Now I Know, Now What?

We had the talk. Not the "ultimatum" talk, but the "why won't you make love to me talk?" Now I really don't know what I am supposed to do.

The talk was informative and brought conclusion to many unanswered questions. I suppose I am somewhat grateful for that, although I am still trying to sort through it all, make since of it, and try to figure out what I am to do with this new found knowledge. Here is what I finally discovered:
She is not repulsed by me
She has a low sexual drive compared to mine (I knew this but she finally confirmed it)
She hated getting dressed up in lingerie
She hates foreplay
She hates cunninglingus
She is okay providing some limited oral sex if it is necessary and gets to intercourse FAST
She only likes intercourse and wants it over as soon as she is finished
She is willing to let me continue to conclusion if I get in, do the job, and get it done fast
She does not need, like or want tender touches, caressing, and words of endearment
She would like to have a sexual relationship on her terms
She does not see sex as "giving"
She climaxes only during intercourse and sex is about that climax
She does not relate sex to intimacy
She does not need intimacy

The list could go on, but what is the point? We are obviously totally and completely on opposite ends of the universe when it comes to sex. Sex for me is all about the foreplay, the caresses, the intimacy, the giving, the pleasing of your partner, and enjoying every moment of the experience. I never needed the lingerie and it was in 1996 I found all of it, over a thousand dollars worth of lingerie, in a garbage bag set out for me to take to the dump. Being the dumb guy, I understood the lingerie could be used to spice-up a love life...I never needed her to dress-up for me, I have always only needed her to want me.

So here I am, I guess, here we are, the two of us. And now I know it isn't "me," it is the way I make love. Romance, intimacy, foreplay, holding out as long as possible and trying to provide pleasure for my wife is all wrong. She just wants a good, quik, hard f*&% and only when she wants it, and as memory serves me from our first three years of marriage, that is twice a year.

And what about my needs? Well, she acknowledged I desired it more. She even acknowledged I was different than her because there is nothing I can do, at least nothing I am aware of, to stop my production of *****. there isn't anyway to prevent, stop, or retard my needs and she offered no solution to that issue. My needs, my constant and incessant discomfort affecting me emotionally, psychollogically and has even caused a permanent and irreversible physical condition leading to further constant discomfort is too bad for me. She offered to have sex if it was her way, under her terms, when she wanted it. Well, that was the way it was since we were married and sex dwindled throughout the first year, became quarterly the second year, twice a year in year three, and once a year until our thirteenth year of marriage when sex stopped entirely. That was 1999.

So now I am truly the refuser; the roles have reversed themselves. According to this conversation, she is willing, all I have to do is "f" her. But how does one start to reconnect sexually after being platonic domestic partners for so long? It would be like "f-ing" my sister, and then I couldn't do anything sexually that I want except straight intercourse and I better be quick! I am 54 now, and not even sure if I could perform with her without some kind of foreplay to get my engines running. She even admitted to me that she doesn't know how to get things started again either. I told her to get naked and see what happens, and she responded with "it is natural for wives not to be naked around their husbands when they are her age (49) because they may not be comfortable with their bodies." Great, so now I got to "f" her with her clothes on?

Well, I am finally armed with knowledge direct from the source of my agony. I had summized much of this knowledge, but have to admit some of it was shockingly new. But I think the net result of this discussion is I am now the refuser and know for sure the rest of my married life is going to be intimacy free, both sexually and emotionally. Now, as it has been for all of this new century, I must still contemplate if I am willing to live the rest of my life without any sexual contact or solve the problem by doing the things I have never been willing to do. In other words, I am right back where I started.

hardtobear hardtobear
13 Responses Jul 28, 2010

"hardtobear"....I read your story and it hit so close to the bone in the way it mirrors what I am going through. I've been with my wife for around 16 years (married for 10) and I am in a similar situation to you, except I get sex about every 2 weeks. <br />
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Our sex life was great for the first 5 or so years and then we had kids, which I know puts a serious strain on any sexual relationship. After this time it gradually started to decrease and was the cause of many fights. It took me another 4 years (6 months ago) to get to the bottom of it, and that was only because we had the biggest fight ever and she told me to leave so I said I would.<br />
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Her reasons are : (1) She has always had a lower sex drive then me - which I knew (2) She is always tired - aren't we all? (3) She was scared of getting pregnant again ; 2 planned kids, 1 accident that didn't proceed - understandable but the pill and double condoms? Then a vasectomy! How? (4) Catholic upbringing with all the guilt that goes with it - totally understand.<br />
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She says she still loves me and that she could never leave me, but can't understand how I place so much importance (once or twice a week!?) on sex even when I am so tired. I still love her as much as the day I met her and could never see myself leaving her or our 2 kids but the frustration boils over in to arguments about every 3 or 4 months.<br />
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I used to go for a massage every couple of weeks and one day I "exploded" when the girl started massaging my thighs...I never even did this when I was a shy teenager. This is when I realised that things were getting bad. Eventually I ended up getting a "happy ending" each time I went for a massage, I know it is basically cheating and the guilt I felt/feel is enormous, but I went nearly a whole year without fighting with me wife. I stopped after this time because of the guilt but now I am back in the position where we are fighting again.<br />
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To me, the mental closeness I feel with my wife is magnified by our physical closeness when we have sex, and I can't work out why she doesn't feel the same? What I have got from stories like yours is that I am not alone and that there are lots of men/women in the same position as me. The question we must all grapple with is "How do we handle it if we want to keep our marriage?" I am still struggling with this myself.

