Long (and Frank) Discussion About Why It Can Be Hard To ****** With A Partner

I'm in a private Facebook group where we can (and do) talk about pretty much anything; today the topic was *******, and it got good enough that I thought I'd like to share some of it here....
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It all started when one of the guys posted this question:

Women's *******. Any women here have problems making that happen solo? Or with a partner? Was it once an issue and something helped you get over it? I know it's usually mental more than physical. Maybe it often goes back to childhood somehow?

What are the men's experiences with this?

I have heard that 30 percent of women do not have *******. I'm not sure if that fact was solo or with partner.

Why do I ask? Well...I have one woman right now that has NEVER had an ****** in her life-even by her own hand, vibrator, etc. And another tells me it is very rare for a partner to make this happen but her shower head does it for her. Plus the woman who told me I was the first guy in two years to make her *** orally and many had tried.

What say you?
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Well, as it turns out, I had quite a bit to say on the subject.... :)
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ME:
I've NEVER had a problem orgasming on my own, but I used to have trouble orgasming with someone else because I was too much in my head—not in a good way—if that makes any sense....

I thought about too many things that interfered with just enjoying what was happening: "do I look bad/weird/fat? Did I miss a spot shaving? Did I brush my teeth? Is that LETTUCE in my teeth??!! Is my hair a mess? Is my makeup smearing? Did I just make a weird face? Does it smell bad down there? OMG, was that a queef? Just shoot me now...."

I also worried about if I was doing things right: "Am I moving enough? Am I moving too much? Is he enjoying this? I've been doing this for awhile—maybe I should do something else…. Faster? Slower? Different angle? Am I making too much noise? Am I making ENOUGH noise? Should I be touching him more? Less?? Oh, no! He's done—I better pretend I'm *******…."

Also, there was the part where if I WAS getting close, I started worrying about finishing before him, and I'd try to stop it (not that me finishing first was an issue often, lol). See, in romance novels—and in some of the erotica I read—and in movies, the guy and the girl *** at the same time…. So, that means that in real life it has to be that way, and if it isn't, then clearly I'm doing something wrong and should just hang my head….

If I somehow managed to get past all of THAT, and was in danger of actually having an ******, I kind of freaked out, and wanted to stop it. It's a very personal thing, and I'm very vulnerable when it happens; there's no hiding, no sharing just PART of myself with someone when I ******—I'm wide-open, emotionally, and I used to get hurt very easily, so I didn't WANT to open up completely to just anyone. (Yes, I realize that if I wasn't willing to open up emotionally with someone, I probably shouldn't have been sleeping with him, but I was young and horny, and hadn't actually figured all of this out yet.)

In any event, before my current husband came along, I can probably count on one hand the number of times I orgasmed with another person present and aware of it. I got very good at letting them think I was done, and I'd finish on my own, later. I learned to enjoy the build-up and, to this day, can stay in a constant state of anticipation for days before letting myself ******. (It's pretty incredible after building for that long, btw…. TMI?)

What was the question again?


GUY #2:
My current GF is the first woman I've ever been with who doesn't have ******* - not via oral, penetration, or self-stimulation. She claims to have had just one ****** (she "thinks") in her entire life. (How very sad!!!) She assures me it's not my fault and that she enjoys sex, but to be honest, it leaves me a bit unfulfilled. Even though I get off, she doesn't - and that makes me feel pretty damn inadequate.


ME:
I can't speak for your GF, but I can at least tell you that I totally enjoyed sex before learning to ****** during it! Seriously: I had no idea what I was missing, because I'd never experienced it. Maybe if she USED to *** during sex with previous boyfriends, and you can't make it happen, you might want to re-think your technique or something, but if she's NEVER orgasmed during sex, then don't take it personally.

And, like I said: perpetual anticipation = good. I'm ready to go at a moment's notice during that phase.

Also, would you rather she lie to you and fake it, or be honest and tell you that she really enjoyed it, even if she didn't convulse and nearly pass out?


GUY #1:
I had another girlfriend that loved oral but did not seem to be able to *** that way. Whenever she got close she would insist I enter her and she would not surrender that way. Kinda made me want to go down on her less and I love doing that.

