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A Letter From The Other Woman

You are the one he’s lived with for a very long time. I have known him for three years.
You are the one who wakes up to his familiar face each and every day and you give him a peck on the cheek. I gaze into his deep brown eyes and run my hands through his slightly graying dark hair as I passionately kiss him.
You are the one he hands the credit card on Saturday morning. He calls you Milady as you walk out the door for an afternoon of shopping. I meet him on Saturday afternoon. I handle every inch of his body in every way. He calls me a Goddess.
You are the one who was not in the mood. When we meet, we will urgently ***** or slowly disrobe each other depending on our mood.
You are the one who nags him about the Honey-Do List. I scream, “Honey do that again as his hands, fingers and tongue do everything I dream about.
I know if you saw me you would wonder what he saw in me. But deep down we both know it has nothing to do with my looks but everything to do with how I make him feel. For these few hours, I let him know he is the one!
Kelki Kelki 46-50, F 102 Responses Oct 12, 2011

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I so understand what your saying. I'm in the same situation right now.

I'm sorry to say this, but the majority of these letters I read have the "other woman" expressing something negative about herself or some type of insecurity while, at the same time she defends her right to love a married man. For example, you end your letter with "if you saw me you would wonder what he saw in me...deep down it has nothing to do with looks" That's kind of sad, because you should be saying, you have something to offer him and that you connect with him in a loving way. As long as you see yourself as "less than" in your eyes, how can you be "more than" in his eyes?

That's not necessarily true...I already connect with him in way she can't. I'm not better than she, just different. Fortunately, she is happy without sex....this may be her ideal marriage but as he says,"I had to do something!" I believe there is a special bond between two people whom get to feel intimacy again. My last statement was meant to put us at the same level just different paths.

i dont understand why folks dont understand. there is simply different needs and ways each need - that draws people to each other. most men begin affairs because another woman takes an interest in them, listens and cares - there is almost two different relationships with a wife and another woman - that both fulfill what he needs.

They also assume I believe I am superior to her....I honestly don't know her! I only know she doesn't want that part of him that I find totally irresistible. It works for both of us...He fulfills my needs too.

I agree.. I was once the wife now I'm the other woman

Hi there i would love to hear more on your thoughts about this....

Have you had an affair?

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So she is the one with the credit card and the one he goes home to everynight and your the girl he sneakes around with on the side. She is the one he will never leave and your the one who will always be the piece on the side. Boy you really showed her !!!

Wow! It's not a contest...she could have that part of him and would rather just have a credit card. We all do what makes our lives happier...

Do you feel the need to make the wife wrong? Why compete with her by comparing yourself, if you are happy with what you have? Don't make the wife the problem just because her husband is cheating. You don't know their true situation.

I think you missed point! I'm not comparing us personally... It's a comparison of people's priorities and the choices made...

Don't waste your time...She doesn't get it. Besides what you wrote there were so many other issues I thought would hit a cord with her and all of them failed miserably. It was my optimism in thinking that many are not as callous as they present themselves and only after some insight would see the error of their ways....NOT here. :(

Oh gosh,I certainly hope you find happiness soon! Your mission in life should not be to coerce others to see the error of their ways in this group. From what you told me...You have your own obstacles to overcome... Be happy!!

My reply was not meant towards you...as I have learned that my optimism does not apply to all. No worries. But just to clarify...My reasons for disputing with you oh so long ago- was NOT to coerce you into changing your life/actions (although I had hoped that would be one of the results), but to humanize the wife and all other wives out there and point out the callousness of your story and comments. Although I allowed my emotions to get the best of me at times...I'm sure it was not that difficult to decipher that my intention was to make YOU (and all "other women" out there) not feel so justified, comfortable and at ease with such a display of superiority and downright cruelty. Myself and others included, realize that in our attempts to do so..we acted as justified and cruel as you...My bad.

Well said. You have nothing.to.apoligise about. I understand the point you were making. Obviously the one you intended it for didn't.

Scagman...Please consider adding me to circle of friends or at least the ability to message you. Appreciate your honesty and intelligence.

I have read your other story about a sexless marrage. I am not saying to.accept that situation. If you decide to cheat.that is your business. There are so.many single guys out there that.would accommodate.you. Why backstab another married person who is supposibly miserable ? He hates his wife etc but action speaks louder than words. If you already have one man that does not value you why get a guy who will treat you as a piece on the side ? A single guy hurts no one and he can be your guy on the side.

And....once again...neither of you knows my entire story since I've never disclosed it on here. I wrote the above story in the form I did for the sake of helping others get a different perspective and not see the OW or OM as evil....

BTW, where did I say he hates his wife...

But yet you continue to interpret my story through your eyes only... I honestly have never considered his wife less than...I don't even want her life. I know the things that are important in her relationship she's getting...he's not! I'm not in mine either... People move on different paths in the journey of life... Frankly, I don't know everything about you...and you certainly cannot even begin to realize why I chose to spend time with him. However,I'm not going to block you or otherwise....because I believe you are an intelligent,interesting person whose life circumstances somehow compelled you to become judgemental... That's totally your right! But...since it's my story I will respond accordingly to my own perceptions...

I would expect nothing less from an adult. I have never threatened you in any way and although I believe you have the right to block me or anyone else for that matter, if you so wanted, for any reason- glad that you didn't. In closing (as a suspect you are tired of the back and forth), I will say that as much as anything that comes from my mouth is through my eyes...It is far more than personal experience provoking my words and opinions than you are willing to accept. Yes, "through my eyes" indeed, but as much if not more as a result of values in general than from personal experience. I say that with thought processes that precede whatever situation may have contributed to some of my passionate replies. Despite the fact that I am sure my mere acknowledgement of a personal connection is what you feel motivates my opinions and makes you feel that these are just words of a scorned partner. If that were the case...I wouldn't have offered the honesty I present...because as you said..This is not a contest...had it been, I would have presented a case I could win rather than a plea for others to see that common courtesy, decency and respect is far too important to reason away.

However,I'm not "her"! I'm a made up name on a website in a group dedicated to supporting Other Women in all different types of circumstances. I understand that this issue takes up a lot of space in your brain for some reason... I'm not assuming anything but I'm not looking for approval or your respect or a win.... just an interesting conversation on story which ,by all means, I meant to open doors of controversy on....It's a controversial subject! If you want to believe I'm not decent or respectful or respected or courteous then you could go to another group where everyone agrees with you...

Point taken. Clearly a topic for debate and NOT something I considered for a moment that you were looking for my approval-- Nor is my disapproval a point that was of utmost importance to me, but clearly a result of expressing my opinions. Truth be told, the manner in which you have replied has not been devoid of common courtesy or decency, despite my continued opinion that your story should have been written in a manner which expressed the decency you claim to and that I surmise you posses.

Soooooo...what is your intention?? All people whom chose affairs should be burned at the stake....All those contributing their stories to this experience are not decent and thus banned from EP.... For all I know,I might even have more in common with his wife than just her husband... Life is complex...

Absolutely not...Have I actually been that vague as to suggest so??? I have blocked or deleted few (if any) and surely NOT as a result of a difference in opinion...no matter how steadfast they have presented themselves. Surprisingly, I find it difficult with all that has already been said, to summarize and reply to this last question other than to say that expressing ones opinion is NOT reason enough to ban or block...at least by my standards. Life is complex and often times decent people present opinions and express themselves in manners that contradict what others (including myself-on both ends of the spectrum) would consider decent and kind. What else can I say without reiterating words already spoken other than to say that I feel that your original story (at the least) was expressed in a manner devoid of the decent qualities I think a fellow woman and/or spouse would have expressed had they accepted the fact that they may have been basing their opinion on the load that was presented to them by the deceitful man as much as all of us may have been basing our opinions upon either what we thought or influenced by our personal situation.

For all you know we may be in open marriages... I,however,love evoking emotional responses from people! I am always surprised how each person who reads and comments has such strong reactions... and interprets it differently. I argue that there are simply not two ends of the spectrum but just a lot in between...

It has been a while since I was in the midst of the "back and forth" of the story and as such can only base my retort upon what little or recent I have read, but based on that, say that it seems to be an "either/or" situation and matter of opinion. Open marriages are only truly "open marriages" when ALL participants are in agreement and accepting of the terms of the "open marriage".... Not what I gathered from your original story and something I referred to in one of my long ago comments that was not addressed as such then. In addition, I think that the mere expression of words (even under that sort of agreement) that YOU expressed was NOT done in a manner that expressed the respect and decency you strive to prove that you have and very may well have...but your expression did NOT.

I still don't understand what your interest in this story is... or your intention for continuing to respond.... You have already remarked my opinions and actions are indecent. As for the way I expressed myself in the story...C'mon I know it gets attention for the last 3 years because of the way it's written. If I wrote it without comparing the two extremes no one would continue to read it... It doesn't even matter if it's true...I wrote from an unpopular perspective so thus it seems I should be attacked. My goal is simply to help people think about the relationships they are in... married or single... I hope everyone has a someone to fulfill them in all the ways I mentioned.

My interest in the story??? It is obvious or so I thought. Unfortunately what is obvious has been replaced for MY sole reason and purpose AND of YOURS and OTHERS justification and acceptance of what should NOT. I am well aware of the attention you received (more than any other story I have read) but cannot fathom a situation where I would place myself in a position to provoke thought processes at the expense of complete honesty and a truthful expression of my true self. Regardless of whether the story was true and if YOU were/are the other woman...I still have a problem with what you said. Read it again...Can you really not see the callousness in which you provoked this debate? Would it had had that much less of a response had you said in a less demeaning way or added a line or two about how it may be as simple as the relationship between you and him being nothing more than something devious or new that taps into his need for adventure, but not necessarily that you provided something that she was unwilling or incapable of? The fact that you couldn't entertain all the possibilities that don't make you look like his savior is obnoxious and conceited.

You know I've been replying to comments such as yours for years now... You're not saying anything new! I still wonder why you keep harping on my story... So your answer is NO! I'm not a malicious other woman...there's no callousness intended. It's about what you read into it... I never used words like savior... He fulfills a need! We fulfill each other's needs. After nearly 7 years in this affair we adore each other. If we are conceited and obnoxious so be it...but trust me...after this long it's much more than just a thrill for us. We understand,care for and love each other... In case you haven't noticed this is the internet... full of opportunities for thought provoking debates. I enjoy making people such as yourself squirm....

Squirm I am not and have not. That is something I reserve for and rarely occurs for anyone other than my husband. Forgive my naivete in thinking that your story was real and honest and that your expression of otherwise is merely an attempt to mitigate your culpability. Your selfishness is clear and seen by all those that are NOT in the same situation as you voluntarily have put yourself into. Thought provoking indeed, as well as obnoxious, selfish, cruel and self-righteous..to say the least. Forgive me for or I forgive myself for continuing to react to your provoking dialogue...as intended. Job well done but pathetic as well.

Please feel free to obsess over this story! May it haunt you for a long time to come! As for disclosing anything of a personal nature...on a website that reeks of trolls,armchair psychologists and doomsayers... you've got to be kidding! The story is written as such for a reason...

I'm curious why the only replies you continue to respond to are the ones that express their dislike, disappointment and anger towards you and the wording of the story and/or the knowledge of your actions chosen (being the other woman). I enjoy expressing my opinion and reading the replies of the poster and others as much. Often times people misinterpret others words and my own, so I entertain the idea that I can enlighten others as they can enlighten me. I'm not obsessing over your story and if not for the recent notification that someone new had responded to your story; I wouldn't have responded. Keep in mind that I was merely trying to make connections with like-minded people and I thought referring to my experience responding to you way back then and my opinion that his response was falling on deaf ears... thought it was a great place to start. I am not a troll, armchair psychologist nor a doomsayer but a women who tries not to be judgmental unless I feel strongly that I am not merely standing in judgment of a difference in opinion, but of the basic lack of traits like honesty, respect, kindness and empathy and the expression of traits like conceit, arrogance, narcissism and selfishness. Your story will not haunt me but unfortunately does reassure me that some are too proud to admit the error of your ways...and that is not limited to the actions you have chosen but includes the callousness in which you stand behind them and use others and their reason for disagreeing as cause to disregard any valuable insight you could gain if you stopped for a moment and actually saw the whole picture.