Thanks for all the comments. Bazzar, you are right on the money. Enna, you are always so thoughtful and what is keeping me with her may also respond to JW. for me the definition of a man is not how many woman he "bangs" it is how well he takes care of his family and lives up to his committments. I am trying to live up to who I believe I am; not someone else's standard. My standard is not better or worse than anyone else's, but it is how I define who I am. (Not that I haven't thought of the hookers and prostitutes and not that I haven't desired any pretty pair of feline legs.) I just need to live up to my own definition of who I am and not quit on my son, my daughter and my family.

JW, I'm surprised such a sensitive empathetic and tender hearted soul as yourself is not getting laid . . . .

Oh come on man. Quit feeling sorry for yourself. Buy some viagra over the web. Pop a couple of those and rough her up a bit - head smashing off the headboard kinda stuff. If she doesn't start getting into it, either find a girlfriend or start banging hookers. You are a man, aren't you?

I don't know which is worse: getting no answers at all, or getting answers that we can't act on. Anyhow, good for you for getting some apparently honest answers. Do you get a turn at saying what your needs are, and is there any chance of meeting halfway?

I agree with some of the other posters in that she is not in love with you. This is displayed by her actions and thoughts on the matter.<br />
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Yes, she gave you "some" truth, but not all the truth. As with anyone that is in a relationship with someone they are not in love with, she has become a very selfish person. She does not truely care for you which is why she is telling you the truth about what she wants. What you want - she could care less.<br />
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Look here is a little analogy - what about the abusive husband that beats his wife, but tells her he loves her. Should she stay? Hell no. She beats you down, only cares about her own needs, but may tell you she loves you. Tell her to take that love and shove it.<br />
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Yes you have to make a decision.

HTB, thanks for sharing this, I read it, and I learned. Vegassbaby I think it was, said hope is the enemy. That's so true. I've been married ten years and I already feel like I'm living with the sister I never had. Her years of refusal have me conditioned to the point that sex with her (on the blue moon occasions it happens) is awkward for me. I feel your pain brother, I think my wife would tell me the same thing as yours did, if she'd be honest with me. You deserve better than that, and you can get it, but it comes at a price. And like you, the rest of us are sitting around deciding whether or not we're willing to pay it. Good luck,<br />

Straight up brotha, she aint in to you. you can continue to wade thru this oprah like bullsh!t or put an official end to a marriage that died years ago.

You are far from where you started. It will take time to process, but you have had the epiphany.<br />
Some time soon you will have decisions to make, but decisions based on truth. You can do no wrong now.<br />
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Good luck

I just read your post..another torturous evening...You need to watch just one more of those movies with her, and then ask her why she likes watching this crap when she doesn't want to even live it. Have you ever questioned wether she has someone else?

HTB, this is very sad and yet very helpful. Now you have confirmation that what you NEED is never going to be provided by the woman to whom you are married. <br />
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And my friend, you are not the Refuser. She is still the refuser - she refuses to have sex with you that has any meaning for you; she refuses to allow you to have any say in your own sex life; and IF you are willing to comply, she will grudgingly allow you access to her body very briefly a couple of times a year. . . . . The fact that you will not acquiesce to this does not make you a Refuser - it makes you a man with balls IMO!<br />
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Time to make the hard decisions IMO. What is keeping you with her at this stage? {{{Hugs}}}

THANK GOD for Bazzar .... he is telling it like it is !!!<br />
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Don't let the "right back where you started from:" ... deter your journey<br />
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This has nothing to do with age .. it has to do with individual needs and wants and desires.<br />
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OMG .. IT IS HARD, FRUSTRATING & PAINFUL .... to live the reality of exactly what kind of marriage relationship we have with our spouse. <br />
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It is a process ... it is a lot of things .... and we are all better for accepting and understanding ourselves. For many of us it is financial .. for others it is emotional .. for others it is impossible .. for others it is possible ... we are all different ... we have choices , <br />
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Every day I pray for strength and courage to overcome my fear and get on with my life before it is over. I know what happiness is .. I have tasted it and it is good ... once we realize we can never go back and I am not going to be struck in this self made purgatory. <br />
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I believe in myself ... I believe in happiness ....

You are indeed "right back where you started".<br />
It often takes us to do a few laps of the curcuit to find we arrive back at the same place. This isn't such a bad thing actually.<br />
It shows us the essential truth. As you put it "I am now the refuser and know for sure the rest of my married life is going to be intimacy free, both sexually and emotionally".<br />
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Unpleasant and sad as this revelation is you now know, and that is another good thing.<br />
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Now you move onto the next phase. "Can I accept that without resentment and bitterness ?" This question takes a while to ponder. You will know at some point what the answer is for you.<br />
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Even at the stage when you have your answer to the above question there is still a long way to go. It'll be hard, frustrating and painful - I can guarantee you that.<br />
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But I can also say that when you come out the other end (whatever that end is) it is just so worth every bit of pain, every frustration, every set back, every tear. <br />
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Good luck as you search for YOUR answers.