ME:
It can be MUCH harder to relax and let go during oral—especially if you're really good at it.

I used to have a really hard time with it because I felt guilty for just wanting to lie there and enjoy it. I felt that I should be doing something for him, but in 69, I couldn't pay attention to what I was doing AND what he was doing. Boo!

Also, once I discovered that I was a squirter, it got even harder to relax with anyone: one bad reaction from ONE guy can keep a squirter from mutual ****** for decades. (True story.)

Even if she isn't a squirter, she could be self-conscious for any of a number of reasons: what if she yells/moans/cries/scratches/bites? You might be okay with any of it, but maybe the last guy wasn't.

And, last thing: like I said, it's a very intimate thing to allow, and if I knew a guy was dating lots of other women [NOTE: this guy is currently dating 8 or 12 women who all know about each other] I'd definitely not go there. What if I get addicted to sex with him, or fall for him after all that closeness, and he decides to get serious with someone else (or with nobody)?


GUY #1:
I do NOT want someone faking it. The one that has never had an O even with herself said all the men tell her they will make her *** but they have all failed. So I said I will not make that a goal-gonna be sneaky about it and hope it happens as a surprise. We shall see if she can open up enough.


She also said they all were fine with it after a bit cuz they could do their business quick and not worry about her. Sad stuff. The other night she was feeling guilty she hadn't made me *** yet and did not understand why I was lasting so long. She thought she was failing and didn't understand I go a long time and stop and start to increase the eventual intensity.


ME:
I used to have that same reaction to a guy taking a long time! I thought I was failing, because clearly he'd be done by now if I was doing it right....

Then it would start hurting because I have less lubrication when I'm stressed, and he'd keep trying to last longer to give me a chance to ***, and it would hurt more and more, and I'd get more and more upset because he wan't *******—not letting HIM know, of course—and I was soooo glad when I got good enough at faking that I could head that stuff off at the first sign that he was close.

GUY #1:
I hadn't thought about lasting so long being a failure on the woman's part.... If it's intercourse I didn't think about that being a failure. But I can understand that when a woman is giving me oral for a long time. That often does mean it's not quite right. I have had a few that weren't the greatest and took forever or couldn't really make me finish.



ME:
Some of US do (think about it being our failure) every time.

We KNOW how long it takes once you're in; if it takes longer, some of us think that's a bad sign. If you're wanting to experiment with making it last, let her KNOW that's what you're doing, before you start, and it should help. (If she's anything like me, anyway....)


GUY #1:
It's the mental for the man too. The longer it goes the more I am trying to make myself want to finish but it doesn't always work. And I know she is getting tired and frustrated.


ANOTHER GIRL IN THE GROUP:
So glad to hear that I'm not the only one who can't get out of her own way to have an ******. Up until 3 years ago, hubs always got me off first. But there were comments (which felt like criticism or complaints) about how long it took me. It made me self conscious. The more self conscious I got, the longer it took. I would get close and then my mind wouldn't shut up..."is this it?", "Be quiet, so he doesn't change anything. ****, I'm being too quiet!", "It's *******, it's coming. Please don't fail me. Dammit, where'd it go? No!", "He's waiting. Hurry up. Come on! WTF is wrong with me?" Sooooo I just gave up trying. Told hubs, "there's too much pressure. If it happens, it happens. Just go on without me. I enjoy the experience." I'll climb the walls, getting my G spot stimulated, so I'm good. On top of that, he put on weight and the position that was a sure fire winner for me became uncomfortable. I love my vibrator. I get off in about 10-20 minutes with it. Theres no pressure or anyone who will complain that I took too long.


ME:
Any man who is stupid enough to complain about ANYTHING during sex deserves NO sex.

Dumbasses.

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And then someone else posted another question (about whether/how clitoral ******* are different from vaginal, and I've posted that here: EP Link




ubelsgirl ubelsgirl
41-45, F
1 Response Sep 9, 2012

I've often said that all sex is good sex, so you'd get no complaints from me!