Ohhh! So you are trying to enlighten me... by telling me I'm narcissistic and selfish based on a story written in a form like this...It's written purposely to get people to think about their relationships, married or not... Error of my ways... You just don't agree with my ways. If you continue to choose to reply, IMO, (and a others will agree) that is obsession and it definitely looks and smells like a troll. Don't consider that an invitation to reply! But I choose to reply to everyone who posts on MY STORY!

I applaud you for reading this entire post, its been here since 2011. Many of the people whom I don't reply to are my EP friends...we communicate via personal messages. They heart my comments <3

I heart most of your comments, simply cause you are the one making them.

Thanks Adorably...you're a sweetheart!!

Birds of a feather. Happy for you both.

Not to rain on your parade with facts or anything but you might want to look up me and my story before saying anything about me. I am not married, divorced in fact, and my affair with a married man ended more than 3 years ago. I deeply regret my own actions but don't have enough hubris to think I understand or know enough about anyone else's life experiences in order to judge them. I made what turned out to be really bad decisions, but I am me, not anyone else and don't feel I can speak for or on behalf of anyone else. I certainly can't lump anyone together arbitrarily to further my own angry agenda.

She's also the one who dont have to deal with him..n when she gets tired of him..she can simply send him on his way

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As someone who has been on both sides of this, the cheated and the cheater, I have mixed feelings about it. I understand why you feel so triumphant over his wife and yet unless you were in her shoes you truly don't know why their relationship is bad. It's easy to be the one he leans on and tells his troubles to and fulfills his fantasies when you are not in a living together situation. I know the feeling of loving someone so much and not understanding how the other woman (for you, that is his wife or S/O) fails to see and appreciate what she has. But you don't really know, do you? You are ready to believe anything he tells you. But I'm sure there's another side to it.

But I don't mean to be harsh or judgmental. Far from it. I have, as I said earlier, been on both sides of the fence. Sadly, it isn't easy to love another person for a lifetime and some of us were never meant to be together, and others change and grow apart from each other. We have to cherish what we have and remember what we loved in each other to keep love alive. It's not always easy in real life vs dating or affairs. Affairs rekindle the spark of what it was to feel loved completely and adored and most important of all desired. I think that is what compels people to cheat even though they may still love the person they are with. It could happen to you, so I guess what I am saying is, don't gloat over it!

I suggest you read my replies to others on this story before commenting any more. This is far from gloating...it is more of about people whom are at different places in life.

Wow you girls sound like fun I wish i could use my hand my tongue and fingers I bet you smell good, Cheating is fun as long as your doing the cheating.

You are in your late 50s and you view women in that way? Are you not ashamed of yourself?

Today I told him he was my Roarrrrr! My man my lover my all.. what does he see in me he sees a reflection of him self.. he sees how he deserves he needs to feel.. he sees what it is to be wanted, cherished and adored.. today he feels like the king he is suppose to be... Roarrrr!!

This is very true. how you make him feel - Like a vital man again

The roarrrr is only getting better.. I might have to say meow soon lol

U ought to c about getting it published in Cosmo or somewhere ;)

Really! Do you think it's that good?

Definitely

Wow! Nicely written:) I do like your writings!:)

Thank you Bella!

the biggest reason of cheating is not for sex - its for human contact and communication.. so, while you may make him feel that way - maybe he shut his wife out, or she shut him out - but sex is usually the last part of the affair, being made to feel special and feeling like someone cares, is how it starts. Who knows, maybe he shut her out and for the last 3 years, the yard guy has been taking care of the wife's needs.

I did notice that the emotional effect sex had on him was more powerful than the psysical act. I dont know what he thought about me but I know he wanted me to love him. My opinion on his work was important to him too. Im sure if it really was about the act he would have visited a prostitute for 5 minutes.

you shouldn't be so proud of yourself ... find your own man

You know what? You do not know my story. You have no intention of providing any sort of support or useful advice so please do not comment on my posts. I wrote this to help people reflect on their own relationships which happen to include marriage.

I like this answer :) I totally understand what u mean :) it is an awesome post :)

Here we go again

Yes, sometimes that is the case

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She was the other woman and I was the other man. It was so good while it lasted. It reminded me that; Yes, I am alive.

Yeah mine reminded me that i was still alive too..

I am the other woman too so I can totally relate 2 this post :) I agree w/what Idylvr wrote in his comment :) this is beautifully written & 100% true :D we r not bad women just b cuz we r w/married men ;) if the wives paid attention 2 their husbands desires/fantasies/needs they wouldn't feel the need 2 look for another woman :) ur husbands get bored & lonely when u neglect them :( make ur husband ur first priority in life :) he should be #1 on ur "Honey-Do List"

Thank you. I wish my wife would actually pay any attention to me other than to ask for money or nag. I try very hard to provide for her and the kids. We are not rich, but we are not destitute. I guess I\'m just not good enough for her any more.

Zaap...I know. I was in the same shoes. She just *Gave up!* . I sure as Hell tried to make things right.

Thanks, mate. It's nice to know I'm not the only one who feels that way.

Beautifully written Kelki, if the wife had given him the attention, love and affection he needs he would not be lingering with someone else for an afternoon of nurturing.

I love it when someone gets this story!! I wanted the post to spark controversy and help couples think about becoming more like another woman or another man. Thank you Idylvr!

What about being willing to accept the love and affection he needs to be able to give? There are guys out there who need to have an opportunity to be affectionate. I'm not talking about sex here. I'm just talking about holding hands or cuddling or a hug or something. Some physical contact other than pushing me to the other side of the bed when I'm already asleep because she wants more room than just half of the bed.

I've read the comments on this story and so many people are so QUICK to call the OW a home wrecker, and their husbands are liars to the OW, blah blah blah. LOL guess what? The OW isn't having sex by herself. Your husbands are enjoying themselves with the person that THEY have decided to have an affair with and yes they lie to their wives continuously in order to maintain their affair. The wives club think they have an upper hand and claim the OW is second best when in reality, the wives are also, only second best.

If you had read my comments or my story, you would know that I don't judge a lot. And I 'm not the "upper class", but I really prefer single men. For many different reasons. And maybe you want to read al hear stories and make your own view. Braging about swallowing, etc... - my good ???? What kind of skill is that? Is it ( to her) precondition for keeping a husband, or what.....?And I really try to understand........And to kelki - yes, I still have a spouse...I just dont want rude people.

I can barely decipher this response... Are you talking to me,about me, or slamming my sexual preferences. Please proofread to make your responses more readable.

There are people who are more liberal and some more conservative. I do have fun talking about sex with other adults on an anonymous site. I do not think that is inappropriate. I also write about how much I love chocolate.... Sweetie, if you believe it is rude to talk about sexual topics, you can enable a block so you are not exposed. Is that your complaint?

It looks like the author of this article gets a lot of your attention. This is exactly what she want's - as all unhappy people.

Actually, I see the postings of controversial stories such as the above - and throught EP - are not for attention seeking, but more for a fertile ground for sparking spirited discussions. If you think that people who post articles on controversial topics are only doing so to seek attention, then ANY author of ANY controversial topic (abortion, religion, global warming, politics, poverty, racism, etc.) in any venue would be deemed as "attention seeking" by your statement. And that the authors are all unhappy.

Hey KK,
You can write to me directly, I can take it. Trust me.... I am not unhappy for one second of my life.

Of course I am.

I am a married woman, to a man that is as superficially aroused as I suspect yours is. He loves me, as I suspect he loves his wife. He supports me, as I suspect he does for his wife. He has chosen me to bear his children, which I suspect he has done or be more desirable in doing, with his wife. Our conversations vary from finances and work, to family and bodily functions, I suspect yours is limited to the superficial, sexual or any other issue that makes you think that you are important to him, so he can get his rocks off next Saturday. You are both selfish and superficial AND from how you expressed yourself here....ALSO, callous and egotistical. Oh did I mention he's doing your neighbor too?

You couldn't be more wrong. I'm sad for you.

Fetish,
You seem to suspect a lot. Your post suggests your husband has found someone to satisfy him in a way you won't....

My relationship is troubled, Yes...and I failed miserably at my attempt to mimic the writing style of the story. It was confusing, to say the least...Granted. I made a mistake in thinking I had the skill and finesse to
articulate the same amount of indignities upon the "other woman" that was expelled towards the "wife" in the story. The story was nothing less than an arrogant display of insensitivity and cruelty and was deserving of the same in return. As far as the specifics of my claims...I suspected alot...as did the writer (Highly doubtful that she (OW) is privy to every and all interactions between him (MM) and his wife). If no one is to call the "other woman" out about her assumptions/beliefs, than don't make it an issue when I express mine. I also truly believe that if a man looks elsewhere for MORE than just sex, and finds it....He would leave his wife and we wouldn't be having this discussion. (Even if the "other woman" didn't want him to). The mere fact that he knows that ALL his needs CAN actually be met elsewhere by someone else, is the kick in the *** he needs to convince himself to leave. The fact that many of you are unwilling to accept that it is dishonest, uncaring and selfish to consider hooking up with a married man/woman is the fundamental problem. You can say..."the heart wants, what the heart wants", but you try like hell to squash those feelings and if you cannot...You certainly don't belittle the spouse and boast about it proudly. Don't bother arguing that point!

Well-said. I dashed here as I thought they were gang banging you. She assumes your husband is dissatisfied and has found a mistress. That is amusing. Considering the quality of women who are mistresses here presently. Forget trying to discuss this further. Let them borrow others. Cause in the end, they still end up alone. And that is sad because they could have someone full-time. Second place is never satisfying. But again they settle. Settle in their marriages, and with other's men. Tragic...She boasts on what? Nothing really. Cause it is nothing.

Wow. How very insulting of you PNE. You dashed here to be mean. Interesting. Sigh. I just don't get people like you and that person who you felt needing rescuing and back up for this conversation. And what do you mean "quality of woman". Things happen in life. A relationship takes two people at least so I'm not sure why you're not mentioning the cheating husband. Who cares if this woman is having an affair and wants to write about it? Why do people like you feel the need to attack? I find it so odd. You legit go out of your way to be complete @ssholes. It's weird. And creepy. Just saying.

PoetryNEmotion ...well now, the quality of a posting like yours is highly in question.

Did you even "read" this story. She (the wife) could have this man; she chose other activities. Her choices have consequences.... just like his affair may. People have the right to make their own choices. That is the point of this story. I did not call her names or downgrade her choice; thus should any of you be judging him?

-----"Cause in the end, they still end up alone."

I find this statement to be quite interesting and seems to be one of the highlights that is so often pushed, used as a threat to those who find themselves in these situation. Setting aside the story for a moment and all the moral outrage that these discussions invoke - the idea that having a man "full time" is any guarantee that you won't be alone later on in life, appears to me, to be quite naive. As one ages in life and takes a look around at older female relative, friends and co-workers - one finds that, generally speaking - the majority of women END UP ALONE anyway - relative to the male populations - no matter the relationship choices they make in life. Death and divorce are reality, and, in the end - if you get sick anyway the caregiving, more often than not, is not going to come from your husband - it is going to come from female relatives or friends. Husbands bail, get sick or die. They are often older (mine is 11 years older than me) and simply aren't going to be around or interested in caregiving. From a macroview - to ignore this reality and pin everything on the man "so you won't be alone" might not be good policy either. In the end we ALL end up alone, and we all die alone - so using the old, worn tactic of the threat of social isolation (you will end up old an alone you harlot!) as a way to browbeat people into not getting into these situations is useless. Women, more likely than not, end up alone anyway so may as well build your networks with that reality in mind earlier in life than later. IF you are fortunate to live past age 85 there will be twice as many women alive than men, so yes, being alone (if one insists on defining being alone as having no man around), as a woman, is the reality for the future of many of us.

Emotions are not often easily contained. Add to that the frustration of having to explain to some that the right to live your own life should not include making it more difficult upon others to live theirs...even if only a fraction of a percent and where difficulties existed prior and we often resort to idle and insignificant threats or comments. I don't think the contempt I feel, is or should be, the reaction of ONLY women that are in relationships where this occurred/suspected or where trouble already exists. It ought to be what I believe IT IS... an unspoken rule amongst empathetic women, based upon mutual respect and selflessness. It is human nature to mask guilt with attempts to justify one's actions to oneself, but have respect for your "sisters" NOT to lose sight of, or try to convince others that it is someone else-s fault and that actions like that can change from being cruel and insensitive to being deserved and acceptable. I also do not agree with every aspect of the few that have expressed their opposition to the story...As I have. I understand what you are saying, but to me, it made no difference that I didn't share the "end up alone in the end" aspect of others' opinions, but agree fully that we all end up alone.

