I Stopped Believing At 10.

and never looked back! I don't call ,myself atheist, I dont call myself anything...Ive never believed in a higher power, either. Of course I don't believe in love. Or the big bang. Or extra-terrestrials. Crop circles? Nostradamus? Let's be realistic! Im a NON-BELIEVER. Did I mention that I'm from rome, italy?
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26-30
5 Responses Jan 17, 2013

Every phenomenon has a reason. For example we see that the leaves of a tree are shaking, we search for the reason and we understand that the wind is the reason………or someone dies (it is a phenomenon or better to say an event) we search for the reason and we understand that a sickness or something else is the reason. It is the same for everything, I mean everything has a reason

Now the question is this: What’s the reason of this whole world?

It's God,isn't it?

Have you ever looked at a simple pen? It has some different parts that someone or something has made and connected them together in a specific order so it works.Look at yourself and its order!Look at the world and its order! They are much complex than a pen, aren’t they?

There should be someone who has created and put them in a special order.Who could have created them except God?
Some people say Bing Bang or evolution or…..
Maybe they are right but who has created that core which has exploded or better to say who has created the explosion or the place of it? Planets has really placed in an exact place Have they really done that by themselves? Or maybe everything has completed in an evolution but who has created the first thing? Has the evolution happened by itself? Everything has really a specific rule. Has the evolution put the specific rule in the creation by itself? I don’t think so……

You sure have people thinking and typing here. ;) I like your colorful profile pic too. I don't have anything brilliant to say expect that my God is LOVE. He's all about giving people the free will to either love him or ignore him. I had the same choice and waffled tons of times. It's not an easy road, but I'd rather live with him and believe him even when circumstances (and sometimes well meaning people) say I'm nuts. Ever heard of a Jesus Nut? If I understand correctly it's the part of a helicopter that holds the blades on and keeps the craft in the air. Aptly named. Thanks for your honest post.

It is scientifically proven love exist. It is essential for human being to procreate and protect their families and all of that. There is not proof that god exists... besides why believe in a God that is always in a bad mood and wants to control every aspect of you. A god that has favorites. I am better of trusting science and living a happy life.

Really? Then how you think this whole universe was created? how life sustains on this earth, who created the STARS, SUM,MOON, what is the purpose of sending human to this earth?? etc etc, who created the first human being?? It was surely done by ALLAH (GOD)...

I am not talking about UFO or alliens etc i am talking about Real God the one who created this universe, u really thnk that a huge explosion created this universe in this perfect shape, every thing in this universe is in perfect order how come an uncontrolled explosion created this universe??

Yes i believe in God, i didnt join this group. Just wanted to hear the point of view of those who dont believe in God...

Yes but not satisfied, anyhow i can pray to Allah to show u the path i sincerely hope....

You can pray to whoever you like, if it makes you feel better. It certainly won't change anything for non-believers.

Don't say it makes you feel stupid. The stupid thing is to think there is some supremely powerful being who just snapped his (or her) fingers and created everything because he felt like it. The big bang didn't "create everything" which you find hard to believe, it started a process which over a period of about 13 billion years has resulted in a universe which includes living beings. To understand the big bang is certainly difficult, but it's far more credible than gods and allahs and so on. At least we have scientists trying to prove or disprove the origin of the universe. For the god or allah thing we have to believe books written by ignorant, supersticious shepherds 1700 years ago, and we are told we must have "faith". Why does an omnipotent god need us to have faith, when he could prove his existence if he wanted? The fact is it just doesn't exist.

Perhaps you might consider a more intellectual and less perfunctory study of nature and the universe?

"A little knowledge of science makes man an atheist, but an in-depth study of science makes him a believer in God." - Francis Bacon

“The first gulp from the glass of natural sciences will turn you into an atheist, but at the bottom of the glass God is waiting for you.”

“In the history of science, ever since the famous trial of Galileo, it has repeatedly been claimed that scientific truth cannot be reconciled with the religious interpretation of the world. Although I am now convinced that scientific truth is unassailable in its own field, I have never found it possible to dismiss the content of religious thinking as simply part of an outmoded phase in the consciousness of mankind, a part we shall have to give up from now on. Thus in the course of my life I have repeatedly been compelled to ponder on the relationship of these two regions of thought, for I have never been able to doubt the reality of that to which they point.”

–Werner Heisenberg, who was awarded the 1932 Nobel Prize in Physics for the creation of quantum mechanics (which is absolutely crucial to modern science).

“Those who say that the study of science makes a man an atheist must be rather silly.”

–Nobel Prize winning physicist Max Born, who was instrumental in the development of quantum mechanics.

“I believe that the more thoroughly science is studied, the further does it take us from anything comparable to atheism.”

“If you study science deep enough and long enough, it will force you to believe in God.”

–Lord William Kelvin, who was noted for his theoretical work on thermodynamics, the concept of absolute zero and the Kelvin temperature scale based upon it.

“Science is incompetent to reason upon the creation of matter itself out of nothing. We have reached the utmost limit of our thinking faculties when we have admitted that because matter cannot be eternal and self-existent it must have been created.”

