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Does God Have Double Standards.

Is the Bible contradictory, or have we by way of wrong interpretation of Gods word made it appear that such is the case.

A core belief among Fundamentalists and Evangelicals is the Eternal Punishment of sinners.

This core belief has not to my knowledge had a great deal of impact on those that hold to this doctrine, and was something i held to for many many years having been taught same in Bible study and Bible College, without question i might add.

Does this teaching of Eternal Torment coexist with all the love verses of scripture readily put forth by many, the answer is all important.

The Lord says in Ezekiel 33:11 that He has no pleasure in the death of the wicked, we say yes but, He enjoys torturing people for eternity. Something is completely wrong with this approach and is a barrier to the Gospel in my summation of the situation.

We believe we can make a case for eternal punishment from the Bible and in so doing destroy the harmony of the OT and the NT as to the justice and mercy of God and Jesus.

Verses of Scripture taken out of context and in isolation are very damaging to the Gospel, the cults are masters of this craft, we need to approach the Bible in prayer and ask for guidance, putting away all doctrinal bias and be open to the Holy Spirit to teach the truth, blessings will follow.
churinga churinga 70+, M 7 Responses Jul 7, 2010

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Always compare scripture with scripture.<br />
<br />
This helps a person to have sound doctrine. I remind myself of what Paul (Judaism first, Christian 2nd) taught Titus:<br />
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You must teach what is in accord with sound doctrine. (Titus 2:1)<br />
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It is possible to learn, obey and put into practice sound doctrine by way of scripture. The psalmist of psalms 119:99-100 must have understood this as he wrote:<br />
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I have more insight than all my teachers,<br />
for I meditate on your statutes.<br />
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I have more understanding than the elders,<br />
for I obey your precepts.<br />
<br />
Any follower of Christ who repents of his evil ways, obeys the teachings of Christ and goes out to produce fruit can and will have understanding of the scriptures. Insight comes by way of meditation and understanding comes by way of obedience.<br />
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Please believe the scripture as Jesus taught many times about Hell:<br />
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Do not be afraid of those who kill the body but cannot kill the soul. Rather, be afraid of the One who can destroy both soul and body in hell. (Mat 10:28)<br />
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But I tell you that anyone who is angry with his brother will be subject to judgment. Again, anyone who says to his brother, 'Raca, ' is answerable to the Sanhedrin. But anyone who says, 'You fool!' will be in danger of the fire of hell.(Matt 5:22)<br />
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If your right eye causes you to sin, gouge it out and throw it away. It is better for you to lose one part of your body than for your whole body to be thrown into hell. (Matt 5:29)<br />
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And if your right hand causes you to sin, cut it off and throw it away. It is better for you to lose one part of your body than for your whole body to go into hell.(Matt 5:30)<br />
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"Woe to you, teachers of the law and Pharisees, you hypocrites! You travel over land and sea to win a single convert, and when he becomes one, you make him twice as much a son of hell as you are.(Matt 23:15)<br />
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"You snakes! You brood of vipers! How will you escape being condemned to hell?(Matt 23:33)<br />
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But I will show you whom you should fear: Fear him who, after the killing of the body, has power to throw you into hell. Yes, I tell you, fear him.(Luke 12:15)<br />
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Moreover,<br />
<br />
You wrote:<br />
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"Hell no matter what is a place to be avoided and by the Grace of God through Jesus we have the means by way of repentance and obedience"<br />
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Yes, hell is to be avoided. And yes we are to be thankful for the grace of God. I have found many are not aware of what God's grace really means. Grace has been distorted and taught mistakenly to the masses in our day and time. Consider what Paul(a true grace teacher) taught:<br />
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For the time will come when men will not put up with sound doctrine. Instead, to suit their own desires, they will gather around them a great number of teachers to say what their itching ears want to hear. They will turn their ears away from the truth and turn aside to myths.(2Tim 4:3,4)<br />
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Yet, what is grace? According to the Bible, Paul also taught that TRUE GODLY GRACE is:<br />
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For the grace of God that brings salvation has appeared to all men. It teaches us to say "No" to ungodliness and worldly passions, and to live self-controlled, upright and godly lives in this present age,..(Titus 2:11-12)<br />
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So, in other words, God's grace teaches His followers to put to "DEATH" their earthly, sinful nature and to live by the fruit of the SPIRIT. And I also agree with you that God is a God of mercy. However, let us NOT forgot that God has more to His character:<br />
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The LORD is a jealous and avenging God;<br />
the LORD takes vengeance and is filled with wrath.<br />
The LORD takes vengeance on his foes<br />
and maintains his wrath against his enemies.<br />
<br />
The LORD is slow to anger and great in power;<br />
the LORD will not leave the guilty unpunished.<br />
His way is in the whirlwind and the storm,<br />
and clouds are the dust of his feet. (Nahum 1)<br />
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This is NOT my position NOR my word. I am only agreeing with the scripture. God DOES NOT PLAY!!!<br />
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Ezekiel33

