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New Territory

Well, there have been a few new developments for ol Dante this past week. After 25 years in a marriage with mostly bad sex, and 4 years of absolutely loathesome sexlessness, I am embarking on a new road that I have never travelled before. I have worked hard to be "faithful" and to honor my wedding vows and have never sought comfort in the arms of another woman despite the burning hell that is sexless marriage.
So many people have said that the "why" does not matter, but the mere existence of a sexless marriage is all we need to understand in order to act. That has never been the situation with me. I have always tried to understand the why, although it is not always something we can understand.
I now understand why I am in a sexless marriage. I am married to an asexual woman. Yes, skeptics, she is an asexual, no question. It was upon this revelation that I began to understand the why, and what I needed to do. The bottom line for me is that I do indeed love my wife. She is a good wife, excellent mother to our children, a brilliant, wonderful, professional person, who happens to have zero libido. I, however, have plenty of libido. We are a good fit everywhere but in bed.
Several times lately I have mentioned to her that I have been considering "outsourcing" my needs. I have considered escorts (yes, I know, a bad idea), and have been pondering having an affair (yes, I have read the brilliant piece about oursourcing your needs) for some time now, although I have not had any prospective partners waiting in the wings. Nor have I been willing to act in a manner that would destroy the life we have built together.
Until now.
I finally had a talk with my wife this past week. Not "the talk", there is nothing new to be said there, and nothing to be gained by going over it yet again. This time I told her how much I love her, and how I am committed to staying in our marriage for the long haul. I told her that I now understand the why regarding our SM, that she is an asexual, and that I am not. That we are simply sexually mismatched,and that I am not going to try to change her, and that I don't want to constantly be angry at her over this issue. I told her that I need to have my needs met, and that I knew she disliked sex, and that it was awful to me to see how much she disliked that which I like and need so much. I explained that I needed to fulfill those needs outside of our marriage, and that while I would rather not do that, I was no longer willing to go without the passion that is so much part of our human existence. She shed a few tears, and told me that she felt she had failed me. I told her it was no longer time for blame. She understood the why as well, and told me to do what I needed to do.
I have met an amazing woman who is in the same situation as I am, and wants the same things. We plan on meeting very soon, and sharing one of the greatest joys our humanity has to offer. We are going into this understanding the risks, but committed to doing this right. I feel I can go into these uncharted waters with a clear conscience, knowing I have done all I can do at home, including being extremely honest and above board with my wife.

To be continued...

DB2
DanteBurning2 DanteBurning2 46-50, M 18 Responses Jul 29, 2012

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I commend you on being upfront with your wife. Its a rare person who can address these topics with honesty.

I wish you luck in your new adventure.

Maybe there should be a box on a Marriage License application:<br />
<br />
Sexual Orientation - mark X next to the box that applies:<br />
I am/I declare myself to be:<br />
Heterosexual<br />
Homosexual<br />
Bisexual<br />
ASexual <br />
<br />
No, let's tweak that a bit:<br />
I am/I declare myself to be:<br />
Asexual<br />
Heterosexual<br />
Homosexual<br />
Bisexual<br />
<br />
Just sayin'.

Nah - you do not even have to love each other to get married! The license is to establish the legality of the union to qualify for disbursement of benefits from government and private organizations. Nothing else is required!

DB2,<br />
<br />
Good luck. My guess though is that if and when you do find the right person to 'outsource' your needs with, you will find it almost impossible to confine your feelings to an affair and that if the sex is great then you will want to be with that person all the time, each night, to be with and make love to. I know as I am in this situation right now. This shows us really that sex is not just sex, a physical itch to be scratched, but a fulfilment of all our deepest needs, and tbh there can be no such thing as a sexless marriage when one person is like you and your wife is so different. when you start having physical intimacy with someone like yourself you just can't get enough of it, you want to touch, to smell, to feel - and you will find yourself hating your wife for not being able to give you that wonderful sense. I know. I do not want to end my marriage and hurt my kids so I have a tough choice to make but in the end I know that I can't live for the rest of my life without sex as it is destroying me as a human being and I have now seen how great it can and should be.

Good luck, may hope trump experience yet once again!

