I Applaud "The Other Woman"

I've looked through this "experience" and have read comments made by both sides. One against "the other woman"...and one supporting. I'm not out to hurt anyone, just merely wishing to provide my experience.

Sometimes, speaking from experience, the "other woman" is actually "the" woman. I'm currently trapped in an existing relationship that for all practical purposes leads me to be an emotional, physical, and psychologically imprisoned husband at every received text, phone call, or key insert into my home. After approaching nearly 2 decades of increasing torture with a wife that is defined as bi-polar, with borderline personality disorder, extreme paranoia, anger displacement, and "a smidge of other things" ' as the doctors, counselors, and social workers have informed me...i'm exhausted and drained.

I applaud my so called "other woman"..."The Woman" for standing side by side with me; emotionately supporting my children and I when needed; and providing a refuge for any little thing. This incredible "other woman" restored my faith in the female ability to nurture and be feminine. This "other woman" has my back, guided me through the most destructive time in my life, dusted me off, and kept me on point. I know it has hurt her, like the Ode to a Grecian Urn, but she has my total love and respect forever.

Any "other woman" that can be supportive of her man, be his inspiration, make him smile, bring life to a dead soul, and show the true beauty both inside and out of a truly feminine woman...has my support. For those of you that despise the "other woman" I suggest you take a long hard look at yourself, and find out why there is the "other woman"; what you're afraid you can't, won't, or haven't offered your man, and how you can be supportive of him. We don't need much, just be a friend and confident, and show a touch of caring love. If you even look at how it is all phrased you have "the woman" and the "other woman"...the only difference is two letters...but combine them and they become "or". Be supportive of your man "or" let a true woman take your place.
seeinglife2x2 seeinglife2x2
46-50, M
37 Responses Apr 12, 2013

Very well said. It is more difficult being a responsible father than I ever imagined and if the mother shuts down and does not support you, the door is open and a need exists. A sad but true fact. It is wrong to condemn others when you refuse to understand what is going on in their world.

Hm... I think that you're a great person. You're there to help your fairly violent wife, it seems. I'm not very experienced in this field, but I think that if the "Other Woman" is okay with being in that position, then it's fine.

This part is addressed to those making nasty comments:
This is not your life. You have not been in this EXACT situation, down to the colour of the walls. I bet that you, like me, are just going on what you've been taught. If you have been in a similar situation, then you might be able to give better advice. This people have made their choices, it isn't up to you to judge them.

I wish you both the best of the luck in future days!

That's awesome! I really hope you guys have a wonderful life together.

Sorry to state the obvious but....... I guess I feel pity for the other man or woman. When reading these stories you all sound like intelligent folks. Just a question. Do you all believe the stories the cheater tells you about the "crazy wife" or "evil husband"? By definition , when you look at it practically, they are all liars and cheats. They lie to their spouses, kids, parents, lifelong friends, churches ect. But YOU are the only one they are truthful with? They love and need you so much that they but just can't seem to care enough about you to honor you with commitment. I know as well as anyone, when lonely we will imagine a love that isn't there. Are you really content to be someone's "sort of mate". I think we all deserve all of someone, not just the one that fills in only when they are upset with their spouse. Why else would they hide you? Why aren't you THE person in their life? The rationalization we can make when we want to believe something so much. I wish you all the very best. At the end , your whole relationship is based on a facade. A foundation of lies. Don't we all deserve real love? Not just when it's convenient for the cheater you love?

Loved it and you speak the truth!!

We are Angels to them ,we help them get threw life that was sucked out of them by their Wives . Bravo to you hischelsea !!

Wow, well said and thank u for appreciating her.

Your still an adulterer.good luck with that....

Thank you for writing this. The man I love is in a very similar situation. What many people don't understand about multiple personality and bi-polar (and my god the combo!) is how volatile and abusive the person can be to those around them, especially those closest to them.

My situation is similar, except at this point my MM and I are more friends that love each other. Over the years I have gotten to know his wife through his experience and through some very ugly confrontations from her. I actually have a lot of compassion for her and what she has suffered in the past, and I do understand in part why he stays....and why I continue to be supportive to him. It does get hard, though. He is ok with me dating...and I do. But it's just never quite what he and I have.

