Dating Outside Your Race - Just Not Good Enough

Sadly people's opinions and reactions DO affect the way we relate to each other whether we like it or not. It just puts ideas into your head that maybe shouldn't or wouldn't be there otherwise. It is such a shame. Racism is one of those things that greatly infuriates me. It really shows how unevolved some human beings are.

There is nothing wrong with wanting someone thatlooks just like you. In fact ad human beings I think we are more inclined to be attracted to those that are like us. However, when you say that you will outrightly not even consider dating someone from a different race because you find that type of race unattractive I think questions must be asked. Do you mean that of an entire race there is not one single person that you would consider beautiful? I think this kind of thinking shows a great psychological inability to see a human being for their qualities as opposed to just seeing colour. Attractiveness is important, and people like what they like, but I think there is a lot to be said for people that discriminate against an entire race simply because they don't like their skin colour. I also think that anyone that says, "I don't find (insert race here) attractive" has some deep routed psychological issues that causes them to see an entire race as less attractive than another race. The idea that you would not find even a single person attractive within a whole race of people truly astounds me. So much so that I cannot even attempt to explain it because I simply don't understand it. But I agree that people that want to date only outside their own race have perhaps even bigger problems with their self image more than anything. That to me is really sad.

I believe that racism is DISCRIMINATION in any form based on the colour of ones skin. Whether it be with regards to picking someone for a job, or choosing a mate. If you will not select someone based on the colour of their skin, I am afraid that there is no other definition for that other than racism. You don't have to spit on someone to be considered a racist. Its all in the mind.

If you can acknowledge that people have the right to build families within their own culture, let me also suggest that not everyone dates "recreationally"; some date specifically to find a mate, and if the expectation is to find someone within the culture to continue their family and traditions, and raise children accordingly, it wouldn't make sense to get involved with someone who wasn't part of that culture, would it ? And it would not be fair to write someone off as a racist based upon that. Even Martin Luther King, Jr said, "I want to be the white man's brother, not his brother-in-law." Understand, it's not my issue; ironically, I'm the child of a very successful interracial marriage (56 years). And I've always found it fascinating that married to a black man, I was not seen to be interracially married, yet my sister, married to a white man, is.

I think you are misunderstanding my point. I am not knocking same race relationships. There is nothing wrong with that. What I think is wrong is dismissing someone purely because of their race. I can perfectly understand why someone would PREFER to date within their own race. That makes total sense. Preference says I prefer coffee but j don't mind tea. That still leaves the option to still have the tea if you can't get the coffee. So if someone said I prefer to date within my race but would not mind dating outside then that is fine. But I think to say I would never date outside my own race is a bit close-minded. There are so many beautiful people in so many different races and cultures out there. That is my opinion.

I think I get what you are trying to say though. Correct me if I'm wrong. What you're saying is that it does not make that person an out and out racist if they choose to date solely within their race. I would agree that the individual may not be an out and out racist indeed, but I would insist that their thinking in this particular instance is motivated purely by racism if that is what they are ultimately basing their decision on. To simplify racism, I just call it discrimination. Whether it be for good reasons or whatever, it is still discrimination no matter how its coated.

You're not hearing me, because I never accused you of that. I just suggested that everyone doesn't "date" with the same purpose. To you, a date might be a movie and dinner, just an evening out. To people in other cultures, a date is an audition for a spouse, and only that. And if the expectation is marriage as a means to establish a family and children within their traditional setting, dating outside that culture doesn't make sense. But that doesn't necessarily make them racist. I mentioned my situation only to illustrate that I can see and respect both sides of the issue.

Okay. I think we may be saying the same thing but saying it differently. Either that or we are not in agreement. When it comes to choosing a life partner should we really place tradition over love? Race over character? I get what you are saying though and I can understand why a person might choose to stay within their own race. I had not been thinking of this from that perspective. But I think what you speak of really is a matter of one being forced to conform by cultural constraints. They are not saying they don't like a particular race, or that they do not find other races attractive. Just that they would find it easier or perhaps more beneficial to marry within their race. I get that and though that is not what I was talking about here, I thank you for bringing another perspective to the argument. I posted this story mainly to challenge the idea of attraction not necessarily choosing a life partner.

It is very sad. It's tough when friends say those racist comments. It can affect you directly and indirectly in so many ways. Very sad indeed.

That's true, I've also seen other friends follow suit so to speak. I'm glad I have a strong, open mind and I am not affected in the same way my friends affect the others around them .

