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I Live In a Sexless Marriage

Rejection Hurts.

By: hl42
Written on December 17th, 2012
By: hl42
Age: 51-55 , Male
958 people have read this story

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53 responses
  • SoftWillie

    Ah, but you are supporting your own well-being (not to mention ours) just by being here and by sharing your research. Well done.
    And I was just reaching for my paracetemol this morning. Good thing you warned me against it.
    Your analysis paragraph (c) is most true.... getting out and about with other people is a distraction which lessens the stress hormone levels - and if done in the right company can increase testosterone release!

    1 day ago
    3 likes
    • hl42

      Go for it!

      17 hours ago
      1 like
  • YB01

    To answer one of your questions my wife ended our sexual relations six years ago.

    Jan 8
    1 like
    • hl42

      Thanks for the update - I had a look at your description of one of your hiking trips, sounded great "fun" - care in the community at your risk?! I've done a swag trip in the MacDonalds, but that was pretty tame as we had a vehicle pretty close & satellite phone available...

      It sounds fairly unilateral behavior from your wife. Would it be useful at all for you to post your story, or are you not seeking feedback?

      If you read more here, you might spot I'm not a great fan of the sexual addiction label - I guess it depends how useful a metaphor it is for you, and that you are able to resist the limitations implied.

      Jan 8
      1 like
  • YB01

    Thank you for referring me to AVEN....it was helpful.

    Bob

    Jan 8
    1 like
  • YB01

    Have been hiking / camping for a week so no response possible by myself until now.

    I take your point about vocabulary. I should have thanked you for introducing me to a new word. It was remiss of me not to do so before.

    I am unaware on the "Aven" reference. Shall google it. Thank you again for your willingness to share.

    My interest stems from a sexual addiction that I suffer from. Working with some counsellors in this field, attending support groups ( eg SA, SLAA, SAA, AA, Al Anon, CoDA ) has led to learning tools to interrupt the obsessive thinking and halt compulsive behaviours. As well I sponsor ( mentor other men here in Australia ) who suffer from this affliction.

    Thanks

    Jan 6
    1 like
  • YB01

    Why not just say "excessive wordiness" ?

    Dec 28, 2012
    1 like
    • hl42

      It seems I can't win here: either I'm concise and use one word which may be understood by some, or else I use 2 and then can be accused of being wordy.

      The real reason for using prolixity is threefold: one, I think it provides some amusement or levity, two, I enjoy using the English language even though my writing isn't ideal (I do try), and third, it was a possibly not very worthy way of saying pvss off.

      I'll use the words I want thank you, I do think about what I say (which is more than some appear to), I don't type on some rubbishy tablet or phone and expect people to read what I say. And the pay's not good.

      Jan 2
      1 like
    • maryryan

      You're not windy, hl...many people are not used to scholarly writing (or they don't like it or understand it). Plus, if they read carefully, they will see the wittiness behind your remarks. You keep on being hl, K??

      Jan 8
      1 like
    • hl42

      Thanks MR, nice to hear from you, it's good to have your breath of sanity. I guess people are wrapped up in themselves to the extent they can't see the context - and perhaps that's a component of their problem?

      Jan 8
      1 like
    • enna30

      Agree with MR. There is a reverse snobbery about people who quibble with words they don't know. The beauty of language is that there ARE words for every condition, feeling, idea, thought, belief, state, postulation, etc. etc! And using the CORRECT word helps to clarify meaning. If someone is too lazy (especially in these days of the Net) to look up a word, then they are hardly likely to put any energy into understanding the post!!!

      BTW I didn't know the word either!!

      Jan 8
      1 like
    1 More Reply
  • YB01

    "Prolixity" ..........?

    Dec 28, 2012
    1 like
  • YB01

    I have met people in 12 step groups who have revealed "sexual anorexia" issues.

    If this exists ( we seem to accept that food anorexia is a condition ) then there may be a percentage of the population who suffer from this disorder.

    I have sought to enquire diplomatically ( hoping I was empathetic ) of a source of the condition from the people I have met who assert they are sexually anorexic. It's my understanding that sexual abuse as a child can be a factor.

    Dec 27, 2012
    2 likes
    • hl42

      I take it you're aware of the Aven site which covers various forms of asexuality.

      What is your interest in this area?

      Jan 2
      1 like
    • hl42

      PS, why the presumption that there has to be a cause? I've heard descriptions from people who have never had any strong sexual feelings and were not abused. They feel that's the way they are made and do not like feeling broken for who they are (which is potentially the subtext of the causation argument, for example, the abuse "reason" still implies they're damaged due to another's fault). And in the cases I describe, that's simply not true.

      Jan 2
      1 like
  • ScooterLuv

    You could have said this in a more concise form and achieved the same results.

    Dec 18, 2012
    1 like
    • hl42

      Well, people have different preferences for how they consume information. Some find examples or more discursive descriptions more valuable. So whereas I might have been more concise and have it benefit you, that's not true for others. If you find my prolixity tiresome, you know what to do.

      Dec 19, 2012
      1 like
  • Hithier

    I am introverted and I really don't care if I get rejected, but when I was younger I used to get rejected and I used to feel humiliated and hurt. Awesome post by the way.

    Dec 18, 2012
    1 like
  • garvan

    What a terrific post,very interesting and thought provoking.