–Physicist and mathematician James Clerk Maxwell, who is credited with formulating classical electromagnetic theory and whose contributions to science are considered to be of the same magnitude to those of Einstein and Newton.

Truth be told, neither can most. “Ex nihilo nihil fit”, they all say! In other words, something can't come from nothing. (Not Hawking’s mendacious pseudo-definition of “nothing” but the concept that describes the absence of anything; the state of nonexistence.)

If it could, why doesn't everything or anything? Why aren't dinosaurs, for instance, popping out of thin air, devouring everyone in sight? Why aren't we afraid of elephants suddenly popping into existence in the sky and crushing us as we walked down the street? If nothing can in fact produce something why would it discriminate? In the end, such an argument is nothing more than special pleading.

Since something can't come from nothing, then the natural questions that follow are, “Where did the universe come from 13.70 billion years ago?” and “What caused it to come into existence in the first place?” Whatever this cause is, it must possess certain necessary properties in order for it to be the cause of the physical space-time universe.

Therefore

(1) Whatever begins to exist has a cause.
(2) The space-time universe began to exist 13.70 billion years ago.
(3) Therefore, the space-time universe has a cause.

(4) The cause of the universe is a transcendent, beginningless, spaceless, immaterial, timeless, unchanging, omnipotent good personal being.
(5) A transcendent, beginningless, spaceless, immaterial, timeless, unchanging, omnipotent good personal being is the definition of God.
(6) Therefore, God caused the universe to exist 13.70 billion years ago.


Now, let’s take a closer look at this. First and foremost, this cause must itself be uncaused. Why? Because an infinite regress of causes is impossible; it can’t be turtles all the way down. (Lookup “Hilbert's Grand Hotel” if you're interested in a more in-depth analysis: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H2W2vduP22Q)

Second, this uncaused cause must transcend space-time because it itself created space-time. It is therefore, spaceless.

Third, since this uncaused cause exists beyond space and time it is must be a non-physical or immaterial cause. Why? Because physical things exist only in space – they have dimensions.

Fourth, this uncaused cause must necessarily also be timeless for the simple fact that it itself doesn't exist in space-time.

Fifth, it must also be changeless. As I'm sure you're well aware, all matter exists in a state of constant flux. This is especially apparent at the atomic level. Since this uncaused cause is immaterial it is not subject to the same forces that affect matter, therefore, it is unchanging.

Sixth, this uncaused cause is obviously unimaginably powerful, if not omnipotent, for it brought matter, energy, space and time into existence completely on its own.

So, to sum up, whatever it is that caused the universe to come into existence 13.70 billion years ago it must be beginningless, spaceless, immaterial, timeless, unchanging and omnipotent.

But we're not done for there are two more properties of this uncaused cause that we can deduce from what we know of the universe. For this we have to take a closer look at cause and effect. Here's what I mean: if a cause is sufficient to produce it's effect then the effect must also be present. The two are joined at the hip, so to speak. You can't have one without the other.

Let me borrow from an illustration to make this clearer. “Suppose that the cause of water’s freezing is the temperature’s being below 0°C. If the temperature were below 0°C from eternity past, then any water that was around would be frozen from eternity. It would be impossible for the water to just begin to freeze a finite time ago. Once the cause is given, the effect must be given as well.” (http://bit.ly/WQtgZY)

The issue is, if we have in fact a timeless, transcendent cause why isn't the effect permanent as well? In other words, if this timeless, transcendent cause actually caused the universe, why hasn't the universe always been around? How can a cause be eternal but its effect commence a finite time ago? We know the universe is about 13.70 billion years old but we've also deduced that whatever caused the universe must be transcendent and timeless.

The only way this is possible is if this timeless, transcendent, uncaused cause were also a free agent – a being with free will who can act of its own volition. As we all know, free will is the hallmark of personhood.

Last but not least, this beginningless, spaceless, immaterial, timeless, unchanging, omnipotent being must also be unimaginably good. Why? Suppose we concede for the sake of argument that he’s evil. Since this being is evil, that implies he fails to discharge his moral obligations. But where do those come from? How can this evil being have duties to perform which he is violating? Who forbids him to do the wrong things that he does? Immediately, we see that such an evil being cannot be supreme: there must be a being who is even higher than this evil being and is the source of the moral obligations which he chooses to shirk, a being which is absolute goodness himself. As such, there must necessarily exist a supreme being who is all powerful, all good and all loving; One who is the very paradigm of good.

So here we arrive at this uncaused cause of the universe 13.70 billion years ago that is beginningless, spaceless, immaterial, timeless, unchanging, omnipotent and personal being who is all good and all loving.

This is the very definition - of God :)

So, since you say something can't come from nothing, it can't come in the way suggested by Hawking, but neither can it come from a supreme being. However if we admit something can come from nothing because a supreme being decided it should be so, then it could also come from nothing in Hawking's way. Difficult to understand? Sure, but more believable than a god, in my opinion. And dinosaurs are not popping out of thin air all the time for the same reason that big bangs are not ocurring all the time. If you wait long enough you might see one appearing in your front garden, but be prepared to wait at least as long as the universe has existed. Finally, while I don't believe in a supreme creator, to an even greater extent I certainly don't believe in his supposed "goodness", at least towards humans. Perhaps his (or her) goodness was limited to creating the universe and then going home to watch TV for the rest of eternity, and humanity was just the result of his (or her) interlligent design. But in his creation there is certainly a great amount of suffering.