That certainly is very good. If only more people were as strong willed. :-)

Yes. Character before skin tone... What did happen to that?

I think preference is okay.

Preference is okay. Preference does not say NEVER. Its like, I prefer tea but I wouldn't say no to coffee. That's how I see preference. And you know, you might have been surprised, sometimes we project our own insecurities onto the people that are around us. So when we feel like we don't fit in, we think that everybody else around us doesn't think that we fit in. I actually believe that many a time we fail to recognise opportunities sometimes because of our own biases. Sometimes we are biased against ourselves. When you do that,you feel everyone is biased against you.

Wow. Thank you for such an in depth and thoughtful response mind purge (what an apt name). I agree with your views on this subject. Prejudice is often disguised under the term "preference". John Mayer just has the luxury of perhaps being more honest than most.

I don't know if you properly read BT's reply. Did you not catch the little snide comment about how I block people because I am too "dumb" to have an intellectual debate? That is what offended me about his response. Not his opposing opinion to my post. Please read the replies carefully.

Respect is all I ask for. Is that too much to ask?

No it's not too much. and I can fairly understand. Thanks for the reply.

THANK YOU!!! Your honesty and humility is refreshing. I appreciate your comment. If I could like it ten times I would. I totally agree with you. Culture or heritage does play a big role in our lives. So when you choose a mate it is not unwise to take those things into consideration. As you say, their culture might make you uncomfortable, and your culture might make your partner uneasy as well. But if you do find someone who is just the one for you, issues like that can become none issues. What I like the most about your post is that you acknowledge that though you would be wary of someone from a different background, you would not dismiss them solely on that basis. That is the essence of this post, and you have captured it brilliantly. Thank you.

Well for some of us we do have one tradition in the south. "Mama always told me not to make fun of someone else unless you first make fun of someone else!" Don't get me started on some of the jokes I have heard some of them farm boys tell about sheep. Baaaaah!

Haha... I think Mama was a wise woman. :-) As far as the sheep go... Baaaaah! Say no more. Hahaha...

I totally agree. There is a thin line between preference and prejudice. And I guess you are right about the inevitablity of having or developing a preference at one point or another. Thanks for the description of the WANTED male. I shall keep an eye out. I'll certainly be enquiring about that "finders fee" that you mentioned there. :-) Thanks again.

I'll try to be generous with that fee! I thanks for reading through my bizarre typos--I kept referring to "gals" instead of "guys." Maybe I'm a closet lesbian after all!! LOL!

You know I did wonder. But hey, to each their own. I shall not judge thee. :-) Lol

Well said! You are absolutely right. I believe everyone has a particular taste. I am an black woman that loves black men, but amongst them I prefer, the red toned ones, but I'm married to a very dark man. I have dated outside my race and honestly I didn't see them as a race. I find all type of cultures have very attractive people inside and out and if my husband would have turned out to be any kind of race I would love him, not because of his complexion, but because he is everything I wanted in a man.

Bravo! It's the person inside that matters, not the colour of their skin. Forget race, every culture has it's beautiful traits and it's beautiful people, not so attractive traits and not so attractive people. Just treat people as individuals. Thanks lilredmonkey. Love that name by the way. :-) Lilmonkey...

Thank you Ladyryan for your response. I wanted to present one side of racism in this post. There are many. To be a racist one does not have to hate or reject. Seeing another race as not equal, not worthy, not "good enough", these are things that make up racial prejudice. It isn't one thing, it is many things. Imagine I took the most beautiful people in the world and lined them up. Imagine one person comes along and says, all these people are beautiful, except for that Asian woman. Because I have never been attracted to Asian women. NOTE, we are talking strictly about physical appearance here. Would you say that that individual has a valid point, and that simply because the woman is Asian, that is a good enough reason to dismiss her, based on the fact that she is Asian alone? Wouldn't you say that person is crazy? Surely a beautiful woman is beautiful regardless of her skin colour or ethnicity. It's not about forcing someone to date other people, it's about acknowledging the beauty in diversity. If someone came up to me and said, I think all black women are unattractive, even Beyonce. I would think that person was insane. Wouldn't you?

Yes, and I am with you. The way OP puts it, if you don't choose to date a Quasimodo then...you are a racist. He may claim that is not what he meant, and that may be because it is clear enough that he lacks the ability to accurately convey his thoughts...that or they are ill formed to begin with and I suspect both. That is why he blocks a rough reply because he hasn't the emotional or intellectual capacity to be able to cope with it, and quite frankly it appears that he views his own opinions are too fragile to defend.