A lil' story, for your consideration:<br />
<br />
At one point, my emotionally abusive ex-spouse suggested that "she wouldn't even be upset if I went and got it elsewhere." This comment made ME upset, because that probably meant that she was planning to (or already had done) the same thing. I passed on the "permission" and stayed faithful to my wife.<br />
<br />
Fast forward to the divorce. She takes the images of the hard drives that she STOLE from by office to a forensic IT guy, who scours them for evidence of websites visited, emails, pictures, ANYTHING that can be incriminating. Her goal: to offer this as evidence in court that I should not be allowed as much parenting time as I was requesting.<br />
<br />
I don't care what a spouse SAYS... and neither do the courts. GET IT IN WRITING, ESPECIALLY if you live in a state with both no-fault and fault divorce. The following states allow fault divorces in the case of adultery:<br />
<br />
Alabama<br />
Alaska<br />
Connecticut<br />
Delaware<br />
Georgia<br />
Idaho<br />
Illinois<br />
Maine<br />
Massachusetts<br />
Mississippi<br />
New Hampshire<br />
New Mexico<br />
North Dakota<br />
Ohio<br />
Oklahoma<br />
Pennsylvania<br />
Rhode Island<br />
South Dakota<br />
Tennessee<br />
Texas<br />
Utah<br />
West Virginia<br />
<br />
What this means is that she can be given a larger share of assets and parenting time, sole custody of your children, more spousal support, and other benefits if she can prove your adultery.<br />
<br />
If she agrees to this, write it down and get her to sign it. OR mention it in an email and, in another paragraph, ask a question that she must respond to (so she will reply to it). I believe this might serve as an ample defense (either condonation or connivance) should your spouse have a change of heart later. For more info, read: http://family.findlaw.com/divorce/an-overview-of-no-fault-and-fault-divorce-law.html

The "why" is not important for those who got it, but we are stuck chasing it, and once we too get our 'why" then it wont be important either.

Oceansun- The why remains important, even though I now understand it. Understanding a problem is the first step in solving the problem, or if unsolvable, to work around the problem. I am grateful to have the knowledge, and it is invaluable to me to understand what I need to do next. I now have a decision and a course after many years of drifting at sea hoping to be picked up out of the water. Time to set sail and hope my course is true...

I agree, this is "why" i say that saying "the why isn't important" is ridiculous!!!
Best of luck to you.

Ahhhh, now I understand, thank you!

Good luck. You're moving in some direction which is far better than not moving in any at all, given your current position. I will keep my fingers crossed that this goes how you hope, but either way I suspect it will result (sooner or later) in you ending up in a better place.<br />
<br />
All the best

Looks like you have your ba<x>ses covered.<br />
<br />
Standby for changes once you cross that line. Your marriage will not feel the same once you crossover...it might feel better or worse but how you experience it will be different.<br />
<br />
Good that you told wife of your intentions. Get ready to implement compartmental thinking to the maximum degree..no way around that.<br />
<br />
And be flexible....nothing will be certain here and your control is minimal with so many irons in the fire.<br />
<br />
I have been living this for over two years now and am doing well. It is a route not for the faint of heart and will tax every fiber your stamina and being....best wishes!

mvcmvc- Thank you! Like I said in the title, this is new territory for me, so I welcome advice from those who have the experience and knowledge I am about to gain.
DB2

Be ready for the unexpected. I see that you consider your wife to be aesexual. She may want to test that on her own by trying something new, herself. If you are outsourcing, make sure you sit down and discuss the parameters on BOTH sides, what it looks like, what it means, what's kosher and what's not. This can be done, but you want to make sure that there are no blindsides coming due to a misunderstanding, fueled by hurt feelings.

Nefandus-I have tried to mitigate the blindsides that I can forsee, and that others on EP have shared through their personal experience. I cannot predict what she will do at any given time, but I seriously doubt she would go that direction. One never knows what will happen.

Oh, and most importantly it's the safest sex you can have.

I suggest going the escort route... Know what you're getting, no strings - which is what you need being already married.

Thanks DustMite. I have considered the path you suggest for a long time. If I had not met the woman I referred to in the story, that would be a path to consider. At this juncture I think I have found a way to make a couple of people happy without burning everything down. All doors are still open, but I have found the one I want to enter.DB2

My thought is that in general, most folks in this situation are seeking more than gratification - they are seeking to be desired. I don't think I'd get that from an escort.

Consider ads, alternative dating sites, and if you live near one, a "lifestyle" club that allows single men, you may find like minded people who are ok exploring a friends with benefits option with some baked in limits.

