility to either prepare against or accept the consequences. However, I also acknowledge that I am lucky to be an intelligent, fairly well educated person with some maturity, which unfortunately is not a pre-requisite for becoming pregnant in our society. <br />
As we all know, stupid, young, irresponsible and mentally unstable people can get pregnant, and it isn't always their fault that they don't know a better way to live.<br />
In these cases, whilst the actions taken by the mothers and the father were despicable, it would seem to me to be desperate actions of people who could not by any means be called sane. I cannot imagine shooting myself to abort my child. These people are obviously not fit to be parents, of unborn or born children. They most certainly need mental help, before they need punishment.

Wow...just, wow.<br />
I mean....hell to be blunt, I'm pro-abortion with reason (most essentially pro-choice); but this falls far outside of reason.<br />
I mean, did she just not consider early-term abortion? Was it not circumstantially available to her at the time? <br />
<br />
What hell people cause themselves...and when her children grow up...I mean, personally speaking, if I found out my mother did this it'd really be a mind-job on my family mentality.<br />
<br />
On a slightly brighter note: This story kind of reminded me of a comedian's bit I recall:<br />
<br />
"We, as a people, are LAZY. We are at a focal point of laziness; we'll suffer for life as soon as 10 years down the road to eat all the daily baconaters with extra biggie fries and a frosty that we want now! I wonder...you know the laziest act to have ever occurred? And the sad part is, this has probably happened: Imagine, a woman, in college, slapping her alarm at 5am...she looks at the clock, notices the sun's not even really out yet, and ponders 'Ohhh damn, it's 5am...why am I getting up this early? Ohhhh yea, that's right, I'm getting an abortion today *yawn*...ah hell, I guess I'll just have the kid; goodbye college!' and turns back and goes to sleep!"

Should not have been protected*

I'm sorry killed the baby on her due date. A little too late to decide that she didn't want a third child. Anyways my point was that she didn't even get in trouble. Nothing. I live here in VA and I never heard once of a law created for it. That was not abortion and she should have been protected under abortion civil rights.

idispair, what is going on is that half of the country is retarded when it comes to the abortion debate. The people who want abortion outlawed support policies which fuel the demand for more abortions. <br />
<br />
Like I said: retards.

I would be looking at the structures of disadvantage that caused these two cases to take extreme measures to terminate a baby...<br />
Why could they not access proper healthcare choices....did they have the money for a legal termination......<br />
What the hell is going on with your health promotion/sex education programs in America??????<br />
Its always the woman that has to pay and is expected to take the full brunt of the law........<br />
cheers

She was not charged because abortion is legal. It would violate her civil rights. Yeah, I'm pro-choice up until you can see/hear the heartbeat. I've never heard of anything that is not considered alive and has a heartbeat, Except when it comes to a fetus/baby. I'm not a far right conservative or anything I just like to have common sense. heart beat = living

I'm pro-choice, but not after the first trimester. I think under this time fr<x>ame, women have ample opportunity to figure out what they're going to do. Just my opinion.<br />
<br />
In regards to the Tammy Skinner story, how is she not being charged with murder? The child was full term, so presumably, healthy. Are legal system is ****. Thank god I didn't become a probation officer like I had planned on.

Again personal responsibility right out the door