BluTravlr - Did you read some of the offensive remarks left behind? I am well up for a good debate, but I will not tolerate any form of disrespect on any of my posts. Never have never will. If you wish to make a valid contribution to a story of mine, do so, but do so respectfully. Insulting my intelligence by claiming that I have none really won't get you far. I give what I expect in return. I respect you, you respect me, and vice versa. If you cannot be respectful, then please do move along. There are people with good manners and the common decency to respect each and every individual no matter what their point of view is. So if you have no actual valid point to add to this post, then I suggest you stop throwing little snide remarks because I WILL block you. And this is not to say that I cannot hadle an intellectual debate. This is simply to say that I WILL NOT deal with idiots who have nothing better to do than to stir up unnecessary trouble. I sincerely hope that you are not one of those idiots.

Lady and gypsy...noone is asking you to date someone just because of their skin color...they are just saying its questionable when you exclude someone soley because of their skin color...meaning if you met the perfect partner is every way but they were a different race and you refused to date them for that sole reason it would be racist.
That's all.

Dente neither I am saying that I am forced to date someone. But the post needs to take a stand against all kinds of opinion. Things might have been different if the introductory sentence was closed by a question mark "If you will not date someone because of the colour of their skin it would be fair to say that you are a racist (?)" Then maybe we wouldn't be so sensitive throwing in comments based on generalized opinions. And I have to agree with you, things can turn to different story when one can find the perfect partner inspite of their race.

It would be interesting to dive into the mind of someone that says they are not attracted to a particular race of people. I would ask this question - "Do you mean to tell me that of this entire race, there is not one individual that you find attractive?" It sounds kinda scary when you put it that way don't you think? Personally I believe that there are many forms of racism. Anything that constitutes discrimination against or favour towards one race would in my eyes be a form of racism. Some forms of racism are just more subtle than others. But it's still racism if you're discriminating purely on the basis of the colour of one's skin.

If it is truly discrimination, then yes I agree that is racism. But I don't believe physical attraction plays into that. FOR THE MOST PART. It may to some degree and in some circumstances, but FOR THE MOST PART, I don't think so.

Well we are talking about racism here. Race is determined by ones skin colour. That is purely physical. If we were talking about cultures or nationalities then maybe perhaps we could say that there is something more to it than just the colour of ones skin. I think when talking about issues pertaining to race, we are just talking about the physical appearance. Although discrimination does occur for many different reasons such as culture, nationality, social standing, income etc.

Ok, well if you want it cut and dry like that, then I would have to go with who a person is attracted to is NOT racism. I myself (BEFORE I GOT MARRIED ; ) ) dated men of different races. One was black, one was Armenien (?), two were Asian. I liked those guys a lot. But they just didn't do much for me. The one that DID happened to be like me, Caucasian, but with a touch of Chinese in him. mmmm-hmmmm..Yes indeed. And he was the keeper!

So now having thought a little more on this subject, I actually don't see why this is a big deal. . .let's just all date and marry those whom we are attracted to. Does their have to be a right and a wrong to it?

Well this is the thing. You found out what worked for you after you tried all the different flavours. ;-) In other words you did not discriminate, but you found what worked for you. Who knows, maybe if you had found one who was different from you but thought to be the one you would be singing a different tune. My point is not that you are wrong for preferring one that is like you. That is perfectly logical and reasonable. You would have a lot of things in common with that person. My point is, do not dismiss the others just because they are different from you. You could potentially miss out on a good/ GREAT thing, simply because you are biased against or towards one type of skin colour. I think if we refuse to look at certain things critically and just say, so long as you stay on your side of the fence I dont care, we would never break the barriers that soon become building blocks for racial prejudice and stereotyping. Because guess what, your children will learn from you. So it is important that they understand the value and the beauty that is within each and every human being on this planet. That, to me, is a big deal.

Gotcha Scorpio. Sorry I was a little slow. LOL I see your point now.. I must've forgotten my Wheaties. . .

No no don't apologise. You are making me think about all the different views and opinions out there, which for me is a great thing. i enjoyed our exchange. Thank you :-)

This is a beautiful answer Jane and in my opinion, the ideal way of thinking.