Re Ezekiel33 July 11<br />
We have accord in relation to the fate of those that die in their sin.<br />
The make up and duration of what we commonly call hell is not absolute.<br />
My understanding is this terrible place was prepared for the devil and his angels Matthew 25:41. and any others judged to join them.<br />
The Revelation given to John contains things that to me a non Jew are not readily understood, so many of the 400 odd verses relate back to the Old Testament. Personal interpretation is forbidden, and sorting the literal from the symbolic has been a trap for many commentators.<br />
The Great White Throne judgment takes place after the millenium as such it is a long way in the future and the Justice and mercy meted out by a merciful God will be pure, of that there can be no doubt. Hell no matter what is a place to be avoided and by the Grace of God through Jesus we have the means by way of repentance and obedience, i appreciate your input and understand your position.

According to the bible:<br />
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"And the devil, who deceived them, was thrown into the lake of burning sulfur, where the beast and the false prophet had been thrown. They will be tormented day and night for ever and ever."(Rev 20:10)<br />
<br />
AND<br />
<br />
"But the cowardly, the unbelieving, the vile, the murderers,<br />
the sexually immoral, those who practice magic arts,<br />
the idolaters and all liars -- their place will<br />
be in the fiery lake of burning sulfur.<br />
This is the second death" (Rev. 21:8).<br />
<br />
Please consider the devil and the wicked will end up in the lake of burning sulfur. Now the lake of fire appears to be a place all wants to avoid:<br />
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"Where the smoke of those tormented there goes up forever and they find no rest" (Rev. 14:11). <br />
<br />
This tormenting of fire appears to be different from normal fire or flame as you and I know it. Jer. 7:31 speaks of physical fire able to consume the flesh or man in the body. Now, consider what Jesus taught:<br />
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Then he will say to those on his left, “Depart from me, you who are cursed, into the eternal fire prepared for the devil and his angels.” (Mat 25:41)<br />
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This eternal fire is able to torment spirit beings. Now, when man dies, the flesh is no more, and the spirit moves on. Consider the fate of those from Sodom and Gomorrah:<br />
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"In a similar way, Sodom and Gomorrah and the surrounding towns gave themselves up to sexual immorality and perversion. They serve as an example of those who suffer the punishment of eternal fire. "(Jude 1:7)<br />
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In other words, we should carefully consider our lives on a daily basis. There is no sin that is worthy of our eternal destruction. Jesus taught about Hell and in my opinion it is a place to avoid at all cost. Jesus taught the seriousness of avoiding hell:<br />
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"And if your eye causes you to sin, pluck it out. It is better for you to enter the kingdom of God with one eye than to have two eyes and be thrown into hell, where their worm does not die, and the fire is not quenched. Everyone will be salted with fire. "(Mark 9:47-49)<br />
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Always carefully consider with the teachings you find in your own bible. We all are accountable for our lives.

Re Ezekiel33. July 8th.<br />
Thank you for your comment.<br />
I will rely on Revelation chapter 20 and let the Bible speak for itself.<br />
The final abode of the beast and the false prophet those that worship the beast and take his mark along with satan is the lake of fire and brimstone where they are tormented day and night for ever and ever we have accord to this stage.<br />
The final abode of those not found in the book of life is a lake of fire without brimstone.<br />
Preceding the casting into the lake of fire of those not found in the book of life at verse 14 " And death and hades were cast into the lake of fire, this is the second death."<br />
Why would the second death be applicable to death and hades and not those found in the book of life? they are consigned to the same place, this lake of fire is without brimstone, and does not contain in the narrative that they were tormented day and night for ever and ever. God is not a God of confusion, if the final state of those not found in the book of life was the same as for the beast false prophet those that worship the beast and take his mark and satan then the Bible would make such teaching plain, which is not the case.<br />
I was indoctrinated into Scofieldism in College by using the Scofield Bible notes and only by the Grace of God i was led out of that system of teaching, Scofield was convicted of forgery and was a man that failed to support his family, hardly a glowing reputation. Scofield tries to explain away the second death but fails miserably. Jeremiah 7:31 states clearly that God does not have in mind torture by flame.