Fetish, you have an interesting POV on this story. I am sorry you got confused. However, let me repeat my motivation for writing it. It honestly was not to be selfish or callous;however, depending on your present situation you could view it that way. All the people involved want to be loved and desired.

What if this woman really does feel totally loved with the unlimited credit line? Is she callous because her husband should supply her with that need? Maybe......

What if the MM did wait well over 20 years to actually have intercourse for more than just reproduction? Is his need less than his wife's need to spend $$$? Maybe. According to the way society views it, it is.....

I simply did a comparison to get people to think about how we tend to place blame on the other woman, the married man or the wife...but in reality, it all becomes rather irrelevant.

People are going to get what they need; no matter what ;at some point. That is human nature. The right or wrong of it is how society translates it.

I wasn't commenting on "the group"- just the original story and subsequent responses...and if one desires "solace" than one should present it in a manner that expresses the distress or sadness felt that is in need of comfort. What IS Insulting is you are so preoccupied and concerned with being surrounded by people that will tell you what you want to hear that you have lost sight of understanding other women s views on the subject. "Hooking up with married people" or "married people hooking up"...In my world, they are say same thing! Married people "hook up" for various reasons and THEY SHOULDN'T. Legally separate or divorce and then do whatever floats your boat. No one need to be in a loveless or sexless marriage, but if you are married or the other person is...It should be considered OFF LIMITS.

Each person in this group has their own stories, live their own lives in their own worlds, just like you. Every person has a valid reason for making that choice at this time.

I understand your need to feel loved in a sexless marriage but is your choice to also leave.....just as I have the choice to stay in my marriage and engage in a parallel relationship.

Once again, I have no ill will against his wife; whatsoever, she makes her own choices too.....and I described that in the post. I did not call her choice wrong or stupid, it is simply different than mine.

Thank you for making this a respectable discussion! Please know I wrote this in a lyrical way to promote discussion not change minds.

I am trying so hard to be nice...I was in the midst of replying to your last comment (addressed to me, 13 hrs. ago) when I stopped to reply to the ignoramus that claimed I was being insensitive to people looking for solace. Surprised and disappointment to read your "dig" regarding your assumption that I am in need of feeling loved in a sexless marriage.- and that is what is motivating me to have such strong feelings. You will NEVER know me and despite me having my concerns or disappointments in my 25 year marriage and 28 yr old relationship, you are clueless. I'm gonna pretend you didn't say that and finish my reply from earlier.

I apologize Fetish... I did make an assumption based on my own marriage experiences. Trust me; my marriage is challenging too; which is part of the reason I have another relationship. Life has a way of causing chaos and we all react in the way we feel is right.

Allow me to say that I appreciate the fact that you didn't just read 1 or 2 of my responses and figured it or I wasn't worth commenting and explaining further. I find that a sign of character. Unfortunately though, other than your explanation regarding your intentions behind writing the story...Nothing else is relevant to my opinion. What did I say that gave you the impression that if she (wife) is content or feels “completely loved”, as you put it, that it makes it an acceptable choice? Call her up and allow her the opportunity and choice of telling you if she thinks that’s ok. Better yet, e-mail her your story. What about your spouse? If you ALL(people involved/affected by this dual relationship) find that acceptable, then great for you. I wish you all the best that life has to offer. I am not a right fighter or concerned with passing judgment upon informed decisions that consenting adults make…unless it affects people that have no say in the matter. For your information, when I say “…have a say in the matter” I am not referring to your example of how she (wife) could have this man if only she did things differently, I am referring to verbally expressing their acceptance of her husbands actions and feelings and yours. I also would expect nothing less of a decent man, not succumb to those desire without attempting to fix the problems that exist, but still don’t understand why it is considered a acceptable solution. Those opinions are what I consider to be the LEAST I would expect and that I believe others should demand under those circumstances. Otherwise my comments would have been far more biting than what I expressed. Regarding your comment about sex for something other than reproduction...I'm baffled. Why would one, start a family, by choice, with someone he had basically no desire, connection with or interest in, when he knows that would make it that much more of a difficult decision, for him to be a real man and leave? I'm trying NOT to be really rude, but your explanations do not make sense to me. Divorce is common, too common for many; However, it seems contradictory to be steadfast against that, but not infidelity. To me, infidelity is far worse an action than realizing you made a mistake and with the utmost respect, remedying that. The reason your comparison is cruel is because you think it justifies you being the OW, and both of you being unfaithful to the people that you vowed to honor and cherish, in good times and bad. What is so wrong about getting what you want by means that are accepted by each and every person involved and not just a few of them. It is clear there are 4 significant players in your game, despite knowing the children and extended families would rather another course of action had been taken, NOT just 2. I am usually tolerant of people who's opinions I differ from...But yours involves others that may not be willing participants and as such, gives other women out their the impression that if they and the MM can pull it off, than it is ok. If you want to have sex and emotional connection with another person...File for divorce. Period! If you have a strong desire for money and recognition, don't accept a job that pays poorly, shows no appreciation, then steal from them and blame them for not paying you enough money or respect. Regardless of whether they deserve that, it doesn’t make it RIGHT. I guess the same attention should be given addressing what is needed by employers AND spouses. I could give you more personal examples of actual situations that provide as proof that I am speaking from the heart, but am reluctant as it is evident that publicly being honest and vulnerable results in caddy remarks. I don’t know if your most recent apology was genuine, but I accept it as such. Feel free to private message me and I would gladly give you insight with genuine truth about instances where I could have taken that route but didn’t. Best of luck to you.

We all have our own reasons for why we make the choices we do. I have told a few of my situation; I do not post it in my stories. I like my privacy.

I still feel you have misinterpreted this story. It is about finding passion because it is important despite obstacles. I want marriages to work but it depends on how that is defined. It's really up to those involved; and you honestly do not know if how or if our spouses were informed. In some marriages, sex is simply not a priority or is even present.

@Fetish, off topic but what is your Fetish exactly?

None really...as the definition suggests. Nobody questioned it for the first year or so as a member...now everybody thinks I do. I feel bad, but don\'t want to change it now.

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You do not understand my situation at all! I am not waiting for him to leave his marriage. We both have responsibilities in our marriages that cannot be ignored.

In fact; you misunderstood the message of this post... If spouses acted more like an affair partner; our marriages would be more fulfilling. She obviously does not desire the parts of him that I do. My husband adores me but for totally different reasons. That is my choice,my reality,my life.

We are both consenting adults. I am just as capable of using him. I get so tired of the stupid double standard!

Why do you assume the woman is the one that waits? Is that what you do? Are you looking for Prince Charming on a lame website?

The man I sleep with is living, breathing and passionate. He is not some fantasy on EP........ Get a clue...

yes, he is living using you. and he belongs to another woman. tsk, tsk. neither a borrower nor a lender be. spouses are not affair partners. they are marriage partners who exchanged vows. does your spouse know of your married lover? I doubt it. we don't need clues. we have reality and the truth. and you have nothing but sex with a married man.

P&amp;E,
I actually have many males in my life. There are three I have had contact with today. One I have lived with for over 20 years, one I have as a affair. partner, and one is of the canine species. There is only one that I own......

I don't understand your need to own another human being.

By the way, your reality is a little warped.... an online lover is a fantasy. He can make you believe he is anything you want him to be.... He could even be MARRIED!

*the husband belongs to the wife*? The mind boggles. I do not own my wife. She does not own me. The age of slavery is over, at least in most countries, most cultures.
Yet, my wife did actually take me for granted in that fashion for some years. I let her know, in no uncertain terms, that that kind of attitude, that kind of behaviour was not acceptable.

If my wife wants to go out and do whatever with whomsoever she desires, be it quilting or be it drag racing or be it snogging, then that is what she can and will do. She will not "belong" to me any more or any less regardless, because she doesn't in the first place.

And all I can say is, if she showed attitudes like you're displaying, P_N_E, then I'd probably tell her to pack her bags. I find your ideas about ethics and relationships quaint to say the least, and I certainly would not have any room in my life for them.
You may choose to live your life howsoever you want, but to call other people names on the basis of how you imagine your life, that is ... shall we say uneducated at best.

P&amp;E, Do you truly understand why we have pointed out the name calling? You state; "You are second best", "You are borrowed" etc... Do you really feel you have the power to place labels on people based on an action they write about on EP?

No one has a problem with your POV. But I become defensive and angry when someone decides I am selfish, callous, flawed based on how they interpret my story.

Now I am going keep pointing this out and I will always implore friends to help me. If this is a problem; you may choose to not comment on my stories......

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Sorry...But you are the one who is not married to him.....
You are the one who waits for him to reach to you...
You may have him for a moment, but she has him forever...
Do you ever get tired of being number two?
Cause he remains married. I am honest. And you are fooling yourself.

he is married. what are the odds he will leave his wife? zero. three years now!
she is second best. ask him! he has his wife and sex on the side. he is the winner in this! don't kid yourself...

she posted mocking this man's wife. Kelkie is foolish. and therefore your defense of her wrongdoings is lame. vows mean something. she is unhappily married but lacks self-love to leave. more excuses. from him and her. pitiful really. that is all. I have nothing else to say. bye.

harrie, I do not believe PE knows any better. She is looking for true love on EP. I would rather be having a meaningful relationship with a real man than profess my undying love to some male I have never laid eyes on.

Prince Charming online can pretty much tell her 10 times more lies than my 5 year AP. In my opinion, her choices are sad, pitiful and desperate.

Poetry: Looking at the relatively high divorce rates in Western countries divorce happens to a lot of people. To include the ones whom post on here - so I would - taking into context divorce statistics and remarriage rates - never say this: "what are the odds he will leave his wife? zero". They certainly are not zero or anywhere near zero.

at least the man I love is free on-line. not borrowed. your borrowed man and you live a lie. your choice is like you. again pitiful. desperate. sad. I use your words as they are you. flawed. terribly. and alone in the end. at least I would give an available man a chance. you give nothing. get nothing,. you are really a poor desperate woman. I have had enough of you and your foolish friends. go back to borrowed. cause no real man wants you.

Yuck. You are not a very nice person. Why do you care if someone you DON'T EVEN KNOW is having an affair??? It's WEIRD. You don't think so?

-----"and alone in the end". Sad how you define being alone as not having a man as your property. Nothing else seems to count in your eyes (as per your comments) except the man with the highest priority being "not ending up alone". People have families, friends, coworkers and a host of others to fill their lives - and if they find that their relationship choices have not fulfilled their romantic fantasies (and those choices often do not as all relationships end - either through death or divorce) they have a wealth of other support to. Some of us even have husbands that are not borrowed. If your love is on-line I certainly wish you the best in fulfilling your romantic vision and that you escape your own version of that dreaded fate of "ending up alone".

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Wow I have read through every response here. I think being the OW is out of line. Y would u do something to hurt a family? While u r out playing a little kitty cat, the wife is at home bathing the kids, preparing dinner and looking for a romantic movie to put after the kids r asleep. The life of a wife and a mother never ends, the husband needs to be less selfish and play his role as a husband and father. For u or any person to entertain the idea if mistresses is outragouse. U may not realize the pain u cause bc u r too busy trying to pleasure yourself. R there really not enough men in the world?

Sweetpea, I read your posts and your husband is a serial cheater. Your marriage is in trouble. My circumstance is so different. My affair partner has children your age. We are both in sexless marriages and have been for years. Our spouses are happy with their lives without passion, we are not.

I think @sadworldwelivein has low self esteem seeing as she is commenting on all our stories and she is not the OW &amp; her husband cheated on her and when someone questions the reality of it all she blocks them.. hmmm think before you speak/write. stick to your \"my husband cheated on me\" forums.

Sadworld, Let\'s get something straight. I will not tolerate your name-calling. Many of the women who have commented on this post are strong and supportive to all the past and present other women. We, often, do not even agree.

But it is wrong to come here to basically troll a story in which you are totally unable to show any empathy toward. In fact, like Harrie, I wonder what your motivation is....except to demonstrate some sort of imagined superiority.

Please find a group of wives whom have or had cheating husbands. I am sure they will understand you. Us\"******\" really do not deserve or desire your advice.

I married the wrong woman.

Yea! I understand,I married the wrong man too. He makes me laugh,we respect each other but....I crave the passion from from this another man. I cannot get enough simultaneous *******.

that letter is awesum...sums up my feeling for sure....xoxo

You could be describing everything I did for my lover, even the resentment I felt that in the end he didn't chose me the way I chose him.