I. When have I ever suggested the universe came into being creatio ex nihilo?

II. Really? Do tell, how long would you have to wait for a dinosaur to pop into existence and eat you?

III. In order for your conclusion to be rational you need to prove there is no good reason God might have for permitting suffering in the world. Can you?

The difficulty here isn't really whether God exists or not. I think the difficult part is separating out the people who do and don't believe. Those who believe a God exists all seem to coincidentally share the same belief (roughly) about a God. I wonder if they had never been educated about this God, ever, whether they would still believe in it/him/her. I seriously doubt it. That's because God, like a lot of things, is something that people conceptualised, then perpetuated. It was done so long ago, and done so well, mixed with such great amounts of fear and mystery, (that back when people were quite literally stupid) people just "believed" what they were told. And that has sadly carried on and on for over 2000 years now.
Here are some things people who believe in God never seem to be able to answer with a direct straight fact-based answer...

1. Prove God exists...

2. There are over 2700 "Gods" that people on earth believe in. Which one is real and which ones aren't?

3. Apparently the various forms of suffering on earth are so we appreciate God when we go to Heaven. I can safely say that I am intelligent enough to comprehend / understand / appreciate how great God is, just fine without the suffering here on earth. So why is it we need to suffer again...?

4. Prove Heaven exists...

5. Does the devil exist? He does? right ok. So why does God need to punish us, when the devil is perfectly capable of providing enough suffering for us here on earth by himself? Anyway, I thought God was meant to be good...?

This universe is a big proof that God exists.. dont u thik that this whole system is managed by some super power or its just a coincidence ?

No, I don't think it's managed by a super power, and no I don't think it's a coincidence.

P.S water boils at 134 degrees exactly. Not 100 degrees.

Maximillian...

III. In order for your conclusion to be rational you need to prove there is no good reason God might have for permitting suffering in the world. Can you?

How dare you ask a non-believer to prove something to you!!!!! Non-believers have been asking for proof of God (actual fact based evidence - not theory or quotes which seems to be all you have in your armoury) for years and all we're ever told is we should "have faith" or "just believe".
You'll never get round the fact that there are some very simple rules (fact not theory) to prove God doesn't exist...
1. There is no factual proof or hard evidence, prove-able over and over again, of the existence of God.
2. If God exists, how is it possible that millions of people on earth don't believe in God? Please don't answer by saying God gave us the choice to choose to believe or not. That's about as strong an argument as me saying straight back to you "No one gave us the choice to believe in something, we either choose to or we don't".
3. How is it possible that different people believe in different Gods, each with different attributes and reasons for their behaviour and design of our universe? You simply can't have "competing truths", it's impossible, there can only be one truth.

The other mammals in the animal kingdom don't sit around theorising about the existence of a God or not. Why? Because their brains haven't developed enough over time (evolution essentially) to give them the ability to do that. Our human brains did develop enough to enable us to conceptualise. At the time that was happening, hundreds if not thousands of years ago, scientific reason to explain things quite literally didn't exist. Is it not possible that God and God's were simply a way by which humans tried to explain the things that they couldn't? Entrenched in fear, and indoctrinated with every generation, the human brain is so powerful it's emotional attachments to the things we learn about or are led to believe we simply can't let go of. There is plenty of proof that's the case everywhere in human life.

Science and religion have grown alongside each other together for hundreds of years. Science continually proving more and more reasons for things happening, and religion only ever asking people to simply "have faith" or believe" something is the way it is because of a God they can't prove exists.
To be quite honest and blunt, to me it's literally quite dumb and stupid to have blind faith in something. It's a very dangerous way to live life.
The reality is we are born, we live our lives, then we die. There is no reason or purpose for it, it just came in to existence through evolution, biology, physics and scientific law. Unfortunately we as humans are able to conceptualise that " maybe there's more to it than that!" when the reality is statistically proven to be far from it.
There is no proof of heaven, or hell, or that a God who designed everything, knows and controls everything is everywhere, simultaneously letting us choose whether to believe in him/her/it. There never has been any proof, there currently still isn't, and it's highly likely that there never ever will be any proof for any of these things.
So it comes down to one thing alone, as a human on this earth you can either choose to believe something someone said a few thousand years ago and was written down, back when people were far less intelligent than we are today, in a time when money bought you entry to heaven and escape from hell, or you choose to not believe it, and instead just live your life from a moral standpoint, based on the society you live in at the time you live in it.

I choose not to believe, but if you can give me a shred of evidence to believe I will genuinely honestly consider believing in God.

I have strong faith, strong beliefs that water will boil at 100 degrees. I believe religiously that it will happen. Why? It's happened for the hundreds of years of testing by people, since we had the ability to measure it. Time in, time out, excluding scientific anomalies, millions of times over and over again.

That's something worth believing in.

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