Many people have this outlook - that an escort cannot provide real intimacy because you are paying her... It's not always true. Women on dating and swingers websites are still just women.... They have expectations and have I mentioned the competition? There is a sh*tload of competition for fun and frisky women that will provide all of the above, for free. This kind of woman is rare in itself but some do really enjoy pleasing others... The experience of being with multiple partners. Some just like being paid to provide that service.

My point above was that unlike with an escort, having an arranged "affair" or a friends with benefits situation can be difficult because it is not a professional relationship, things can go pear shaped, peoples feelings sometimes get in the way... Can become more trouble than what it's worth.

Just my humble opinion.

Many years ago a wise older man once told me: "this is not a dress rehearsal, this is life, and you only get one shot at it." Those words have echoed in my mind, and frequently left my lips over the 21 years since he said them to me. They are wise and true.<br />
It is time to live life to the fullest. I am weary of waiting for things that will never come, and understand that in order to have the things you need and want in life, you have to be willing to take the risks and go and get them! I feel like I am crouched in the door of the airplane at 14000 feet, just about to take that huge leap of faith.<br />
DB2

As ever, I cannot "like" your post (for some mysterious reason known only to the EP boffins!)_. But I LIKE it +++++++++++++! "You only get one life" has been my mantra for some time now. It is both sobering and exhilerating when you truly consider what it means. You may well find you just LOVE that free-falling experience!! {{{hugs}}}

Thanks Enna, the anticipation is thrilling, but the waiting to meet with my friend is killing me. Soon, though, soon! If that free fall is anything as exciting as the real thing, I am more than ready. Ironically, I am planning on going skydiving again in a few days. Should be a rush!
I wound up standing face to face with the grim reaper about four or five years ago, and that really makes you consider how important things in life are. I decided that before my next meeting wth him, I was going to live, and live a lot! I'm not in a hurry to meet with him, but I want to have no regrets when that time comes! I value my wife and kids so much, and I have had to decide that I need to value myself too. Here's hoping that I can maintain some sort of balance in my life!
Hugs to you too!!!

im looking for a nice woman to **** on me as we make love.

I think you may have made
a wrong turn somewhere...
don't think you are in the right group...
perhaps not even on the right site???
dunno...
but your post reminds me of Sesame Street
"one of these things is not like the other
one of these things just doesn't belong"
how bout just a lil
basic respect?
joyinthejourney,clg

Yuck!
DB2

I'm pretty sure there's a group for that. This group isn't the one.

Wow. Wish you the best, but I ditto what Enna and Baz said.

Dante, I truly wish you well. My dear Ex is very close to being asexual IMO. There are other issues too - no one simple "diagnosis" fits everyone. But asexual is pretty close for my Ex.<br />
<br />
Like you, I tried the FWB route - altho' I did NOT discuss it with my husband first. It was my experiences with that situation that lead me to write the story "outsourcing your needs". I just want you to know that altho you might think you can manage both relationships simultaneously - and manage to keep both women happy - the chances are NOT great unfortunately.<br />
<br />
What your wife agrees to in theory may NOT be something she is happy to accept if you come home from being out with your woman friend. Even if you take care NOT to flaunt it, your very demeanour will be a give-away. You will be happier, calmer and probably nicer!! Your wife might find that VERY hard to accept with equanimity in reality - even if she is fine with the idea in theory.<br />
<br />
And I think you underestimate the effects of great sex with an amazing woman. In my experience it highlights what is missing in your marriage - thus making the long term prospect of remaining in the marriage even less bearable than before.<br />
<br />
And please keep in mind that your FWB is also a variable that you cannot control. What if she falls for you? How will you cope if she wants you to leave your wife for her?<br />
<br />
IF you think through all these considerations and decide to go ahead, that is fine. It will mean you are prepared for the possible pitfalls ahead.<br />
<br />
But please don't think that getting your wife's "permission" is going to result in a smooth path ahead! If it does, you are lucky. But it is quite likely to NOT be the case.<br />
<br />
Whatever your future holds, I think that once you experience genuine loving and intimate sex, you will find you can no longer accept the status quo. . . . .