Your logic doesn't make sense, you say you need the other woman to support you and your children since your wife is so difficult but nothing you've said explains why you're still with her. If your other woman is so important why not just marry her instead and split with your current wife?? Your children have accepted her after all so there's no issue there and you don't seem to care for your wife much

Obviously people do change but like I said if the children do accept you then there should be no problem with the parents splitting up. Plenty of kids live with divorces parents so what would make them any different

The thing is I know what it's like to be one of those kids, if it came to a split he would easily get fully custody and supervised visitations for the mother to see them. Yes it's good of him to put them first but sometimes taking them away from a destructive environment is for the best

Only because people unnecessarily overcomplicate things. Divorce is stressful but it's better to endure it rather than put up with a lifetime of stress and strain

You can't make blanked statements like that - particularly if you haven't walked in someone else's shoes.

People have gotten full custody for less, system unfortunately doesn't work as well as it should

True, and I'm not trying to disrespect you ... coming from a father who did the same as in your situation, didn't make my life choices easy when it came to men. I've made brutal mistakes. Let's hope he doesn't have daughters that witness a back and forth and supportive GF in the picture with a bi-polar mother. This does have an effect on the children, and yes this is just my opinion ...

"He stays for the children ..." .... the oldest excuse in the book. So if you are the OW, how does it feel to share someone? Never thought of having a man of your own? Just sayin'

I have a bridge in London for sale - Would you be interested in buying it?

I'm happy you are happy with yourself Chelsea for now - that MM is very jealous of his Ws new BF. She might not have seen her children that much but I'll bet she's seen plenty of him.

Personally I feel sorry for his W it sounds as though her whole family has turned against her. He must be a perfect Narcissist in order for that to happen. I'll bet she Survives better though. Betrayed Spouses always do and that Wayward always regrets Losing them. It might take time but ... That story isn't finished yet;

Slither hit a pedestrian a few years ago and bolted. A homeless lady seen her and got the plate. Hubs turned her in since she was driving his car but turned right around and used connections to get her out of it. He didn't want me to ask questions so it all had to disappear.

How do you know where my sympathy lies? Assumptions are often wrong. Just saying.


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My God thank you for taking the time to write this. Your true woman, is a very lucky woman, for she has found a good and true man.

Wowwwww !!!!!!!!! That was great .

I truely want to be the safe place for my mm to fall but lately i have been selfish. I miss him... i want to spend time together and i am not my beautiful self.

I just told him that I will stop seeing him because I cannot take this anymore. I told him neither of us deserve to hurt. He told me that he understands me and that he was sorry to cause me pain. He also told me that if he became single, I am going to be the first one to know about it.
His wife can be a very controlling person. She manipulates him with the kids and have the kids talk to him every time they have an argument. To me, this is very immature and irresponsible because the kids have nothing to do with their marriage not working out.
Besides being in love with him, I feel sorry for him because he is a great father, hardworking, caring, sweet, compassionate, loving and he can also be a great husband if given a chance. He filed for divorce months before we met, but again, she used the kids to keep him from leaving and she even went to a couple of counseling sessions, but after a few days, she became herself again. Now, he is afraid to leave because of his kids. He does not want them to suffer, and he wishes that a divorces didn't affect them.
To me, being in love with a married man is very wrong because I am messing with another woman's man and I don't feel like I am enough for him because he won't leave. It hurts me deeply when he says he can't talk or text me at the moment because she's there. When we meet, he has to leave real quick because she will start calling and asking where he is. There was this time she called him 11 times until he had to answer.
I am very confused and sometimes I wish he would've not pop into my life like this. He is the kind of man I have always dreamed of spending my life with, but I cry almost every night for him, and weekends are worse...


Hi, how are you? It is so very painful being the OW. I was too but he told me he was separated when the affair began. He too is kind, compassionate but I truly believe you should move on with your life. The roller coaster of emotions will just continue. I am so happy that I broke free from the pain, I was unhappy more than I was happy! I only see that now because when you are with them, the high was a feeling I had never experienced before but, when not with them the low was the lowest and that's when I knew this relationship wasn't healthy. Look after yourself and protect your heart.

You need to get away from this man ... I understand, its like a drug addiction, only multiple it by a million ...love is the highest feeling one can ever have, but involvement with a MM only involves hurt for you. Been there for 4 years and was eventually dumped like a piece of trash when he found the next best a$$ to jump. Do I still miss him everyday? Absolutely, but I know that if I never would've left this situation, I'd be worse off than I am today. Forever guessing, never being to call, a roller coaster of emotions will lead you to a chaotic mental health state. I now suffer from depression, anxiety and have self-esteem issues, despite being a 'beautiful woman' ... don't get to my point and become a shell of who you used to be ...