I hope you realize that this is no usually the case. I am the wife. I love my husband, passionately. We make love for hours, look deeply into each other's eyes many, many times a day. And yes, we tear each other's clothes off. But it can't be planned, it has to be spontaneous. And yes, when you have a house full of children that gets less and less often. But it is still just as delicious. Maybe more so because this is the person that held your hand and cheered you on while you gave birth to his child. This is the man you watch changing diapers, the man that tells you you can overcome whatever obstacle you are facing when you are down. This is the man that will drop what he is doing to come home to you and your children-because you are his wife. He had other women come into his life, but he chose one to spend the rest of his life with. This wasn't arranged. This wasn't a quick decision. He married the woman he loved above all the others. He married the woman that he wanted to stand beside him in front of family, friends and God as his partner.

As the wife, you are number 1. As the mistress you are much further down the list. Yes, you make him feel desired. Yes he makes you feel the same. But it is based on fantasy. It is so much more difficult to maintain those feelings when you do have "lists" of things to do to maintain your life. It is not all fun and games. It is work. It is a partnership. It is intimate, it is dirty, it is challenging, it is REAL.

Don't settle for being number two. Don't believe the married man's words. He is lying. The wife is not a shrew that won't have sex. My husband would have make love with me then go have sex with the girl at work. He would tell her he would leave me while building his dream garage in our house. He would tell her he wanted to fill her up with his babies, but I was holding his hand and putting ice on his vasectomy.

A relationship with a married man is doomed. It is based on secrets, lies. He is being selfish and reckless. He is unlikely to leave and he Is unlikely to be able to give you the time, attention and honesty you should demand from a partner.

And it is really bad karma. You don't want to be the wife that learns the man she loves so much is betraying her. It is the worst pain you can imagine. And it is never ending.

Well I am very happy you live a cookie cutter life... If you had read farther down this post you would know I am also married. By all standards,it looks like my life is all sunshine and roses too. However, perceptions are deceiving, my lover and I live in sexless marriages,we give each other what our spouses can't or won't. I understand his situation ,he understands mine and neither one of us has ever considered leaving our marriages. You see ,sometimes relationships evolve for other reasons and I know in your Christian view of the world there is only marriage but ,in my opinion, that is narrow minded and judgmental. Life is simply too short to worry about how others live their lives. I intend to enjoy mine.

Guess putting her life down makes you feel a tad better. Cookie cutter life? Isn't that what you are doing? If you and your passionate lover can't get enough of each other, why not leave your spouses and be with each other? Oh, because all it is dirty sex... He wont leave his wife because in the end, you are just an open pair of legs and he is a man who will respond. I am a man who has seen it all, and in the end the other woman gets screwed (literally)

I'm surprised that you don't seem to have any guilt. I couldn't handle the guilt. We were the same. We didn't want the other to leave their families. But he is like you. Wanted me to be there no matter what. He didn't care if we were busted. But I would not want to be vilified by everyone so I left. It was the hardest thing I've ever had to do. I love him. Very much. Our time together was not all about sex. But there were so many factors that happened between us. But the scariest is that someone found out that works with me.

Once one lives for years (or decades) in a sexless marriage, there is nothing to be sexually true to. There is no spousal sexual relationship remaining, so if the spouse does end up coloring outside the marital intimate lines, there, oftentimes, is little to no guilt because the relationship is based on social and legal standing, mostly a shell with no spiritual intimate center.

Yet a sense of responsibility remains...to my husband,our families,our friends. I still consider my husband my best friend,he is simply not my lover. In fact I considered divorce long before I had even thought about a lover.... Nothing can compare to the relationship I have with the lover but I do not have any desire for his or my relationship with our spouses to change.
I often wonder if I was the spouse not into sex if I would mind if my spouse had the affair....I believe I would accept it as what he needs to stay sane and centered.

Kelki: I get the sense from reading your stories that you do fulfill all your husband's needs. He does not need intimate interaction within the context of your marriage. Mine does not either. Folks who have never lived that scenario can not possibly begin to understand these dyfunctional sexless dynamics. My husband and I live as strictly nonsexual roomates and responsible financial partners - he has no need for intimate interaction so there is, literally, no sexual bond to be true to from the beginning of the marriage. He has no sexual jealously that I am aware of. Three years ago (after four years of me trying to build intimacy) I told him that I would no longer live without intimacy- I dropped the rules of sexual fidelity - for BOTH of us. I would no longer labor under those rules as I did not marry to be chaste. This gave him the opportunity to either 1. work with me to fix the sexless marriage 2. accept that I was going to get my needs met elsewhere or 3. divorce. He accepted option 2 and we have live a very high quality of life. I totally get where you are coming from. I sleep well at night and feel no guilt, as my husband is absolutely complicit in the dynamics. I read that you and your husband add tremendous value to each other's lives even if you are not sexual.

Thank you mvcmvc! I never thought I would even consider the option I chose. But...it works for now.

And if, from a macroview, folks are going to spread the blame around - we can go as far as this: if the OW gets busted by her lovers wife - I recommend she give the scorned wife her husband's telephone number - tell her to ask him WHY he refused to take care of his own wife's intimate wise - thus driving her out of the house into another woman's husband arms. Refusing spouses have a huge role in these long term dynamics and are starving their own spouses out of the house and enabling an environment where affairs can and do happen. Everything is connected. And as we get older - the probability is high that the affairs are between people who are BOTH married.

I left the guilt behind. GUILT is the least of my worries. I spent most of my marriage feeling that there was nothing I could do to ever be happy. Now,reaching the ultimate pleasure and sharing an intimate relationship with another human being is essential to my life.

Kelki, You see your husband as a 'Bank Account and someone who takes out the Garbage on Tuesday...." Tell him you are a Cheater, and want a Divorce". Move on Woman! He deserves better.

Crowbar,
I take very good care of my husband. He gets all he needs and wants because I provide for him......not the other way around. However, I cannot stay sane without sex. I have told him I would outsource. I have a great friend who is ready and able and in a similar situation. Life in parallel relationships may not fit into your world but it makes mine wonderfully happy.

So, He thinks its Ok when you come home late at night, with another Man's *Seed* inside you..........and you Kiss him and "Crawl into bed" ???

Oh my crowbar..... I am questioning your motivation. Is it to incite me into making a plea that all the "Other Women" are misunderstood and victims of love gone wrong? Could it be possible, that you are a man who had a wife that disagreed with you? Maybe she was even a "cheater". OR...... Do you just want me to disclose all the nasty or erotic ( depending on your POV) details of my illicit affair?

Yes, *I had a Wife.....* HAD, is the Word. We are divorced. We decided to end the marriage after 25 yrs. and 2 wonderful children. I resent the fact that you think 'SHE' or I cheat. But you do!! And like it!!
Why not "Stand on a street corner at 2am." .....Wait for some New Meat to come by, and get Paid for it too?
Sex on the side...while being married is Evil.

Hmmmm! So are you just confused Crowbar? Are women really only meat to you? Yea.... it's called the Madonna/***** complex. Some men cannot develop relationships with women unless they equate sex as "dirty" etc....

Actually, I just asked if that was your experience... you do not have to supply any details. I am really not interested; I was being polite.

You may tuck your "gutter" language back in your pants! This is not the story where I discuss that. Trust me, a man such as you portray yourself, still would not have a chance with me; even if I were a two dollar hooker.

Good Luck Crowbar!

Kelki, I have no desire to be with a Woman such as you. Sex is a Minor part in a relationship, but love is always there.
Adultery is a sin. I think that doesn\'t matter to you. Can you look in the mirror and feel happy that you cheat?
He... might tell you different... to keep you around, but you\'re nothing but a \"Walking Vagina\" to him?

HA! Adultery IS a sin, well guess what?? SO IS DIVORCE! My goodness. You being mean and insulting is a "sin", you casting judgment is a "sin", you calling names is a sin.. need I go on? Unbelievable. Aren't you awfully self righteous? I don't understand people. I really don't. These comments. Gross. Honestly, who says that to someone?? If that is the way you speak to people I am not at all shocked to hear that you are divorced.

@sadworld, No one has a cookie cutter life! That is the point. No one should be dictating what my life should be either. You do live in my world ,have my experiences or make decisions for me.

If you truly are this angry about what happened in your marriage, you need to sort that out. Bitching at me for my life of sinfulness is not going to help you heal.

@ crowbar, Get over your double standard mentality! Maybe, sex is not important to you. Fine! Then take a hike over to the \"I am asexual\" group with some other liked minded folks. Preaching at me for my adulterous behavior is hopeless! Once again, what is your motivation?

Whoops.. that should read You do NOT live in my world. Sadworld, I sincerely, hope you have your own wonderfully,fulfilling life. You sound very happy with your husband now. Please concentrate more on your life together and less on what happens to OW on a website.

Crowbar, I do not think there are too many women beating down your door to get to you; other woman or not...... May I conclude....even if you were the last man on earth....

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This was sad for me to read. But it was so true.

Oh yes, that nails it!

It's so crazy but that is exactly how I felt with my MM. Thanks for putting my feelings into words.

Very very true

Perfect! Well said..thank you.

Thank you Diako! I am glad you found this story and hope it gives you a little inspiration to live a passionate life.

I can't tell you how much this turned me on! Haha thanks for sharing this!

Goodess,it is nice to hear positives about my story. An EP friend compared it to an Anias Nin ....so I guess it does have an erotic slant!I will say It is very enlightening to be the Goddess in his life.

This turned me on.... And Im a young woman haha... I enjoyed this thank you

I am glad you enjoyed the writing!

I think the place that people are misled is "He's the one". They assume this means he's the love of your life and you must want more with him.

With so many ways to misinterpret this, don't be surprised when people do.

No surprises here! I hope people take the post as intended and make their relationships better.

This is true u make him feel like a million dollars but how do u feel when ur done and he puts his clothes back on and walks out that door and doesn't care that u wernt feeling especially well that day??? How do u feel that he was running home cause now he cares bout that credit card and the responsibilities of being a husband but u did make him feel like he was in a better mood.. I just want u to know that if u r truly ok with this then ok but ur better then that and why can't u b a wife and stil have a honey do list and just put sex at the top? U deserve a man that u r his "milady" and ur his goddess! Just something to think about, good luck my friend

Why do you assume I need more? I am not sure I want that kind of relationship with him. He makes me feel pretty wonderful too. I know he feels the same way when our time needs to end. It is a double standard to believe that only the woman is emotionally connected to a relationship. Let me explain, I am treated like a queen by my husband but there is no sex. My husband and I fund raise in the community,attend dinner parties with close friends, we have family traditions that have gone on for years and we have a lot of fun. I almost left a few times but then he' d get sick or a family crisis would take place and it was never the right time. Actually, if my AP partner hinted at more I would probably end the relationship. So I guess I am not your typical other woman....I am not putting out ultimatums or needing promises of forever. We just enjoy each other's company.

That seems to be the case for a lot of people. They enjoy their life and the way it is cause it costs a lot of money to get divorced an it's not just lawyers its losing friends an family and if heir r kids involved u gotta think bout their feelings and of course a lot of ppl don't wanna get divorced cause then they wouldn't get medical benefits or social security payments or whatever benefits cause it seems the go er meant likes to punish ppl for bein married lol. I wasn't tryin to assume u were the one or only one wanting more I was asking it as a question, I would think at some point u wanted more or u wouldn't have tried to leave a couple times but I do understand that it's never the right time. I guess I was just tryin to understand if everybody invol bed was happy with the arrangement is all, I mean does ur husband know u use this other man for all things he can't provide or won't? I'm not judging cause I've been the other woman and I've been cheated on and I've done the cheating so I'm the last person that will point fingers I promise u that, just curious and mayb a little jealous cause that's what every woman wants is a great home and to b treated like gold and then have all the intimacy u can ask for. That's great if u guys have it all worked out.

My husband knows since I told him if there was no sex I would have an affair. He has never asked if I followed through on my decision. So I guess it is a "Don' t ask,Don' t tell" situation.
I did not take your comment as a judgement at all. I am more used to being called as a ***** due to my decision. Life leads us down an unexpected path sometimes.

Oh I am real. And much of my responses are the same because much of the context of the post is the same. Same message can apply to many and can resonate in many ways.