Enna,
Thank you for your kind words and wise warnings. I have been wrestling with this decision for a very long time, and have played out many scenarios in my mind regarding the pitfalls ahead of me. The brilliant story on outsourcing needs I referenced is the very one that you wrote. I am not going into this with the assumption that it will all be smooth sailing and sunny skies. I actually anticipate a storm when I get home from visiting my friend, but I am willing to accept that if it happens. She understands and seems to take ownership to her role in this. We both know that if we had any semblance of a physical relationship, that I would never even have landed on this forum, and would not be forced to make this choice.
I am very aware that emotional entanglement with a lover is a very real potential issue, and it has always been the one that has caused me to shy away from this decision. My good friend and I both are committed to our SMs, and both have a lot to lose, and a lot to gain. As I have gotten a bit older in life, I have finally come to realize that the only person I can control in my life is me. I cannot change my wife into a sexual person any more then I can transform myself into an asexual person.
I do not know what the future holds for me. I hope it is great sex without gut wrenching guilt and major fallout. The only way to know is to go plunging headlong into the future, while knowing I have calculated and mitigated all the risks that I could along the way.
For now, it is time to enjoy life!
DB2

Actually, you sound quite a lot like me! I had not found ILIASM when I embarked on this journey so there was much I did not yet know about sexless marriage. And I didn't have an Exit Plan. But I DID think to myself "Let the straws fall where they may. If this results in my having to leave my marriage because my husband finds out, so be it." As you know, it didn't turn out like that but I did leave.
Wherever this journey takes you, you seem to be fully aware and prepared for the potential outcomes. I wish you nothing but joy, happiness and GREAT sex!!!!

"I am committed to staying in our marriage for the long haul" & "I have done all I can do at home, including being extremely honest and above board with my wife."<br />
<br />
Very laudable and honorable. Please be aware at least as a probability, that she may react differently, not be committed to your marriage, and not being honest.<br />
<br />
So, get yourself the backstops, and enjoy the moments. Wherever they lead. Congratulations by the way, on owning your needs.

hl42- I thank you for your kind assessment of my motives. I am very aware of the potential consequences, up to and including being kicked to the curb by my wife. I cannot predict the future, and no longer pretend to do so. I will have to see how this all plays out, thus the "to be continued..."
If it all goes awry, it will be like a hangover: a self-inflicted wound not worthy of anyone's sympathy.
DB2

Dante - I think that - whatever happens - you'll be going from Hell via Purgatory/Limbo to Heaven (though the SM is anything but a divine comedy, and I found Aleghieri's Heaven insufferable!). I do also think that you're being charitable to your W - granted that it's best to do this kindly because you still love her, yet as asexual as she may be, she's not been the one to understand and make this offer, you have. So keep your compassion practical.

Sexless marriage is an evil tragedy, not a Divine Comedy. Although perhaps there are divine puppetmasters who are laughing at our misery...

So learn to laugh back at the puppetmasters.

1 More Response

You know I wish you the best, but I *am* worried about the potential for things to go awry. Play carefully...

msdamgoode- If one chooses to stroll through a minefield, one must accept the reality of stepping on a mine. I have avoided this minefield too long, and starved at the edge of it for 28 years. Cross it and live or cross it and die, I must cross it.
DB2

See a lawyer brother.<br />
<br />
You are about to open Pandora's box - and there is nothing wrong with that - but you need to acknowledge that this can very easily spin off in unknown and unknowable directions.<br />
<br />
Legal advice about how a divorce would shake out for you will do you no harm at all.<br />
<br />
Already, you refer to this chick as "an amazing woman" and it ain't such a stretch for that to turn into "an amazing woman I want to be with".<br />
<br />
Play ? By all means.<br />
<br />
But play safe. See a lawyer. Do-able exit strategy. You may never need to activate it, your plan might work like a Swiss watch and the FWB seamlessly become part of your life. But, it is high risk stuff, and a safety net is required.<br />
<br />
Play safe.<br />
<br />
Tread your own path.

Brother Baz- The research has been done, the plan. although not as detailed as I typically plan, is laid out.
As far as the amazing woman, she is pretty amazing. Neither of us are looking to replace our spouse, but to fulfill that which an SM has robbed from us. I think we both have looked closely at the cost/benefit analysis, and have calculated that the benefits are greater than the risks. As I enter this new territory, I know there could be grave consequences, as well as mountain top experiences.
Thank you for your wise words.
DB2

You never know the path life will take you. I strongly doubt what your crystal ball is telling you, but having no crystal ball myself, I can't prove it. Time will tell. The journey has begun...
DB2

the word that came to me<br />
more than once while reading<br />
was<br />
honorable...<br />
joyinthejourney, clg

clgsassy- Thank you so much! I have tried to live honorably and treat people well. I know no other way to live. Even with something so risky, I have tried to do it with honor and respect.
DB2