This post actually made me feel less awful about myself so thank you! It really means a lot. It made me look at my situation in a different, better way.

Wow. This was beautiful to read. My ex-MM is not in a marriage like yours at all - his wife sounds awesome, maybe just not awesome for him - so I don't know if I do all of that for him, but wow do I wish he had appreciated me like that when we were together. I was instead viewed as "temptation" that he needed to move to a new state to avoid. Glad to see not all of you are like that!

Thank you for your kind comments! She is even more special today than yesterday and tomorrow she will be yet more special. I am truly blessed!

Good morning ladies! A little birdie told me there was a bit of a thread going on here....felt i would pop in. "OW"...sorry i've been offline for a bit...terribly busy work schedule and adventures with the kids.
Anyway...stand strong you wonderful OW...the "trolls" you mention...well quite frankly.....just haven't been able to provide a good debate in my opinion. They have their perspective...which is beneficial i feel - as it shows the limited logic and understanding possessed in some sects of society.
To the Non-OW....thank you for your continued responses - each and every simplistically derived non-logical rambling reminds me of why the OW plays such a significant and supportive role in supporting her man.
Alright "non-ow"....give me the best you got...I'll be back online tonight or tomorrow sometime....I have a date later tonight. Hugs and kisses!

Hello ladies!.........Chelsea - are you mentally sparring with your food again? Let's save that energy shall we....and channel it differently....I find your mental sparring to be quite a turn on....intelligence is quite erotic....and when matched against lesser wits....makes you an even more incredible woman!

As a gentleman, who also has an incredible OW...might I ask for a bit of an insight as to why you think it is wrong given the presented circumstances?

Actually I didn't know you were blocked. I'm honestly just asking why you think it's wrong. This is just me asking is all. No I didn't discuss it with the wife, but I don't feel I have a wife as she has voided that commitment via her actions. She is not loving or caring etc. That was the wedding agreement we made in front of a couple hundred witnesses. She voided that commitment by her actions and untreated issues. I've found an incredible OW that is totally wonderful. The only thing I have with the wife is a legal paper. Just curious as to why you think it's wrong to find someone and fall in love.

I'm simply wishing to enjoy some life, it is the wife's desire to not improve her mental health and in doing so she has ruined the family. So, if I can greatly improve the family (children's situation) I i will seek to do so. The children come first. In essence I'm also confirming your statement that there very well may be a direct correlation between women with mental illness not wishing to get better...and men that realize this fact and seek mature women.

I was trying to ask shelly the following...but i think she tossed on the surrender towel and blocked me. Attempted to post: I don't understand why you are upset, I've merely asked what was wrong with finding a supportive individual. I can assure you my wife has a clinical declaration of bi - polar with bpd. For confirmation I present a box full of psych rx's. Mental illnesses may go un-diagnosed for lengthy times if not addressed promptly. Until everyone stopped being patient and helping her, her true dementia/psychosis never fully arose. Just for clarification, do you have any medical or statistical background education on mental issues?

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Sooooo let me get this straight... Lostchild is a "child" because one of her parents had an affair thus should not be spoken to about it...But it's perfectly ok for her to come to this specific story and basically attack this man and family. Then, this family needs to be attacked personally and continuously because they are making different choices than her. Unless I am missing something...is this the OW who "messed" up her family? Yeah! I don't think so. That, I believe, is a troll...

Sounds like she loves you very much. You two are lucky to have each other.

To all those throwing stones as trolls so often do, unless you've lived through this...You really don't know! This story is not written by a man that has his cake and eats it too...but one whom had to climb many mountains and has now reached a place of refuge... Blessings to all on the twisted,rocky journey of life!

Wow, you spent a long time thinking about this, haven't you? How, you're not actually that bad of a guy at all. What's so wrong with it? You love your poor, deranged wife. You love and respect your supportive OW. The kids aren't at all affected, they enjoy the love and support from her too! Your daughter won't feel she will have to accept not being her husband's one and only--that the man's needs and wants are more important than hers. That it is her 'job' to remain sexually enticing and accept her place at the beckon call of him. How she must never suffer mentally..or else. Your son that will find that he only needs to have love and devotion to mother of his children so long as she is constantly able to give him pick-me-ups. That "for better or worse" is one sided in his favor.
I hope your OM feels the same way when you die of heart disease and she finds she's not on the life insurance. I hope she won't feel she wasted her life with someone who did not choose her.