I laugh at the description of troll. Hmm...Look up the definition. Your behavior and words are much more in line with a "troll" than my trying to express some thoughtful and honest perspective.

It has been asserted that the verb to troll originates from Old French troller, a hunting term. A verb "trôler" is found in modern French-English dictionaries, where the main meaning given is "to lead, or drag, somebody about". Hmmm...like a married man.

As a child you were hopefully taught the difference between right and wrong. It is actually a very simple concept.

Society today allows people to feel as if they are owed something or do not have to be accountable for their actions. I personally, think this is wrong and it is why you feel you can justify anything.

I appreciate that you feel I have better grammar than Blondie...not sure who that is.

"Today not only in philosophy but in politics, government, and individual morality, our generation sees solutions in terms of synthesis and not absolutes. When this happens, truth, as people have always thought of truth, has died.” ~ Francis Schaeffer

Nope, not at all Ray. I just believe in right and wrong. Self righteousness is displayed by those justifying their behavior when they know it is wrong. We can agree to disagree.

If you wouldn't want your grandmother to know you were doing something or you wouldn't want it printed in the newspaper for all to see that is usually a good gage of knowing something is right or wrong.

I realize not everyone is faith based but I also know that I personally have to answer to God.

Ray, I agree with you completely, nobody has any business in anyone else's bedroom, especially ANOTHER person if you are married.

I am a realist and pragmatic. It happens I know. It has since the dawn of time and will continue to until the end. That still doesn't make it right.

I have always loved graciousness. I think it’s one of the most beautiful traits a person can have.

By the same token, one of the ugliest traits one can call their very own is ungraciousness – the attitude that NO ONE ever does enough for them and that what they do manage to do is…well, owed to them, somehow or justified.

“To bear defeat with dignity, to accept criticism with poise, to receive honors with humility -- these are marks of maturity and graciousness.”
- William Arthur Ward

No apologies. No, not southern, not Baptist. Do you have a belief in a higher power? Just curious.

Agree on consequences. The world would be a bette place if we all worried more about helping others. Not discarding them or their feelings. We can't save the world but we can be the change WE want and hopefully illistrate and demonstrate to others truth, love and honesty. I appreciate your sharing your thoughts and your dialouge.

The grandmother comment is thought provoking! Each of mine would have reacted in two different ways. One would have prayed for me and the other would ask if my prayers were answered.
Each day my feelings are hurt by all kinds of events,I chose how to react. Is it possible the change I envision is just different from yours?

Some people think truth is an absolute. They believe in dogma.
Some people know that truth is relative in virtually every social situation.

My grandmother believed that everything that was printed black on white was truth. Every article in the gutter press, every advertising leaflet in her letter box. Would I submit myself to her scrutiny? Not, I think. She was a very simple woman.

In virtually every talk between two people there are two truths. In every political situation there are many, many more truths, depending on where people come from in approaching the matter in hand. Consider, Mr. 4truth, the perception of a fundamentalist Muslim seeing you. You are a giaur, somewhat less than human in the first place. Should you dare start a relationship with a Muslim woman, he will consider that you have just committed a capital crime.
Just one truth that maybe you would not subscribe to, as it were ...

It is my truth for instance that any so-called Christian pastor or priest who blesses soldiers or even canons is blaspheming. Which certainly may not be your truth if you go on certain passages in the old testament, but it is mine, reading the new testament.

How many truths?
And since you seem somewhat inclined to think that you have The One, I won't particularly worry about carrying on with this aspect of the conversation.

kind regards -P.

A - I am a woman not a man. Truth is truth. Not lies. Yes we can worship different God's but ultimately lies and deceit are just that. I don't know all the answers and have not professed to. Just stating self righteous justification is not a path that I choose to travel. I didn't ask you to comment so I am fine with your not wishing to carry on any conversation. God bless

Kelki - absolutely. We all have different journeys - different paths. Your change is yours alone. I just know first hand the ripple affects of an affair and know that many innocent people are hurt. Just trying to shine some light on that perspective. Good luck

The ripple is from reaction to the situation not the affair itself. I do not know your story but my motivation was to illustrate how a spouse should become more like an affair partner. You see, I do not want to own any part of my AP. We simply share a part of our lives that our spouses don' t care about.

Exactly, we like intelligent discussion even if there is disagreement. However, I do take offense to being called a deranged ***** and I hate it when my fellow posting friends get called goofs, fatssdlosers,***** etc... But be aware if you take that low road of name calling we will run you off without ever calling you one. Except.... TROLL.. but usually they identify themselves as that due to their actions.

But the ripples are created from choices - choices of free will. Even if the souse doesn't care or you do not care about the spouse I have seen first hand how it affects the children. My daughter lost her hero, a person she thought was someone she could always count on. Through the affair and lies it taught her she wasn't as important as her daddy's desires. I would have had more respect if he'd have asked for a divorce so we could deal with reality vs. his wanting to pretending to be devoted husband and father. That's my issue. We have 3 children and they lost their innocence and belief in their father through the actions of the affair. A daughter needs a father so she will have at least one hero that will never let her down and demonstrate unconditional love. A son needs a father to be an example of a man he should inspire and grow to be. Major ripple that we had no choice in being swept up in. Unfair, selfish and irresponsible.

Thanks Ray. You have been a great person to chat with. I am obviously new here. I appreciate your giving me the benefit of the doubt. Hugs

I do not believe a man or woman cares less for their children because they have an affair. I do not know how how your husband handled his affair or his reasons for having one but I would never expect my AP to forsake his family responsibilities. He ,in turn, would never expect me to put off my obligations to satisfy him. You see, we provide each other with that one element that our marriages do not have. It is almost medicinal... I do not know if I could deal with life as it is now without his support. Having an affair should not take over your life, that is obsession. An affair should enhance your life not control it.

Respectfully, if what you have is so good why not divorce and be together? If either of you have children how do you think they'd respond if they found out? I am not saying my husband doesn't love our children but he severely let them down. The truth we sought to teach him, the facade he continued to carry on was false and made our children question who their father really is which in turn has them question everything in their life that they knew to be true. It's just sad. My husband is remorseful but he can't undo what's been done.

Ray, your children are lucky to have you. I agree about happiness but never at the cost of others. Accuse me of being a martyr but I can't consciously make a decision knowing it could hurt someone else, especially my children. I wish everyone happiness and love in their lives. Ray, you seem like a fair and good man. Keep your head up. Hugs

Go Blues !!! Lol

Do you have a toque?

Oh gosh, to answer that question I would probably have to write another story, which I probably should. So here’s a synopsis; I am one of those women in a sexless marriage. I decided to find an affair partner after 12 years of no sex in my bedroom. My husband was ill for most of our marriage and I stay to take care of him and my job provides insurance benefits. We never had children. I announced to my husband that he was leading me into an affair and since then I have had one. I did play the martyr for a long time and it nearly killed me and him as well.

My affair partner has been married for nearly 30 years, has 2 sons, aged 16 and 21. His youngest has autism. His sex life was always lackluster and then when it became extinct, he looked for an affair. In his words, he had to do something. His children and his wife have no idea he carries on a discreet affair with me. There just seems to be a limit for some of us to declare that sexual intimacy has to happen or we become less able to deal with life.

Here is the clincher, we respect, feel responsible and love our spouses, but however, sex is not important to them. Leaving, even without affair activity, would cause way too much chaos. I honestly do not want to spend the rest of my life with him or any other man. Although, I do adore the relationship we share and would love it to continue like this for years to come. We are going on 5.

It sounds like your husband became pretty obsessed with his desire for this woman. The key is to know that the time you have together is precious and passionate and if the desire is too much to handle, then there has to be decisions made before one partner becomes possessive or obsessed.

Ray, I am reminiscing about last month’s trolls. Question: Who was the one that left crazy messages on our whiteboards, called us fornicators and did not know what the word meant. Then proceeded to tell us about all the “fornicators’ chasing her?

Thank you for sharing your story. Where I have strong convictions and beliefs I do not feel that I am ever in a place to pass judgement. My truth is not someone else's - life is not one size fits all. We each create and choose our own journey.

My h got into an an emotional affair first. Through counseling many "reasons" were unveiled.
We are still together.

I understand needs, can understand your staying. In our case those issues weren't a factor. He was simply living a dual life (mid life crisis per him and said MC).

I granted him the out. I personally do not want to be with someone that doesn't want to be with me. He didn't take it. I said nothing messy - I can provide for myself and our children. But the "wake up" (his words) of losing me and our family "woke him up" and he loves me and our family so says he.

Good in one manner - mind boggling in so many others. As a wife and mother I have had to pick up the pieces of this mess that I did not create ( again HIS free will took him elsewhere without ever telling me once he was unhappy)

And actually my husband was himself in the affair. Passive aggressive. Found the emails and text and they are actually kind of sad. If I were her I'd want more. Vanilla. Never said he loved her. She did in every communication. I know i don't know everything. We still made love 2-3 times a week. Still ideal couple. Shiny happy couple.

I wish you happiness. I do. I hope his spouse and children never find out so they aren't hurt. I appreciate your truth and honesty. God bless

Thank you. No apologies necessary but I do appreciate it. Good luck.

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Have a moral compass...have a heartLike it or not, you are a willing participant in a man violating his vows and betraying the trust of his wife -- not to mention grossly disappointing hurting innocent children. You have zero right to hurt others because of your selfish needs. Despite his reassuring you how much you mean to him, his not ending his relationship with his wife in an above-board and respectful way -- and not beginning a legitimate relationship with you -- are actions that speak louder than words.You are a hard body, a fantasy an escape. Bottom line an option and easy to discard. You sound smug in your posting. Is that smugness an attempt to cover up your insercurities? We all want to be loved. That is human nature but finding love that is authentic is real. Your lies and deceit are not real.Do you really want to "win" this man? One it's not a game, you are playing with people's lives and two, wow...what a "prize"I hope you have some faith in your life to find a way to truth and honesty. God has a path for you and I can assure you this isn't it. God loves and forgives. Look for His guidance so you can be proud of the person you are. Being involved with a married man and thinking you are "winning" shouldn't make you proud. Who you are, what you have achieved in your life, being humble and caring, those are traits that I would hope you'd aspire for. My heart breaks for you. If you were my daughter I would shed many tears.

<p>You are in denial...</p><p>Here are 6 simple reasons why you shouldn't get involved with a married man:</p><p>1. He's not really yours. You will be at his mercy with scheduling your rendezvous around his wife's schedule. You will be waiting for him and being alone and lonely most of the time.</p><p>2. It's all secret. What's wrong with having a secret relationship, you say? When you start getting closer to him and falling in love, you will want to tell your friends and family and will want to go out in public. He can't do that because he needs to keep the relationship secret from his wife and anyone who knows him.</p><p>3. You will never rate. In other words, you will get the sloppy seconds. Yes, you have to be comfortable with your married man "double dipping" and yes, I mean his penis. You have to know that he is having all the same intimacy with his wife as he is having with you. He will try and downplay his sex life with his wife, but ultimately, he is going home to her, sleeping with her and playing house with her not you.</p><p>4. You will essentially take yourself off the market. You will grow older by the day, month, year(s) you are with this married man and saving yourself for a relationship that may never happen. I mean, he may tell you he wants to leave his wife eventually when the kids grow up, or when she gets over her depression, or after her surgery or whatever, but, too many times he will stay with his wife. He will string you along for a long time without making a commitment to you . You are a fling. He likes that thrill and if it's not you it's someone else.</p><p>5. What will you do if his crazed wife finds out about you in a low moment of marriage therapy or truth or dare between him and his wife and he spills the beans about you? What will you do when she calls you at work, leaves dirty desc<x>riptive answering machine messages at your home, calls your parents, your employer, and your friends and tells everyone of your disgusting relationship with her husband? Don't think this will never ever happen? Think again.</p><p>His wife will sniff out another woman and when she does, she will confront him when he least expects it. She will threaten to take all his money and the house and the kids, so he agrees to go to therapy with her. They talk about any extra marital relationships and you pop up. He can't help himself, men are lured to tell the truth in these scenarios and she goes ballistic and insists on knowing your name, address, phone number, where you work and then you are the target. He feels a temporary relief that he's told her the truth and the emphasis is now on someone else...you. This could happen while you are seeing him or years down the road, even after you have broken off and have gotten into a serious relationship authentic and consensual with another single man. Your life might be in the best place it's been and then this lunatic comes in and stirs it up and drags you through the mud like a common *****.</p><p>6. He has the upper hand; he controls the relationship. Sure, seeing a woman outside his married is thrilling and the sex is incredible. You and he make a connection that makes you both feel great and exhilarated. You are essentially his toy. Usually temporary until he's tired of playing with you or you get too serious or there's a chance his wife might find out. He can end this relationship with you at any time and he will never have disturbed his life or marriage. You will be left alone and depressed and there's nothing you can do about it.</p>

Oh my! I am by no means being dragged around by my hair. My AP and I have no intention of leaving our marriages, I do not own him, I do not plan to put myself on the market like a prize pig and as far as rating.... well.... we do not rate each other or our relationship because it is uniquely ours. No rating required! I always have the opportunity to end the relationship too... An affair is not always so one-sided.