That is my point exactly. Character before colour. I think people like to tag the word "preference" to this subject to disguise their dislike for a particular race. Well, preference says this, "I prefer coffee but I can still have tea. But I'd rather have coffee..." That is preference. I would have less of a problem with someone that said, "I prefer Asian men to black men, but I would not say no if a good black man came along. Thank you for your comment. I was beginning to think that there was no hope for this post. :-)

Thank you!

Thank you and I agree with you.

Thank YOU! :-)

So being black is equivalent to being gay? Great argument. :-/ Btw. Who said I was educated? Certainly not me.

Bring discriminatory does not necessarily mean you are a bad person. It simply means that you discriminate and are prejudiced against a certain group of people. We've been arguing for days now gypsy, and frankly I am getting tired of it. You disagree,fine. Let's agree to disagree then shall we?

Despite what you think,I don't hate you. I DISAGREE with you. I think your thinking is wrong. That doesn't mean I think you are a bad person. I never said that. Stop projecting.

oh there you are mr white black man i see u are a racist t.. u dont like gay men hu ... sad sad sad

i not going to date blk men no matter what u say or do this is america... and i have the freedom to do so... much to ur personal dismay!! get over ur self

what do u want ? blk white babies ?..... is that why u want white women to date blk men ?

whats wrong with ur own kind ? to date them .. scorpio you dont like dating black women ?

why are you so desparte to convince me to date you or any other black man .....get over ur self

Okay you clearly do have problems. You obviously want me to block you. Your wish is my command.

Reply by gypsyblu Jun 26th, 2012 at 5:10AM there ar plenty of black women who would love to date a black man who is white

Preference and racism aren't the same...he is asking for people to examine why skin color might be a preference...you might miss out on something great because you can't get past the book cover or the wrapping on the package...

Thank you! Just shaking my head here. *sigh*

There is a world outside of America you know gypsy? People like you give Americans a bad name. I actually would not have minded to have a debate with you on this subject but seeing as you felt more comfortable hurling insults at me as opposed to remaining civil I had to block you. Being on the internet does not give you the right to insult people as you wish. For someone so old you are very immature. Been nice knowing you... Maybe not...

I totally agree. Some forms are more subtle than others,making them difficult to spot.

And a lot of people don't want to admit that it still exists because they would then have to look at themselves...

Absolutely. It amazes me that people can still be so ignorant and dismissive of the difficulties that other people face. They probably know that if they acknowledge these disparities in the way some are treated, they would have to do some work in order to rectify the situation. Either that or live with the guilt of acknowledging the crime, but refusing to deal with it. So they would rather choose to say it doesn't exist. Extracting themselves from a position of responsibility and action. Its better than pleading guilty is it not?

For some it would appear that way...and truely its not even totally pleading guilty...its pleading that some are guilty or that there is something to plead gulity to....ya know!

One of my favorite issues regarding this is racial and cultural appropriation

Racial and cultural appropriation... Haven't heard that phrase before.

Did you check it out?

Yes I've just finished reading up on it. Very briefly but read up nonetheless. From what I gather there are negative and positive aspects of this appropriation. However, I would argue that there are more positives than negatives. What say you?

Depends on how its done... and if it is acknowledged, some people will agrue dreads aren't appropriation, that the celtics did it so white people do it because of that ect...

Something sacred or special to a group of people should not be used as a "trend"

I see. I'll have to read up further on that to get a better idea of what constitutes racial or cultural appropriation. It is an interesting topic of discussion. I think there is no greater example of cultural appropriation than the transformation and adaptation of music. From rock and roll to soul music. It's an interesting study.

I'm sure there are people who will feel strongly about that. How strongly they would feel, I don't know. But I think you would rather someone embraces one aspect of your culture,even ignorantly so. Then that gives you a platform to help that person better understand your culture, thus encouraging learning and growth in both individuals.

So what you're saying is, people with dark skin are not attractive? Since you're not attracted to them that is the only logical explanation for your reasoning behind your argument. Saying you are not attracted to a certain type of race IS being racist. Your are discriminating on the basis of race, nothing else. You don't have to hate someone in order to be considered as racist. Looking down upon, not seeing someone as equal to yourself, or just thinking that a person's skin color makes them look unattractive, judging a person based on the COLOR of their skin IS racist. Are there no beautiful dark skinned people in the world? Well obviously not in your eyes. Let's call a spade a spade shall we.

Thats not what I'm saying at all. If you would open your thick skull and read my comment you would understand it better. I MYSELF am not attracted to men with darker skin. That does not mean they cannot be attractive to another woman and that doesn't mean they are horrible people. You need to get a life. Seriously..