If I am understanding your question correctly, Yes.<br />
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And I saw an angel coming down out of heaven, having the key to the Abyss and holding in his hand a great chain. He seized the dragon, that ancient serpent, who is the devil, or Satan, and bound him for a thousand years. He threw him into the Abyss, and locked and sealed it over him, to keep him from deceiving the nations anymore until the thousand years were ended. After that, he must be set free for a short time. (Rev 20:1-3)<br />
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Key Points:<br />
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It takes only 1 angel to seize the devil. <br />
The devil is placed in the Abyss(spiritual type prison?) held by a chain<br />
The devil is kept in holding for 1000 years<br />
Unable to deceive the world (Rev 20:7)<br />
<br />
Furthermore,<br />
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When the thousand years are over, Satan will be released from his prison and will go out to deceive the nations in the four corners of the earth—Gog and Magog—to gather them for battle.(Rev 20:7)<br />
<br />
Key points:<br />
<br />
1000 years are up & Devil is released<br />
He is free to deceive<br />
<br />
Moreover,<br />
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They marched across the breadth of the earth and surrounded the camp of God's people, the city he loves. But fire came down from heaven and devoured them. And the devil, who deceived them, was thrown into the lake of burning sulfur, where the beast and the false prophet had been thrown. They will be tormented day and night for ever and ever. (Rev 20:9,10)<br />
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Key Points:<br />
<br />
The devil deceives<br />
The devil was NOT thrown back into the Abyss. He is NOW in the Lake of burning sulfur<br />
The beast and the false prophet will also end in the Lake of Fire<br />
<br />
The devil does not appear to be as powerful as some might expect. It only takes 1 angel to seize the devil. The common theme also appears to be the devils ability to deceive. The devil is the master deceiver please be on WATCH until his final destination which is the lake of burning sulfur.<br />
<br />
Love Peace and Joy<br />
<br />
Ezekiel33

re ezekiel July 7th.<br />
If i read correctly Rev 20:10 is the end to the matter? from you point of view.<br />
Revelation 20:10 comes after the thousand year reign of the Lord and i would prefer to leave it there.<br />
The eternal punishment doctrine is foreign to the Old Testament would you agree with that summation?

Notice what the scripture says:<br />
<br />
Consider the devil:<br />
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And the devil, who deceived them, was thrown into the lake of burning sulfur, where the beast and the false prophet had been thrown. They will be tormented day and night for ever and ever. Rev 20:10)<br />
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The Greek word for tormented is Basanizo. It is defined as to torture,to vex with grievous pains (of body or mind), and to be harassed, distressed. <br />
<br />
The word they refers to the devil, the beast (or antichrist) and the false prophet. The word them refers to the so called Christians and non-Christians who are(NOW) and will be(future) deceived. <br />
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In other words, the above mentioned will face torment for "day and night for ever and ever" <br />
<br />
Please Consider:<br />
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God's 2 greatest commandments that man is to honor:<br />
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Love(Obey) the Lord God with all your heart &<br />
Love your neighbor (Matt 22:37-40)<br />
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Yet, when it comes to our enemies we are commanded to:<br />
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"Do not take revenge, my friends, but leave room for God's wrath, for it is written: "It is mine to avenge; I will repay,"]says the Lord.( Rom 12:19)<br />
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Notice the word wrath. It appears hard for some to comprehend that God has a wrathful side. <br />
<br />
According to the bible:<br />
<br />
The LORD is a jealous and avenging God;<br />
the LORD takes vengeance and is filled with wrath.<br />
The LORD takes vengeance on his foes<br />
and maintains his wrath against his enemies.<br />
<br />
The LORD is slow to anger and great in power;<br />
the LORD will not leave the guilty unpunished.<br />
His way is in the whirlwind and the storm,<br />
and clouds are the dust of his feet. (Nahum 1)<br />
<br />
God will repay His enemies. The guilty will be punished. Carefully ponder this about God:<br />
<br />
We should not test the Lord, as some of them did—and were killed by snakes. And do not grumble, as some of them did—and were killed by the destroying angel. These things happened to them as examples and were written down as warnings for us, on whom the fulfillment of the ages has come. So, if you think you are standing firm, be careful that you don't fall! (1 Cor. 10:9-12). <br />
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Immediately, because Herod did not give praise to God, an angel of the Lord struck him down, and he was eaten by worms and died (Acts 12:23).<br />
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"Didn't it belong to you before it was sold? And after it was sold, wasn't the money at your disposal? What made you think of doing such a thing? You have not lied to men but to God." When Ananias heard this, he fell down and died. And great fear seized all who heard what had happened .... Peter said to her, "How could you agree to test the Spirit of the Lord? Look! The feet of the men who buried your husband are at the door, and they will carry you out also." At that moment she fell down at his feet and died. Then the young men came in and, finding her dead, carried her out and buried her beside her husband. Great fear seized the whole church and all who heard about these events (Acts 5:4,5,9-11). <br />
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I looked, and there before me was a pale horse! Its rider was named Death, and Hades was following close behind him. They were given power over a fourth of the earth to kill by sword, famine and plague, and by the wild beasts of the earth (Rev. 6:8).<br />
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So here is the bottom line. God is not limited to just how we think. If it were me, I would trust (OBEY) God and diligently study the scriptures for His hidden nuggets and truths. And always remember:<br />
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As for God, his way is perfect; the word of the LORD is flawless. He is a shield for all who take refuge in him.”- Psalm 18:30<br />
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Love, Peace and Joy<br />
<br />
Ezekiel33