Who is there to judge? We all grown up and responsible for our action. It takes two to dance. People are happy, that the most important.

you may be his goddess, but apparently not enough of a one for him to actually choose to be with full time. ..and so it is a very sad situation. I don't see the reasonableness of selecting to remain in such a dishonest situation. As for being "the other woman". i think you short change yourself....... I prefer the tile...."only woman".....perhaps you should consider that option. Your certainly deserving of that type of exclusive relationship. why settle for so much less?

I am deserving ,but that was not why I wrote this post. When I thought about why I am in this adulterous relationship,I came to a rather eye-opening conclusion. My affair partner and I are drawn to each other because of our spouses' lack of interest in sex. My message was simply to contrast how a spouse would benefit from being like the "Other Woman". Maybe someday I will leave and become the only but that is another story.......

Neuilly, you can have a relationship with a person without wanting to own them, without wanting to have them exclusively to yourself, without either of you giving up your autonomy, your other relationships, your marriage even.

This is a story about someone who picks up the precious thing that somebody else has discarded, and treasures it, no more, no less. The people in this story enjoy each other, they give each other pleasure, and neither want to leave their life to make a new life together.
Can't we just respect their choice? Wish them lots of fun and a happy future?

hugs, -P.

the problem with that idea, is it cheats them both out of a possibility of much more than coming in second best..

But in our world it is not second best.....I cannot leave my marriage, he cannot leave his. I am not even sure I want to be with him or anyone exclusively. I do know that in these roles, we fullfill each other's needs, ones that we denied in ourselves for a very very long time. Trust me when I state I am in no way being selfish....I spend quality time with my husband and his family is in no way neglected. I do understand how being "the one" in someone else's life is perfect but for me, right now, this is special. It is perfect because I have to take care of all the burdens life has handed me. I cannot change that at this moment. This affair is life-changing. This man has given me more than I ever thought I could have again. All that could change in a minute, but for now I am going to enjoy these moments.....the ones that I do deserve......in somewhat imperfect circumstances.

well...then best of luck...best of luck to you both...

Thank you! We all need a little more luck....

I agree

Very true!

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Some of you women are so old, yet still so immature and selfish. Whether the wife was giving him everything he needed or nothing at all, it was his CHOICE to marry her, and as long as he chooses to stay with her is clearly a CHOICE. If he is so unhappy, why does he choose to stay? The words 'selfish', 'cowardly', and 'ill-moral' come to mind. However disgusting the married man's behavior is, clearly this is a case where opposites don't attract.
Maybe one might argue, "If he left, he would lose a lot of money and stuff." A man like this doesn't value you OR his wife over STUFF -- pieces of trash you'll find at yard sales in a few good years or in the dumpster with no oxygen to even rot. But you can bet he values himself more than all that stuff taking up room on his shelves.
While I agree 100% with the OP that you cannot control someone else, this does not create a new view in which cheating is okay. Do you believe the wife would have wasted her youth/gone into this marriage if she had known her husband would be sleeping with other women on the side? Maybe, but probably not is my guess. She is the one stuck in the middle, and the one who will feel the most pain. She is like a door being slowly unscrewed into instability. Each of you stand on one side of the door, slowly loosening it's stability and closure. It's when your faces meet that she crashes onto the floor.
I can deeply sympathize with someone who entered a relationship with someone who lied about their status, however, to continue or especially to begin an affair is beyond words disgusting.
I am not married, and have (to my knowledge) never been cheated on, however, your karma is waiting. You might think mine is waiting too for being a "judgmental b*ch" or the likes, but believe me: Even if mine is waiting, who can deny that yours isn't ten times worst.

I no longer reply in depth to people who do not have the bravery to write their own stories. I also explained why I wrote this story farther down in the posts.

Good for you Kelki. I read that post a minute after it went up and I considered my reply. Judgemental, for sure. Now that is one thing. But it's also completely lacking in respect, it's glaringly ignorant, and it's full of abuse. The proper karma for that is not to be heard, not to be replied to, not to be taken seriously.
I have no problem with people who have a differing opinion and want to enter into a discussion, but it's got to be respectful, and with honest intentions, not just "slagging people off". As you said, it's cowardly. Bravo. I decided ultimately that the story-comment was not to be dignified with a reply .... HateLuver will reap in their life as they sow.

Thank you Pertruska! I realize I draw a fine line between right and wrong. However, there is no reason to call me names over a post like this. For heaven's sake it is to show how a relationship dies due to neglect and selfishness. It is not about the "stuff" at all. It is about reaching out to someone else for understanding,support and sexual intimacy. Responsibility to a spouse can be so overwhelming but do we give up part of ourselves and become less to fulfill that?

Ray, You know we cannot let your talents go to the wayside. Have fun with the New troll.

Harrie, thank you for your thoughtful reply. It could only be written by a self-confident woman who has learned more about life through experience. I am not so sure about the women who push their perception of karma. Don' t they know that karma is all about Thoughts and Actions? I hope those bad thoughts toward people in affairs do not consume them. That would be a whole lot of bad karma.

These new and/or reinvented trolls are something else...Oh well, if they feel better tellling me I am gonna burn in hell, I guess that is their way of blowing off steam. Whatever....I do not plan to change my wicked ways any time soon.

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you and those like you are ill. i hope you get burned and are hurt as those your hurting.
get your own family and man to be a ***** with. karma is real.

I am confused...are you trying to call me a victim???
and for the record...yes mine did cheat and yes I did have a huge role to play in his doing so....I accepted and have made the changes i needed to to be available for my family and put them first. I had not in their eyes in some time.
This does not change the fact that the ***** he went with is just that a no count ***** who messed with the wrong womans man and CHILD. I paid my price now they will have to pay thiers.

If you look down farther in this post you will see I answered everyone the same way. I am NOT the woman who cheated with your husband. This is a lyrical post to illustrate that a wife or husband should probably thin about acting more like the Other in a marriage.

Affairs can be messy,obsessive or they can be exactly what a person needs for many reasons. Sometimes the people involved are mean, nasty and horrible and sometimes it is just a matter of finding someone to get you through the challenges of life.

I am not calling you a victim but I do detect a lot of hurt and/anger in your post. Please be sure to get the help you need, your child deserves that.

What people don't realize is that along with amazing sex, the connection extends to emotions and intelligence as well. We stimulate each other in more ways than one . . . and it's very real and intense. After all . . .who doesn't want to feel nurtured, loved, accepted, and appreciated ?

KattG, You are so correct! I know there are affairs that get out of control but this kind of relationship can be and should be fullfilling for all parties involved. I often tell my AP, he is my Prozac....I do not think he or I could make it through the week without the connection.

i am exactly like you the sex is incredible

Wow! well written!

Thank you!

This story is my life for the last 3 yrs of being the "other" woman. I am 65 he is 64, I am completely & helplessly in love with him. He says I am his anchor, his safe haven, he is completely in love with me as well. The Mrs has serious health issues, so there will be no leaving her. I understand that. I've tried to walk away, i haven't been able too. I know I deserve more, I just don't know how to live without him in my life...........

I am going to change my stance, i think maybe you are right Kelki.. I think its always right to be Happy..We anyway dont know what life is going to be like in the long term, even with our spouse, our own lives, so maybe its better to welcome whatever happiness comes your way..We dont know whether its going to come our way again or not..I dont know you but I am still happy for your kelki that you have found happiness and love..

uma, I have been very blessed to have people come into my life to teach me and share amazing experiences....I added you so you can read some of my blogs too. And thank you for your kind words.

<p>Beautifully written.. Isnt there an inherent sadness to be being the other woman though..?</p> <br />
<br />
A sexless marriage is dysfunctional, but isnt an affair with a married man kind of dysfunctional too, given that the other woman does feel bad when the guy goes back to his wife, who has kids with him, who is the beneficiary of all his resources? Can one dysfunctional relationship be saved by another one to make us feel complete?

Uma, I look at it this way: there's people I might like to shoot pools with, there's people I like to talk psychology with, there's people I like to discuss photography with or woodwork or building computers .... all those are interests of mine. These people are not congruent.

So why should I not be able to have a good relationship with my sexless wife, and a passionate one with a FWB, just like I have relationships with other people with whom I am neither hugely affectionate nor passionate (well, I am always somewhat affectionate, but that's neither here nor there).

Not JUST wondering out loud because in my 20s I had a very good relationship with the woman I would call 'the love of my life' and a friend that I'd had prior to that relationship with whom I also had sexual relations (she was married and had a number of lovers) and we 3 got on splendidly. There are many things that are possible with the right constellation... it all depends on the people involved and the circumstances. What works for some, does not work for others, or with others.
Everybody in the end has to find a way that works for them, and for those they are connected to. i.m.n.s.h.o -P.

@aod7909...I think monogamy isn't for everyone. But our society still prescribes it as the thing we're supposed to be happy with. You are living in de-facto polyamory, though I assume the hubby does not know, and the wife of your lover does not know.
I think that the ideal of monogamy for everyone is something that ought to be questioned...maybe not held in such high social regard.

De- facto polygamist! I kind of like the name of that. I have also heard it called cuckold
Gracie and aod, I do not know about your relationships but mine was not one I just fell into. Thank you hylierandom for the information.

woof woof, you're barking up the wrong tree

In my case, I was on a hunt for the perfect FWB. So was he. I met him online,made eye contact 2 weeks later and got a hotel room two weeks after that. It was instant attraction and over 4 years later still amazing. We simply enjoy each other in our moments together. Like Gracie,sometimes I may not see him for 2 weeks but we do text or talk daily. The only expectation we have is that we keep ourselves healthy enough to have sex till we are 90.

harrie, I do not believe being a friends with benefits is belittling. I think the stereotypes of TOW should be questioned. Some of us are not waiting for our MM to leave his wife. But our relationship is essential to our health and,as strange as it sounds, to the longevity of the marriage. I entered into this affair with my eyes wide open and I have never felt used for sex. I understand the perceptions of society,the taboo of an extramarital affair,however, maybe it just should not be an issue.

Ok Harrie, I'll play.
1 - when I have a friend with benefits then the word Friend is written with a capitol F. Friend first. How is that belittling? I have many friends of both gender, are you suggesting that I am belittling all of them merely by being friends with them?
2 - I do not compartmentalize. I am who I am, I am the same person in all places, my friends know each other and my feelings for each and any of them are not compartmentalized from each other.
3 - I feel very sorry for you that you feel like a substitute sex provider. You need to pick your lovers more carefully.
4 - how dare you call my friends 'tramps'? We all have respectful and genuinely affectionate relationships between grown up people.

You are making way too many assumptions. And you are placing inappropriate value judgments based on said assumptions.

I've been used by women, but because of that I do not go around saying that all women are just after my money, all women only want me for sex or all women don't really want sex but just pretend so they can have a man look after their material needs and wants (all stupid sexist put-downs I have had to read through this last week, made by men hurt by their wives).
You've done a similar thing to me. Please examine your assumptions and do not be so hasty to judge others on insufficient data.
All my friends are treated with respect, and loved. Males and females. Otherwise they would not be my friends. I don't see myself as able even to go out there and have one-night-stands, sleep with prostitutes or people whom I do not have a relationship, a friendship with first and foremost. And I just happen to know for a fact that I am not alone in that, from a male perspective.
Not every man is an insensitive exploitative lout, just like not every woman is a greedy selfish *****.

peace, -P.

Cannot be said any better!

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It looks to me that we don't understand that both "positions" are really hard.

You shouldn't be annoyed - "first women" finds some truth in your statement (and it hurts )- And I believe you also find some truth in what we are saying. Life is not black and white, and not as simle as you claim: if don't have sex with him, he will go to the ather place. It would be easy, but it is not...