If you truly respect your wife, your kids, AND your 'OM'-- you will make her your wife and still give the mother of your kids the respect and care she needs.

I appreciate and applaud you for the support of the OW. I am an ex-OW and proud of it. Your kinds words said it all:) Thank you.

i really love this explanation...so true on many levels.

It's always so easy to sit in judgement on people. Sorry mate you are just going to have to ignore them as best you can. Hang in there and good on you for sticking up for your lady. She deserves it.

I use to be the person who always criticized others and thought bad of them if they had multiple baby daddy's or had an affair with a married man or woman etc..... People really need to watch what they say about other people cause you will someday find yourself in that same situation with someone else casting the stones.

I think this is a good story! Makes me really think about my situation, Thanks for the story!

Hey tricks!
Thank you for your comment! I appreciate your perspective regarding rats. Unfortunately I must admit you have me at a disadvantage, as I'm unaware of the first-hand "smell" of rats. Rats run hidden in sewer sludge and empty lifeless places, so I value your input having had proclaimed your expertise in rat knowledge-seeming gained first hand. I stand tall and proud and love the other woman that stands by my side-so thank you for your perspective as I feel even more grateful that I can smell the daffodils....and not wallow in sludge. Daffodils are always blooming....I recommend you try smelling the flowers and do away with the sludge. Kindest regards!

It was a figure of speech obviously but you bing a supposed "professional " you would know that and you're sarcasm does not go unnoticed. My problem with you is not that you love HC my problem is with how you are treating your mentally ill wife. I fully understand,as i have said before, what goes into a marriage with a mentally ill person, it takes a lot more time a patience to love them then normal relationships. Obviously you were not cut out for such a union. Which leads to my questions, most of which you have left unanswered, such as how long into or before the marriage did you realize your wife had these problems? See its all about the length of time you have been married and known she has problems. You may no longer care for your wife and may find her dangerous but she needs a voiced in this. A completely innocent party in all of this mess she has no say so in your actions and I'm sure while hc loves you unconditionally she would rather you take your children from the home and move in with her in yet you don't with all this documented evidence of abuse you would think you would have left long ago.

Don't even bother Tricks.... there's none so blind as those who cannot see.

Clearly Chelsea has fallen for this man and all his lines..... personally, I doubt his wife is even really that crazy (otherwise he would've left, and taken the kids with him), and even if she has done things that are a bit, hmmm, nuts, it's probably because her philandering husband has been gaslighting her and driving her mental for years. FOR example making out that she is paranoid and delusional when she questions his fidelity (though we all know the reality on that one, don't we!)

However there's no convincing Chelsea. She doesn't WANT to face the reality because it would hurt to realise he's been stringing her along. She chooses to believe him, because she wants to believe he "loves" her rather than accept that actually noone loves her, least of all this lying, cheating married man. Likewise, there's no point telling the man himself because he's not about to come clean with ANYONE. Maybe he has even managed to convince himself of his bullshit!

Don't worry; what goes around comes around and I've seen it too many times to not believe it; this guy will get his dues. Sadly, so will Chelsea.

Ignorance must be bliss i suppose. its funny he believes he is mentally superior to me but when i lay the logic right infront of him he chooses to ignore it lol. You are right sugarpie its sad he has to drag her down with him though.

@tricks: Thank you for your comment! I appreciate your input. Yes, as a matter of fact, I can have my cake...and eat it too...both from the other woman who is a phenominal baker....she possesses all the qualities of a true woman. I wish you much joy and happiness and hope your Easy-Bake oven of maturity comes with a replacement bulb...for the one currently installed does not appear overly bright.

Smh i speak from the wife's perspective true. I don't know what its like to be the other woman. But I can always smell a rat and you good sir smell of a rat so strong i can smell you through the internet.

Again if you"love" her so much why is she your side bit?

Well, it appears my Applauding of "The Other Woman" has created quite the stir. I've received comments supporting my writing, denouncing my writing, and some that are quite frankly.....simplistically ignorant of the facts alone.