No need to get offensive. I thought I was debating with an adult. I tried to explain my point. If you disagree with it why don't you explain what you meant instead of chucking out insults. If you have a point or an argument, let's hear it. Don't insult me for not agreeing with you. I did not insult you, can you at least do the same for me? I have read and understood your comment, I think you did not understand mine. I did not want to point any fingers but if you say you are not attracted to dark skinned people I would ask why? What you're saying is quite simple. You just don't like the colour of their skin. What does that make you?

I guess all you are trained to see is racism as the root of anything. Sorry, people are allowed to have their preferences and this is a different topic than racism. Chipmunk made a good effort of lay out these principles earlier because your premise of what is racist is sophomoric at best. You could be a fellow white person and I think your skin tone or complexion is hideous so by your definition I would be a racist.

Blu - It amazes me that you continue to insult my intelligence by arguing that my points are juvenile or "sophomoric" as you put it, and then continue to give a really lame example which actually proves my point. There is more than one skin tone within one race. There are black people that are fair skinned, light skinned and dark skinned. One might have a preference for one of these skin types, that does not make them a racist because the skin tone is part of a particular race. That is choice based on preference which I have no problem with. Read Jenny's comments about preference and my response to her. There are white people of one race with different skin tones. Some white people are pale, and some white people are slightly more tan. Their different skin tones do not make them a different race. This is just an example of the genetic diversity that occurs within each race. Please do refrain from insulting my intelligence. It's getting old. Just present your argument and we'll take it from there.

I think your are over simplifying something that goes a lot deeper than hair colour or preference. Preference says, I prefer red heads but would not say no to a beautiful brunette. Saying I would not date anyone of this skin colour is equivalent to saying that people of that particular skin colour are not beautiful. Is that not insulting to that particular race? To say that your people are ugly. Because we are talking about appearance here.

But there are people who will not date because of hair color, or height, or weight, etc.---all based on looks. If you don't find a certain type sexually attractive, that's just the way it is and it's not necessarily racist--though it could be.

You can change your hair colour or your weight. You can't change your height necessarily but if someone refuses you because of your height that would make them shallow. But this probably isn't such a big issue today because there aren't that many exceptionally short or tall people around. Nor are there too many people that will flat out REFUSE someone because they're too tall or too short. But if anyone does, that person will be looked upon as shallow. In other words,we admit that they are wrong for doing so. Race is however a big issue,and we can't bring that down to the same level as discrimination based on hair colour, weight or even height for that matter. Just because that's the way it is, does not mean that we just have to accept it as being okay. Certain things should be tolerated,certain things should not. Discrimination should not be accepted or tolerated. In my opinion anyway. :-)

Forgot to mention. I am not saying your should love all people of colour. Your casing help who you are attracted to. What I am saying is. what causes someone to deem one race of people as not being attractive? I used to think that Indian women were not that attractive,until I bumped into one that blew me away. It wasn't just her appearance that got me, it was her mind as well. But I learnt something from that. Your shouldn't discriminate just because you have preconceived ideas about a group of people.

To answer the "what determines" question--could be simple personal aesthetics, could be racism.

Perhaps. I just think it has more to do with the psyche and how one views others.

You dated one Muslim man. I personally would never advise any woman to date a Muslim man, not unless you're willing to convert and live by their laws which are very harsh and oppressive, especially regarding women. It helps a great deal to have a lot in common, believe me, I know. But would you say that your one bad experience reflects every other interracial or intercultural relationship out there? To assume that would indeed be folly. No relationship is the same. Certainly no intercultural or interracial relationship is the same. It would be wrong to paint them with the same brush.

I have actually written about this topic. Marriage to a Muslim man - do you really want to? That's the topic if I remember correctly.

I think maybe I was a little bit traumatized by the relationship. I was very inexperienced. It started hot and ended hotter. Neither one of us was to blame and it was a very long time ago. As far as interracial dating, times have changed very much where that's concerned No one hardly blinks an eye anymore. Its pretty common around here.

Its understandable that you would be wary. A bad experience will always make you think twice. It helps when you are from the same background, certain things are just understood, no need for explanation. It's good to see that people are becoming more open minded though.