The people calling you names, can not rationaly realize that their spouse is a problem, not you, not even the real "other woman".

They just see you as a symbol of somebody who allegedly ruined their lifes. Which is in fact their spouse (and they of course contributed their part...)

Kelki, maybe you want to read my story, btw: I came back after all. After I got upset eith you some time ago - can you imagine those women who are in the midle of huricane right now.... Try to understand - I definitely try to understand you.

Could you please clarify a few small points for me? Has his wife actually spoken to you and confirmed that they are in a "sexless" marriage? If so, how does SHE feel about living in a "sexless" marriage? Have you witnessed the actions you mention, her nagging, her denying him sex, her taking his credit card etc or has he told you all this?

There are so many literal thinkers on this site! Once again, this post is lyrical. My main objective was to write about the sad state of a sexless marriage and how a spouse can change that and become like another woman or another man. Let me clarify this! I am not angry with his wife! I am not angry with my husband! This post is about people with different priorities in their lives. Many people are happy in a sexless marriage and their spouses.... not so much.....I happen to believe sex is an integral part of my life.

Please do not let your leftover anger spill into every story told by every other woman in this group! Their path is different than yours.

Can I respectfully ask one question? If you were not having an affair and your husband was would you still have the same empathy that he is just another lonely soul searching and possibly finding what he was not getting in the marriage? It maybe that he is that lonely soul now, senses he's no longer much of a priority in your life but more an obligation, wishes he could let you go but cannot. Not judging you about the affair and saying you're a bad person. That you are still looking after the needs of your husband in an obligatory way shows that fundimentally you are a good person.

If my STBX had had an affair, I would have been more astonished than hurt.
"My Gods! you actually WANTED sex!"
...Just sayin' :p

Trust me, I have spent many hours thinking about it. If my husband was having an affair, I would have been the one to suggest it. I do not beleive I would have let him hurt like this for so long and try to pretend all is ok. One of the reasons I do not leave is because he is a lonely soul and he is not such a burden as he is a avoider.

He does feel because he does not want sex, it is him, not me. The difference is that he does not want to change that. I can only be there for him in the capacity that I am, a marriage based on plantonic friendship! The thought to have an affair was harder than the action. BTW, I have pretty sure he knows of the affair and chooses to ignore. It's that he is not a priority ,he is,but I cannot give him all he needs without getting that one thing I need.

Looks like the blondie blocked me! LMAO! I am still wondering why she felt the need to even comment here. It's not like we cheered her on, it's not like we thought she had anything of revalance to share. So once again she proves she is very fearful of another woman even if she is projecting to one she does not even know! She obviously is not as well mannered as she like to pretend as the utter trashiness of her vocabulary portrays. I think she is just another lonely soul like all of us are on occasion. I think her occassions happen more often. Hell, she posted more on my story than I did in the last 24 hours. People with fullfilling lives do not feel the need to do that!

Let me get out my crystal ball. Oh...yea....I knew it......her husband left....did not want to put up with the abusive language spitting out of her mouth. And let's see what else....Oh how sad! The fairy tale castle of revenge and bitterness is just a black cloud of nothingness.

Thank you to all my EP friends whom help me conquer the trollls!

I agree, blondie seems a little bitter.

http://men.webmd.com/features/why-men-cheat
...according to a survey done on a population of 200 married men...among those who were or who had cheated, 48% cheated out of emotional dissatisfaction.

"Only 12% of cheating men said their mistress was more physically attractive than their wife"

...So, basically, the main reason men cheat seems to be loneliness.
This is something I can REALLY understand.
I was profoundly lonely in my marriage...and I ended up having something of an emotional affair with a friend. This sort of gave me the support I needed to end a marriage that was no good for either me or my partner.
(...Don't feel terrifically sorry for My STBX...
I kept telling her what she was doing wrong, how she was hurting me.
Because she found my point of view illogical, she ignored it.)

Something I note, Kelki...It seems to be assumed that you want to "catch" a man. Presumably once you've caught him, you can safely take him for granted?

That's kind of a depressing mindset.

Hyleirandom, I waited for many years before I even knew what an emotional affair was. I threw myself into my job, blamed myself for everything and I never reached out for fear someone would find out how dysfunctional my marriage really was.

I am now of the mindset that I should have been the spinster aunt with a lover in every part of the world. I stay in my marriage because of responsibility. I am in a monagamous affair because I have to cope with all the responsibilities. I was very lonley for a long time but once I expected no sex in my marriage H. and I got along fine. But I still deal with the hurt and rejection. I get support from someone who desires to be treated the same way I do.

I don't want to "catch" a man at all! I just want to be with someone who enjoys the sensual part of me that my husband does not seem to want understand.

I totally get you.
Had my wife said "ok, you can have others," I think I would have tried to make an open marriage work. I'm not good at sneaking, so I would only do it given permission...
But after a year of no sex, she gave me duty sex. UCK.
Too, it was becoming really apparent how much she was running right over me in everything...a friend pointed out she was bullying me.
He was right, she was.
For those who are unhappily married, but can't get out due to circumstances...I feel for you.

If he was giving his wife what she desired...maybe she would be giving him what he desires..but I guess its a lot easier for a coward to fool a woman like you..with lies...about his marriage and about his wife!
Like I have said many times....I wish the other woman would have called me during the time my husband was having an affair with her! But she was too stupid believing his lies...she has a liar and a cheat proving himself to her...like you have one...and you believe everything he says! I have to ask where your brain is when its NOT in your vagina!!!

I love the way you other women blame a wife for the moral bankrupcy of her her husbands actions! I guess its a lot easier than lookin at what you are and what he is....and thats how you go through life...being used for sex....2nd place...while hes at home spoiling his "miserable " wife!

I cant understand how any one doing this..can call a wife stupid...when she has no clue and trust her husband....and you dimwits...know hes a liar and cheater...and BELIEVE HIN! AGAIN, UNREAL!

Wrong, plain and simply wrong. There are millions of damaged people out there who will NEVER give their spouse what they need and want.
They are called dysfunctional people. Damaged by their past life. By their parents, whatever.
You can romance them, you can butter them up, you can cook for them, clean for them, put rose scented candles in the bedroom, read sex manuals and try everything in the book, give them diamondes, buy them a boat, stand on your head, wearing sexy lingerie and waggle your legs and they will still ignore you.

Your premise is WRONG. Period.

Do you even like men? You assume all of them cheat and always will. I still do not even know why you are in this group. Your whole mission seems to be to name call and to pronounce your possession of another human being.

BTW, I never called the wife "stupid" or "miserable" or any name for that matter. She just has a different set of priorities right now. My whole reason for writing this post is to hope people take a look at their marriages and become like another woman or another man. I know there are lying, cheating spouses in the world. I also know there are neglected, confused ones.

I am wondering if your marriage is truly what you claim it is. You have written no stories and have offered only negative comments to other women. Maybe practicing the art of forgiveness is proving to be a very hard thing for you to accomplish. Hmmmmm!

I do hope you will refrain from posting negativity on my stories and any others. I am not saying you are BUT your comments are disrespectful, one-sided and not at all supportive. Not to mention the trashy the name-calling!

I thought about blocking you and I still might, but, honestly your comments come off so angry or bitter or fearful ( I am not sure what yet) it like a dark comedy.

Im sure your parents are very proud of you!

As for ignorant...thanks...anything derrogitory coming from a person of your moral character and ethics..can only be a compliment to me!
Go screw your married man..wait for him and be all you can for him....becaused hes the only type of man you will ever get..good ones, can see right through you! Block me, please! YOU MAKE ME SICK!

Well, they are certainly not sirens, that's for sure!

And by the way, you have no clue what goes on in anyones bedroom, unless youre there!
No one should have to behave like some ***** for any man...except..if thats the only thing you got going...which..it probably is! Go spread your legs for the next one!

And you do not get to post horrible names and make moral decisions about anyone's character! I do not have to defend the decisions I made to anyone but I will continue point out the simply,outright, garbage names that you call people. I may decide to have fun in a hotel room with a lover but I will never ever be viewed as a foul-mouthed woman with no class.

Keep on trolling me, blondie! Next, I want to psychoanalyze where all that anger, spitefulness and fearfulness comes from.

Ray, I am lovin' every minute of it! Chime in whenever you want, my fellow troll baiter! This one has totally different issues, and she's going to be nasty.

Of course, screwing a married man...is CLASSY- IN YOUR BOOK!
You go ahead and try to analyze me....take the focus off the fact that youre just common trash and now try to make me sound like a hateful person for calling you out! You are garbage..youre a *****. Go analyze that! Yeah and keep smiling.....knowing your a stupid woman letting a married man screw you and take advantage of you! Now that is to laugh about!

No anger , not spiteful or fear...thats all in YOUR story! Your old, youre afraid to be alone....so you ll take ANY MAN

And your spiteful because you were never special to ANY MAN , except the 20 minutes hes using you! So dont brag about your affair and the attention YOU give him that his wife isnt!!! You ARE disgusting! YOU SHOULD HANG YOUR HEAD IN SHAME! Not boast , like youre really accomplishing something by letting some married LOSER SCREW YOU!

Petruska,
Kelki is an idiot! It doesnt take too much to figure that out....hell, read her story!

Serious abandonment issues! Blondie is absolutely terrified that her husband will leave again. Do you think her father left her at a young age? Possible obsessive compulsive disorder....I am sensing some strong desires to control her environment. I am wondering about alcoholism? Don't alcoholics sometimes lash out like this? I am just getting started... truly "pethetic" she needs help!

My 2-cent analysis?
This is anger she likely feels at her spouse, who cheated on her.
However, rather than direct it at her philandering spouse, she directs it at a surrogate "other woman."
...She is actually THIS angry at her partner.
I think if she allowed herself to feel this angry at her spouse, she'd end the marriage.
...Unless of course she has never been in this situation and just likes to ride a moral high-horse...a real Betty Bowers type... http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OFkeKKszXTw

One has to wonder when this anger started....Was it before her husband even had the affair? Was it after the affair? How much of the anger was directed at him and maybe that is why he began an affair?
Now I am watching the Betty Bower link....

Honestly, we all should know even though she may have called some men...,maybe even her husband...idiots,whorehunters, and stupid, ignorant perverts, he always thought about her when he was with or on of those "pethetic" ******. Frankly, I think he probably needed a break!

LMAO! Yeah..all of the above!

I love the way all you cheaters stick together! cheaters lack self control, self esteem and confidence. You are people who are missing something and make the assumption youll find that happiness in someone else....sorry. Not going to happen! If you cant find what your missing in your own soul..no one else will fill it!

I had a father in my life up until 4 years ago, he abondoned me when he died. (you dumbasses!) He tought me how to be a woman and respect myself and never let any man take andvantage of me. He tought me that I am valued and loved!
My husband....he had 2 dipshits for parents who did nothing but cheat on each other..he and his sister are seriously screwed up people...but since this happend to our marriage my husband realized he didnt want to be like ALL OF YOU and he wanted to clean up his act and be the man God intended.

'And yes Kelki we had our problems..why do you think we both had affairs. I stopped at emotional...because..all that love and learning I got from my FATHER and MOTHER who were married over 50 years..KICKED IN! I am better than the common trash who let their sex orgsans take over!

You losers go ahead and surmise all you want....its how you protect yourselves from seeing the truth....YOU ARE ALL CHEATERS AND LIARS! Glad you can all look in the mirror and like what you see! No suprise there! You are all a total reflection of what this society is..cut throat and selfish!

Your lives are screwed up because you live screwed up!
And yeah, my husband probably wanted a break because my standards are pretty damn high! And when he stopped living up to them...he found someone who accepted his lower standards....some one like YOU kelki! But you know what, he wanted to be better...and he fought for me....and the love we have for each other now is a love you will never have!

I m sorry your husband doesnt value YOU..maybe he needs an other woman to scare him straight!
Good luck to you and your cheater!

And for the poster with the 2 cent analysis..I was this angry at my husband and our marriage did end!
Its called REBUILDING!

Most of you, should just stick to cheating....thats what you know best! Trust me !

Reminds me so much of her. Bravo Kelki.

again LMAO!

Betty Bowers is a parody, BTW...Blondie just really reminds me of her.
...And the only thing I ever cheated on my STBX with took AA batteries. I was really in love, as my reward I was chained by my vows and ignored...or told I could not do anything right.

I will never marry or commit to monogamy again.

A little bitter aren't we?