For those incredible women who have supported my opinion and view...you have my heartfelt appreciation and adoration...and I thank you on behalf of all the men you have or will stand behind as support.

For those that asked excellent questions...."Hischelsea" has summed up the case honestly and sincerely.

For those of you that have ignorantly denounced my opinion and view and commented on other things not being the main subject of "supporting the other woman"...I can see and understand your limitations-since you were unable to actually address the subject of "the other woman". You have my pity and my sympathy as you deal with your limitations.

I will not individually bash a single "poster" on this topic - I enjoy the comments-the negative as well as the supportive. The immature negative comments re-inforce the desire to be with "the other woman" as the arguments of some of the simpler postings confirm that a higher degree of intelligence is available. The negative immaturity merely enhances the "everything positive" the other woman provides.

I hold no grudges or anger towards
ANY person who has commented. I thank you all for taking the time to respond! I'm still searching for some answers; providing the best protection for my children; following the legal advice of an excellent law firm; and enjoying my own tiny piece of life with my very special "other woman".

I'd still like to hear comments regarding my adoration of "the other woman" as that's the primary subject of the inital post. If you're unable to post regarding that....well....I can't really explain it in any simpler terms.

How about you stop being a coward and using your kids as an excuse to keep having your cake and eating it to.Its ok karma will get you :)

Seriously if she was really that bad, if it was really all documented and all the various government agencies really had an open file on her, then it's pretty much guaranteed that he'd get 100% custody if he left.

In our country, the various agencies would be just as likely to take the kids away anyway, as they are being exposed to risk just by being in the same home as an abusive parent.

It's a very long, expensive uphill battle for someone to get access to their kids once they've lost them due to abuse.

So I've with Tricks on this one. Something doesn't add up.

Two decades he's been with her? So how long has she been mental for, and how old are the kids? If she was really that nuts the OP would have known long before they had babies (so shame on him for knowingly bringing children into an abusive situation). If she really was that dangerous, any DECENT parent would take the kids and run, in order to keep them safe.

Thank you sugarpie! Its a horrible situation to bring kids into knowing she was mentally ill then cheating on her? come on now

No harrie i was not aware and my husband is not a danger to my children the only thing that has to fear him is the $150 dollar punching bag i bought him for Christmas but thank you for your concern and another attack


Come on harrie even country thinks its weird.

Because he doesn't bring danger to my house duh. I would leave if i even got an feeling he was going to be dangerous or throw him out but he's not and won't stand for others to endanger his children that is the difference. He doesn't yell at them he wouldn't dream of hurting them in anyway. He doesn't use them as pawns he knows they are innocents and he will protect them at all cost. there i. lies the difference between my husband and his wife.

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Lol repeating that i know nothing when I'm living with a person with bipolar? you are clueless

Ok ill say it.again this time word for word so you understand. take...........the.......kids.........with........him.....if she.is.the.one with the job then he is lying about.how bad her mental illness is. simply put people with bipolar tend to be narcissistic they care about themselves and if she has been diagnosed then she has it on paper which means she can ger disability soooooo someone is lying

ewhatever you needto actually stop and think Chelsea why is he still with her if she is so dangerously mentally ill how long has he known ? why isn't she on meds and if life is so terrible why is he still there with the kids?? or have her commited

I can handle the comments, no problem, I'm a professional at dealing with all issues. I have children that have clouded vision, a teenager with...well...childish spoiled views. I know the ramblings of an unmedicated person, I know the pitiful cry for attention of a person without a life. They are merely "words" that carry no weight. But they do provide me and all of the "other women" with the simple proof that ignorance does exist.

A professional my tail end i maybe nice to them but i will not be nice to you my husband has type one bipolar with boarderline personality disorder skitzo tendencies. I go through hell everytime he hits a manic episode everytime one of his triggers are set off but i would never cheat i would take my kids and leave before i would do that!!!!! And btw if she is as bad as you say she is you can take full custody. so don't tell me i don't know what I'm talking about.

I understand your view, I'm sorry you have to go thru similar circumstances. The highly paid attorney said I could get full custody-no problem. Supervised visitation-no problem. But....down the road in a couple years if she takes her medicine and can prove "fitness"...and get 50/50..then I'm unable to protect them from her retribution towards me. She uses the kids as pawns to incite violent arguments. This will happen if I'm not there. The calls from a child in a closet have proven it. DFS has a case on her, the court system is also aware. Basically I'm stuck.