I had no idea that it was so difficult for some women to achieve ******. I know my wife told me that she didn't have her first until about her fifth guy, but she enjoyed sex nonetheless and once she finally had one it was even better. She was on top for her first, so maybe position plays a role? Even after that, she says that she only came during sex with a partner once in awhile. That changed when we became lovers, and since then she always **** (sometimes two or three times), so maybe part of it is how comfortable a woman is with her partner.

As for a lady being concerned that she's "not doing something right" of a guy doesn't *** fast enough: we're trying NOT to *** soon - we want to prolong the pleasure for both the woman and ourselves! You said you know how long it takes, but how long should that be? I suspect it varies from guy to guy (a recent medical review said that less than 8 minutes is "premature"), but as far as I'm concerned longer is better - if it feels great why would you want it to be over? I get the drying out thing, but remember that live is your friend!

Who would have thought that wen are so nervous about pleasing a guy that they don't *** themselves? From this guy's perspective, if we squirt you can rest assured that we were plenty pleased! And we like it when we we get some guidance on pleasing you - we all want to become better lovers, believe it or not!

The right position can definitely make it easier, but mindset is SO much more important for some of us.... I can ****** without touching myself when I'm on my own, if I want to, but when a man is involved I usually start thinking it would be rude for me to just focus on my own enjoyment, but I'm not sure what I should be doing to help him along, and being unsure is a sure way to derail my ******.

I suppose some of that is simple lack of communication, but it seems a lot of people have a hard time discussing sex at all, never mind directly telling someone what they want or don't want.

I'm very open and frank in discussions about sex now, but when I was younger I would turn twenty shades of red and try to hide if anyone brought it up, and I wouldn't have been able to answer any questions anyway, because I knew next to nothing about anything except how to get myself off on my own, and I was very embarrassed that I had perfected that as much as I had, because that made it obvious just HOW much I did it.... And the thought of trying to explain to a sex partner, what felt good or didn't, or even to tell him I wanted more or less of something? TERRIFYING.

Of course, it occurs to me that the times I was with women, even at my most self conscious stage, I did NOT have any of those problems.... Because of my experience with my cousin when I was growing up (I've mentioned her in a couple of my stories; I had one just about all that, but EP deleted it... I'll write it again at some point), I KNEW I knew how to pleasure a woman, so there was no lack of self confidence there, like there was when I was with men.

Huh. I hadn't thought about that until I typed it just now, but I suppose that would explain a lot....

Truly, I'm stunned that some women (obviously not just you) have been so nervous about pleasing a man. Most men (I'm not talking about the NSA sex of a one night stand) are very concerned about whether they are pleasing the woman, and her pleasure is of paramount importance. "Communication" can be as simple as "oh, that feels good" or guiding a hand or finger where you want it, or touching yourself during sex play.

I suspect there would be a lot more satisfied couples if they approached sex with a "this is supposed to be fun" attitude!

I'm interested in a statement you made before about knowing "how long it is supposed to take." From a woman's perspective, is it a time thing, or until you achieve ****** thing, or some other measure? Is it different depending on the urge, or setting? Do most guys take too long, or not long enough?

"How long it's supposed to take" is based on my experience with him. When with a new partner, I wasn't as focused on how long it took, because I didn't know how long was normal for him yet.

And yes, everyone would be MUCH happier if we approached as something that should be fun, but we’ve made it into this hugely important thing that can make or break a relationship AND we’ve made it so that if you aren’t happy with the sex you’re either supposed to get out of the relationship or do without. With all that pressure, it can be hard to relax and enjoy it….

As for, “"Communication" can be as simple as "oh, that feels good" or guiding a hand or finger where you want it, or touching yourself during sex play…” I have to say that depends on who you’re with….

Would you believe that some guys get pissed if a girl touches herself during sex? I seriously had a guy yell at me because he said it was an insult to him. Apparently, if I needed to touch myself I was saying that he wasn’t doing enough. Ditto for guiding his hands or fingers; some guys think that THEY know what’s the best way to please a woman, and if she tries to change what he’s doing he takes it as an attack on his technique/talent.