I mean no offense, but when you say you "would never advise any woman to date a Muslim man"--this seems a little prejudicial to me. Mind you, I'm not playing "gottcha." Most of us, I believe, have at least a residual of racism within us due to our early experiences and the "herd" mentality. I know I occasionally have a thought or feeling that I can identify as somewhat racist. I abhor such thoughts and try very hard to keep them from EVER affecting my behavior. But in any case, regarding the coupling of a Muslim and Christian--if you are well versed in the differences, than advising them on those differences and possible points of conflicts--if done without any agenda for a hoped for outcome--would be constructive. Telling they shouldn't do it for this, that and the other reasons is evidencing a bit of prejudice, IMO. Again. I am not putting you down for this. But I have little doubt that SOME such couplings work out well, though there are bound to be issues.

No offense taken. We are all entitled to an opinion. As long as it is done respectfully I have no problem with that. For the record, I am not a christian. I would also not advise an atheist to marry a christian. Unles of course both parties are very liberal about their beliefs. I say this because if one person decides to become more devout at any stage, it can be a problem for the other. I mentioned Islam specifically because LilAnnie was talking about a muslim man. I have heard of stories were one does not reverence the anothers beliefs. If you take your faith seriously, believeing for example what the bibe teaches. This would mean that if your partner does not believe in Jesus, they would be going to hell. That's IF you truly believe what your faith teaches. But if you dont believe that what the bible says is true and you decide to make your own rules, you can ignore this spiritual teaching and live happily so long as you dont get seperated when one goes to Jesus heaven and the other goes to atheist heaven. :-) If you study Islam, you will see that there are several teachings that would require a woman to submit to her husband in the most strictest of ways. To a woman that is unaware of these teachings, she could become trapped under Islamic law, needing a very brave effort to escape. You should read my story about Marrying A Muslim Man. There is one example of woman who lost the right to care for her children, because under Islamic law, the children belong to the husband. Research this, listen to the testimonies of the women who "fell" into these unions unknowingly. This is why I am against inter religious marriage. It is confusing for both parties, not to mention the children. Of course this is not the case with all inter religious marriages. It's less of a problem were a christian for example would marry an atheist because lets face it, christianity in a lot of instances is very watered down and a lot of christians are very liberal. So it would be easier to accept someone from a different religion. Islam however is very strict. However, if the man or woman who is a muslim is very liberal, there is no reason why it could not work. However, from personal testimonies that I have heard, from muslim women and non muslim women, I can tell you that their experiences are far from joyous. Not generalising here, just looking at the facts. It is dangerous to accept anything in the guise of acceptance and tolerance without knowing anything about what you are leting into your home. Do some research on it, you will be shocked at what you find.

I have been exposed to several stories--horror stories really--about some Muslim marriages--even some between Muslims. Some men in the Muslim community, take the strictest portions of the Koran and apply them rigorously while ignoring the more moderate teachings. It's always been this way for all religions, there are groups with tunnel vision who take excepts for their holy book and apply them in such a way that it gives a elite group extra power while making the lives of others miserable. But not everyone isn't like this. So, persons entering into such pairings would be wise to fully understand the challenges involved and to discover, as fully as possible, the intentions and expectations of the other. But each has to make his or her own way. :-)

Yeah I agree with that. This is one of the main reasons why I am no longer a Christian. It's complicated, let me just say, in my opinion, there is more to spirituality than just following rules. But it is difficult. I'm sure you have heard of the old bait and switch tactics employed by some of these men, from all walks of life. It is difficult because you just might fall prey to one of these guys. It is tough. One certainly has to tread their own path.

"I personally would never advise any woman to date a Muslim man, not unless you're willing to convert and live by their laws which are very harsh and oppressive, especially regarding women."

I was raised in the middle east, and have seen the full range of muslim men, from the most devout to the most liberal. I respectfully disagree with your statement. The points of conflict occur when any liberal person marries a devout person from any religion. A liberal woman is 10 times better off marrying a liberal nonreligious muslim than a religious christian, jew, hindu, etc.

PS - Islam allows men to marry non-muslim women even if they don't covert. (The same is not true for muslim women marrying non muslim men, but that's another story). Usually those who ask their wives to covert do so in order to fit in with their traditional families or because they are on the more religious side of the spectrum.

Hi Elaria. You are correct, I made an incorrect assumption there that all Muslim men would be a certain way. It was said without too much thought. Generalisations are unjustifiable and usually don't tell the full story. I apologise for that. I am not religious. And I agree that the problem occurs when one party is more devout and less liberal. I think I responded in a similar way to Jenny. Please accept my apologies.

No need to apologize, Scorpio, and thank you for the nice reply :)

Thank you. :-)