Doesn't sound like it it sounds like you can get the kids if dfcs has a case on her it will be hard for her to get 50/50. I know all about how they view mental illness i used to work with them on a private duty case i had. They hate mentally ill parents and will do their best to keep the child with the non mentally ill parent. so try again. You get no sympathy from me. I feel bad for her and for Chelsea. If you knew she was so dangerous you would have left a long time ago. My husbands case is bad but luckily he has stayed on his meds or i would have left.

Don't tell me i have no clue what I'm talking about can you imagine how hard it is for her to get through everyday??I see it everyday its a struggle for them to even get up in the morning especially if not medicated! Cps is not about family unity when the.children are at risk and it sounds like they are! I'm suprised they are even in the home at all.

I'm a nurse not a case worker FYI not intimidated i just know someone is lying

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I'm actually not angry at you ladies thanks to one who actually talked to me.

Well. he is not an ow or an om. you can report me all you want i didn't say anything truly wrong! He is cheating on his mentally ill wife! If he wanted to he should leave her if she is as bad off as she said he could get chikd custody and then what's his excuse? I get it you love the guy but wake up! If your daughter had a mental illness how would you feel if her husband didn't leave her and just had a relationship? Its not fair to her! Just leave her and move on with your life! Two decades? makes me wonder how long he knew she had a mental illness

oh goodness you could actually have described my MMs situation at home but he has also has some physical violence as well . He is currently not antagonising his wife as she has threatened to wreck his sons wedding in May . We have to make sure she does not find out about me as she has threatened to stab him if he leaves him and that is not even for another woman . We are putting our plans in place to be together and he knows he will then have a partner who loves and adores him and will not control him with emotional and physical threats . Your words are exactly how my MM has described how i make him feel . I have saved him and shown him what true love really is . His wife will only realise what a truly wonderful man he is when she has lost him. I have been in an emotionally abusive relationship so i know how it can wear you down and erase your confidence . My ex partner even wished our son who suffers from cerebal palsy dead so he could sell our house . Please take the necessary steps to leave your abusive wife and be happy . I have never looked back since removing my abusive partner from my life . its hard and energy draining but you have to do it if you want to move forward with your life .My thoughts are with you and if you need any support or advice I am here

Thats terrible . I live in the Uk and emotional abuse is recognised . My ex partner will have to go to court where they will assess him in depth if he wishes to see our son again .

Can you call the police if a partner is screaming and shouting at you ? In the Uk we are advised to log emotional abuse with the police and call them out as it all helps for proof towards injunctions and court cases

I am not tryih to be mean to you hischelsea i promised to be nice to the ladies on thie forum but i have no respect for a man who cheats on his mentally ill wife she can not help it. Its disgusting. She can't help that she has a mental illness.

Hey here's a crazy idea leave your wife pig. my husband has bipolar and i would never cheat on him. may i suggest your ow watch her back? If you wife finds out it will get ugly...just saying

Not to be rude, but what keeps you from divorcing the crazy wife?

Basically a poor legal system. A divorce could lead to 50/50 custody. Staying in provides a 6'1" 270lbs muscular wall my kids know is standing between her and them. Before she can get to them emotionally or physically...she'll need to go through me. 50/50 would mean I wasn't there for my kids. 100% presence gives them unmitigated support....I'll take any hits the wife can throw-emotionally or otherwise. It's all about the children.

I think that's an excuse. If you can show she is unfit (and it sounds like you could do that easily) you would win custody and guardianship. Consider too having her committed. It will help you document for court.

Staying in this situation only teaches your kids that this can be tolerated. How would you advise your child if his/her spouse acted like yours?


I love this and thank you... I have been the other woman and I was always there for him from friendship, laughter, tears, pain, sadness, love, sexual, made him feel he was my KING... I never told him NO not know. I was there when she was not, I made love when she would not, I held him, when she walk away, I laughed when she fussed, I cried, when she did not notice him, I gave him my all when she gave him nothing. Thank you for writing this. I wish you the best....

I applaud you! Many men are afraid of showing emotions at times, so for myself and all the other men that will read this and not post - I thank you and all of "the other women" for taking the strong stance of being more of a woman and companion and friend than we find ourselves imprisoned with for one reason or another.