As for "oh, that feels good,” SOMETIMES that works great, but then sometimes he’ll get stuck on the thing that I said feels good, even when it doesn’t anymore; or it ends up backfiring, because the guy will assume that if you aren’t saying it feels good, it doesn’t, which means I have to keep talking even when I’d like to relax and sink into what he’s doing so I can ******.

What I FINALLY learned works pretty well is when we each take responsibility for our own pleasure. I’LL move myself around and do what feels good to me, and ask him if I need him to do something differently, and HE does the same. We both end up a whole lot happier this way, in my experience….

FYI: the very THOUGHT of my final paragraph would have terrified me when I was younger. I would have been worried that he would think I was weird because of what felt good for me, compared to what he expected. (I was MUCH too concerned with what people thought of me...)

But, again, none of that was an issue when I was with women, so it could just be a confidence thing, or it could be that since I'm not really all that into guys, I was afraid they'd figure that out....

Sea you've had the misfortune to be with some guys with serious confidence issues! Maybe I project my own take on "other guys" too much, or maybe there are just a lot of guys who are very self-centered, but I can't imagine not wanting to be guided to what makes your lover feel good - isn't that the point, after all?

Glad you found a reasonable man who considers your pleasure. Does he know you prefer women? Does he mind?

He knows I'm hugely attracted to women, but I'm not sure if he knows I prefer them.... He doesn't mind what he knows, and I don't think he'd mind knowing that I prefer women, because it doesn't affect us, really.... (Since I'm the one with the higher sex drive, I can ********** to lesbian **** as much as I want without it negatively affecting our sex life.)

Do you still meet other women? **** has its place (especially amateur ****, in my humble opinion), but real
life is better, don't you think?

Real life is MUCh better, but unless my husband gives me the go-ahead I won't be having sex with any real life women. I DID just order a "realistic vagina" toy to play with, and that will help....

Have you brought up the subject with him? Would you consider a ********* with another woman? Do you think he would?

He might enjoy watching the two of you (it's a guy thing); he might like to join in.

Yes, I've brought it up, but he's not interested. He isn't like most guys... he was a virgin when we married. (He doesn't want sex outside of a committed relationship, so he wouldn't want me to have sex with someone else unless we were all in a relationship together, and he's entirely too much of a traditionalist for that to happen. sigh....

Personally, I think adding a woman to our relationship would make everything better: I wouldn't get frustrated with him not wanting sex as much as I do, there would be somebody else to help out with the stuff that wears us out (housework, errands, etc...), and there would always be someone for one of us to hang out with if the other needed some alone time (we're both introverts).

I understand your frustration - I have a higher sex drive than my lovely wife (it may not always have been so - she has had many more lovers than I have), and after nearly 25 years of marriage things are a bit stale. We're best friends, but on different wake/sleep cycles, so we don't always connect. I've suggested adding another guy to our lovemaking, but she's not interested.

Have you suggested adding another woman?

I have, but again not interested. Maybe she's completely happy with my superb skills. :-)

I want to be careful, as I don't want to make her think she isn't desirable, or that I'm tired of her (no need to stress her and make her less interested in lovemaking). Some of the routine is surely related to job demands, as she is a department chair in health care at a major university. I am a surgeon at the same university, and am often on call at the trauma hospital (like this weekend), so sometimes we just have a hard time connecting.

I would like to spice things up a bit, though - on the rare occasions she says something about her sexual past, I find it extremely stimulating. But it seems many women are almost ashamed of having experienced other lovers, and very secretive. Not sure why that is - I love to hear about it, and it has made her a wonderful lover.

Stress definitely doesn't help.... Does she know that you enjoy hearing about it? If not, you should let her know... reliving my sexual past is cranking up my already high libido....

You could tell me a tale or two about your past to rev me up - she'll reap the benefits oft reaction! :-)

I'm working on that story about two guys.... I have others to add after that one, if I can find time. : )

I'm a patient man . . .

I like you, and how well-spoken and open you are. In the real world, I think we could have been real friends.

Thank you! I have the same feeling. : )

Stupid iPhone - "seems"

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