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I dont know wether to laugh or cry at this....you are truly a pethetic woman!

Blondie, you really are getting into the 'blonde' thing here?

There are an incredible number of people out there who JUST ARE NOT INTERESTED IN HAVING SEX WITH THEIR SPOUSE. Most of us, who fall victim of such people, have tried everything in the book to fix that, and it won't work. You can't make a pig fly, you cannot get coke out of an empty coke machine never mind how many nickles and dimes you stuff into the slot.

You, Blondie are talking about things that you obviously have no idea about.
If you want to learn - I invite you to read widely in the group "I live in a sexless marriage" but you may find it way way too disturbing to your cosy view of the world.

Calling somebody who has spent years and years working on their relationship with an unresponsive spouse "pathetic" really is the epitome of ignorant.

AHHHH! More name-calling.... Blondie, better access the thesaurus... your posts are getting boring. BTW, I am laughing.

Yeah, I bet you are ...alone tonight? Your married lover with his family?

Petruska, so are you saying its ok to cheat on your spouse after years and years of working on your marriage? Who did I call pathetic..besided Kelki?

You know what this is really a waste of my time...I have a life, a great life....and I dont need to waste my time at the BOTTOM of the barrel with you losers!!

Then don't! Who asked you? This is yet another thing I don't understand. People like you pick a fight and then say you're too good for the argument YOU started. You go out of your way to read these stories. Why?? It's unhealthy. You and the others like you are obsessed. Keep stalking, the bottom line is you're reading and it's provoking. You can't get enough!

Why would I be alone? I thought you read my stories! I have a husband and lots of friends and relatives.

This one was written as a lyrical comment on the state of some marriages, in general. It sounds like it scared you to death. I understand you must feel so guilty because your husband left you. I hope that changed now that you "got " him back. Now that you "own" him again. I certainly hope that he knows the terms of being "bond" to you. I am sure he sees the wisdom of your ways. After all, he is only a weak-willed male in need of your constant supervison.

Blondie, that invitation to TRY to troll on the ILIASM group is still open?

Oh wow, double shame...youre married!!!?
And for the record...my husband never left me....he had his skanker on the side..hoping to win me back! The man he was before he started cheating and during the time he was cheating...she could have gladly had..but like most of the ow's her best...gazing into his brown eyes...and crying out in pleasure...couldnt keep him from me...lmao!
I think its time you leave your sexless marriage! Why are you wasting your time cheating?? COWARD!

Youre right? Why? Like my mother always said....you play with pigs, you get dirty.
BTW...OZ!

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Well I like this post! From what I gather...what your tryin to say basically or what I got from it is while she's off shopping, while she's not in the mood & while she's nagging him to get things done around the house your not doing that. Your giving him the love & attention that he deserves & obviously wants.
I sorta feel the same...if she was doing her job as his girlfriend I wouldn't be with him. If she stopped and took a moment to give him what he wants, treat him how he wants & show him how utterly attractive & sexy he was I wouldn'y be needed. If she was more open sexually like he wants I wouldn't be needed.
Maybe this comment will get alot angry attention but it's true.

That's exactly it, Medu5a! And...... it works both ways. Men should be hell bent on making sure the woman in his life is feeling that way too. I was amazed how much negative attention the post got and how many people felt they needed to call me names over it. What strikes me as ironic is most of these same folks will state how sex is unimportant in a marriage, however, they go to great lengths to voice how horrible it is for a spouse to go somewhere else to get what he/she craves. If sex is so unimportant in a relationship , then let someone else provide to your spouse. How much of the "worse" in a marriage does a spouse have to put up with before they seek out someone else to demonstrate the one of the "better" parts of a relationship?

I wanted to add this-
With those words for the wife it's like you want her to find out about you. Why care about her or give her a single thought if you say you love your own husband?

Kelki why would you write a letter to the wife if all it is for you is fulfilling the lack of sex in your own marriage and no more? With your "letter" it seems that you would like something more with this man or else you wouldn't take the time to give his wife a second thought. What advice are you seeking?

Mishtx,
STOP! You are reading a lot more into this story than I intended. This is not a story I wish to receive advice on. I simply wanted to let wives and husbands (in general) know how marriages deteriorate when one spouse does not keep a bond of sexual intimacy intact. I read your profile, my dear, and you are in a very different place than I am. Please do not take this lyrical post and take it beyond what it was intended to be.

Ok. Read my profile all you want. If I was ashamed or afraid of being compared as you're comparing yourself to me I wouldn't come here and share. I was just trying to understand your post. I didn't realize you were seeking to stir up a specific type of audience. I actually thought this was a real letter you were going to send!

Mishtx,
OMG! I would never send such a letter. I like to write lyrical posts that make people think. I have taken a lot of criticism over this story and getting called some of the names I have been puts me on the defense. I now feel I have to read the profile of each person who comments. Some I never respond to, I just block. Honestly, when I read your story about how you hate your husband, it took me back to some very heartbreaking times in my own marriage. Of course, they are totally different circumstances but the feelings of abandonment are very familiar.
Please take care and read more stories….and enjoy EP!

Clearly the part about "for better or worse" is not applicable to these people's marriages anymore. It you say you are just missing this one thing from your marriage then either accept that or get out of the marriage. Your reasoning makes no sense. Marriage is not about getting everything you want and every responsible adult knows that. If sex is the deal breaker then be honest and leave. You and your cheating partner are both just trying to have your cake and eat it too? You speak as thought it is somehow better than other sleazy cheating relationships, but it is just as dishonourable. The is right and wrong and the problem is no one wants to take the responsibility of adulthood by using cop out excuses like everything is not black and white. While that is true to some extent, the vows you took to your spouses is black and white. There is never a good reason to cheat. It is always better to leave. You may not SAY anything bad about your husband, but your actions dishonour and disrespect him more than anything you can possibly say.

I feel sorry for your spouses because they are probably hurting inside but love you all more than you deserve. BTW. You are a mature woman, so you should know better than to just take a man's word. It is more than likely that he is getting sex at home and wants more - and like most other cheating men, once there are women willing to put out, there will be men willing to take more.

And you are crusading on the "I am the Other Woman" group because........

Caribgirl: No profile filled in, no stories written, no comments except ONE, this one.
Full it is of assumptions, allegations and accusations. Smells like cretain other 'moral majority' commentators and crusaders I've seen lately.

Sockpuppet anyone?

"Caribgirl", do you not understand that maybe some other people do NOT subscribe to your dogma? Hell, I dare say I don't even share the same concept of 'responsibility' with you, seeing how you (ab)use the word.

Oh Petrushka, I guess I should just be so happy that Caribgirl graced my post with all her words of wisdom.

,There are actaully 3 women on here who choose to comment on this post whom do not write any stories of their own??? Interesting.....part ot the EP moral majority, I guess...

It's too funny -- I wrote a fairly scathing comment on totallytea's post about being the other woman ... she's gone and edited the story, I am sure, because I read stuff in there that isn't now, about home breakers and how the other woman does or doesn't &gt;get the man&lt; -- and then she commented I never said "get a man".
(forgot the edit the last line though).

Who knows, maybe she really was stung, but if so she went in there with very unhealthy expectations and agenda. Starting an affair with someone in a relationship and expecting the person to abandon their family is not cool in my book.

You are absolutely correct! Once it gets to that point where you expecting more from the relationship than you agreed on in the first place you have lost control of your emotions. What strikes me as so interesting is that most women cannot understand the concept of having a relationship with a man based on something other than a marriage. Yet if they treat their husbands like dirt and they go elsewhere, that other woman is a *****. I know it works both ways. . I would not be in an extracurricular affair if all was fine at home. Am I allowing it to happen? Yes! Do I understand the consequences? Yes! However, I do hope he returns at night to her and I hope he stays there to take care of his life responsibilities. I cannot provide him with all he needs and I don't want to. He does the same for me.

They are only the "moral authority" in their own minds, in their own little fairy tale worlds of happily ever after. Yet deep down... they believe all their husbands are wolves in sheep's clothing. Now me, I am looking for that wolf....with the red roses!

Wow, I'm not suprised thats all it takes! Red Roses..lmao! Im willing to bet if he shows up without roses, you'll still have him in the rack in RECORD TIME!

I just realized...you really are as stupid as you sound! :(

As for you ray, calling us trolls....maybe the person who was "trolling" you finally figured out YOU CANT TALK SENSE TO PEOPLE WHO HAVE NONE!
Thats what is really going on here! You dont want to hear what people really think about your cheating ways..you go live in your dirty fantasy world...I bet youre one of those perves who look at naked women on the internet and play with yourself! Goof!

Blondie, I am sorry how could I possibly think that you would understand something that is abstract symbolism. Interesting analogy, don't you think? Sorry,those are big words, aren't they?

Ray, do you think she knows the definition of a troll on the internet?

LOL! Looking forward to the AM! I hope she thinks about us all night....

Ray,
Goof!

Oh ha ha ha...Kelki that means you ll be thinking about me all night!

Of course you think I cant spell, because YOU CANT..TOO FUNNY!

Ray, you didn't get rid of your troll! She got rid of you! I can see how just communicating with you garbage can bring you down to your level and frankly, no one wants to be that low with you guys...but I'll play a little, because this is FUN!
But, I do have a life....and venting to you cheaters and liars is somewhat very thereputic! Thanks for letting me vent!
Catch up with you ..later...looking forward to all your posts! Keep them coming!

Dwork? again LMAO! GOOF. ..I like that better for you.

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Very well put across.

marriage is not just about sex, so you make him feel good give him what he wants make him feel like a real man, but guess what he goes home to her and you are left alone. The only thing he dosent do with you is leave the money on the bedside table,dont kid yourself if the choice came for him to choose between you or his wife honey you would lose every time. Sex is a very small part of a marriage important may be but not the be all and end all. How much respect do you have for yourself if you are willing to settle for a few secret hours of sex with another womans husband you will always be second best.

I am not asking him to choose. He is not asking me to choose. What we do choose is to fill in the part of our marriages that is nonexistent. Yes, I agree sex is such a small part in a marriage BUT then there are thousands of people on here saying it is important. Sex is a basic human function but also a deep shared emotion. I am sorry both of us do not have sensual minded spouses but we do recognize other elements of the marriage as being important too. We simply cannot function in these marriages without sex. .

I get tired of the double standards set by the EP moral majority. He could just as well be a gigolo as I am a *****. Neither one of us is bearing our spouses any ill will. We just realize after years of sparse sex, this is the solution for now.

Kelki, just look at the way the commentator writes. Cannot even form a proper sentence ... and that is only a reflection of their wooly thinking.

Realistically speaking: do I care what some sheeple thinks about how I live my life in awareness, in the here and now? What difference does it make to me? Oh, they can be annoying, they can be hostile and abusive, but really, can't we take the high road and take their noises for what they are: the bleating of the herd?

More power to you, for choosing your own road, and thinking your own thoughts.

-P.

Thank you Pertrushka! Your support and understanding means so much. AND You are so right. Kisses and hugs!

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I enjoyed reading your story,very well written.It was shocking reading the comments to me also.Very hateful!!
I must say in the end it is something I have come to expect from women,some stay on that moral high ground and feel it is completely acceptable to judge and throw stones while living in glass houses.
How about learning a lesson from this story?If you refuse your partner the intimacy and closeness they desire?If you believe that being a log in bed is sufficient and he/she should shut up and accept it?Then you are asking for them to seek it elsewhere,and like a grown up you need to accept it takes two..Having that ring on your finger does not mean you get to treat someone anyway you please, and expect that they should accept it.
Moral of the story...You want your guy (if he is truly one of the good ones) to stay faithful,stop throwing a fit and satisfy him in every way and then maybe you would not have to worry about another woman IMHO...People resort to name calling when they simply can't support their claims ..

Thanks Isabella! The log in bed senario happens so often. I think that is the reason these harsh comments mean so little. It is very hurtful to know that your spouse is so far removed from you in this very important element of your marriage.

If I could have had just 50% of what you recommending...If only. It is great to hear/read responses from the ladies. thank you so kindly.

Kelki, your story has received lots of attention and I'm surprised that you kept your composure after each harsh comment.

Not that I condone your actions, but contributors need to keep in mind that throwing stones does nothing to benefit you and shows how little love or compassion they have in their hearts. Why does anyone think that stomping on the emotions and feelings and character of anyone on this site beneficial in any way? I realize we are "online" and "anonymous" but we are nonetheless real people.