    Dec 18, 2012
    1 like
  • hyrok40

    There is a great way to combat rejection and anger, I call it "protect your soul". It is hard when your spouse is non responsive (we are all there) but you can adjust your expectation and protect your soul. I also think twice before making any conversation with anybody, whether it is the bill collector or the clark at the register or my spouse. What I learned, it makes a big difference how you approach a situation, even if someone is mean to you, you have the power to turn it around. Winning in an argument is not worth hurting your soul. At the end of the day If I am not thinking about something negative I won. Good luck and God Bless you all.

    Dec 18, 2012
    3 likes
  • elkclan

    Although I've removed myself from the bedroom, I live with an ongoing sense of rejection. He doesn't care enough to make an effort. He'd rather see me live in misery (and live in misery himself, I guess) than make an effort. This still stings.

    Dec 18, 2012
    3 likes
    • hl42

      I'm very sorry Elk. I loved your dark humor in the forum about giving him a bad sexual experience - wanting some....

      Dec 18, 2012
      1 like
  • mettagrl

    This is so interesting to me as my husband of 29 years 364 days continues to push me away as he discovers his creativity with a soprano, his "best friend". The physical sensations I have of a splitting hot wet feeling at the center of my chest are like a knife might feel. When I practice breathing and non-reactivity, he gets "nice". Makes sense, for him to keep his power, I need to want his attention. I am coping with profound rejection while trying my best to keep my head up.

    Dec 18, 2012
    2 likes
  • sunsure

    Good post

    Dec 17, 2012
    1 like
  • LaoTzu

    I love your post. I remember that breathelessness and the pain. Its why I usually start a lot of my comments here with 'Breathe'. We have to breathe through it so we can see and feel clearly.

    Dec 17, 2012
    11 likes
  • emdi

    This is VERY informative. I'm an introvert, and a seventeen year old. Typically, I feel rejected even BEFORE I can be rejected! Ah, I am the origin of my own apathy; I suppose I may have a more sensitive response... The "safe" aspect really does make sense. Thanks so much for posting.

    Dec 17, 2012
    1 like
  • Fearlessdomine

    Rejectin made me indepedent and stronger a i have friends who are rejects

    Dec 17, 2012
    1 like
  • vaguestbaby

    I was rejected my whole life, by my family, peers, and very much professionally for a very long time. It took its toll, but it made me strong.

    But when I was rejected by my wife after being loyal and giving for so long, I experienced it as betrayal. I fell into alcoholism to dull that betrayal pain. Rejection was always a walk in the park compared to that back-stabbing disloyalty. I used to hide a bottle of brandy in a bush to take a big swig out of before going in the house. Eventually, that would have killed me.

    For me, being a person who lives by a code, my self-betrayal out by the bush was worse than her loveless betrayal. One betrayal fed the other.

    So just to split hairs, I say it's the fundamental betrayal that scars you, not the rejection. Rejection is a rational choice, betrayal is a moral one.

    I can easily live the rest of my life without love or loyalty if it came down to it. But I cannot bear betrayal another second longer in my life.

    Dec 17, 2012
    9 likes
    • FriendofPromise

      VB, you have really struck a note with me... I understand exactly what you mean...

      If I did that sort of thing I would type "like" in all caps, followed by a whole row of little plus signs... lol...

      Dec 17, 2012
      1 like
    • hl42

      Betrayal was the feeling uppermost in my mind at the end - which is what it is. And VB, you have done it, you've got the scars and you don't need hypervigilence anymore. Your moral reaction has done its work (as it did for me). Thank you for your comments.

      Dec 18, 2012
      1 like
  • Tallred

    Really interesting and nicely written :)

    Dec 17, 2012
    1 like
  • theremustbeawayout

    Here is the link for "Getting the Cold Shoulder:"

    http://www.nytimes.com/2012/12/09/opinion/sunday/the-chill-of-loneliness.html?_r=0

    The bulk of the article talks about how feeling lonely or rejected causes the skin to cool by a measurable amount; how this also changes how we perceive our physical environment; and how the application of warmth to the skin, such as a cup of joe, cause people to be more sociable. (I doubt, however, that turning up the thermostat or feeding our refusers hot soup will make a difference!)

    The reference to the study about primary/primal relationships, physical touch, and warmth, is further down in the article.

    Dec 17, 2012
    1 like
    • theremustbeawayout

      (Grammar police): ...caused... or ....causes....

      Dec 17, 2012
      1 like
  • enna30

    Excellent article hl, and very appropriate for our forum. I do thank you for taking the time to research the issue so throughly. I think that instinctively many of us realise the truth of this, but without actually acknowledging it. Seeing it in "black and white" does give it a veracity that our feelings cannot do.

    I suffer from some undiagnosed autoimmmune issues which I believe are the result of ongoing stress. Whilst my SM was not the only stress in my life (far from it!) it was certainly the longest lasting. . . .

    Your timely reminder about exercise is very valuable too. Note to self" Back to the gym!

    Dec 17, 2012
    3 likes
    • hl42

      I've always hated Platonic dualism (well, since I've known what it is!) - and now listen better to "little" messages. Accepting the SM for so long was doing violence to myself, I now see. Almost certainly the stress involved would result in raised cortisols etc, and the studies specifically referred to increased sensitivity that results from that prolonged (stress) arousal.

      Back to the gym before the NY?! Go for it!

      Dec 18, 2012
      1 like
    • TrulyMadlyDeeply38

      First reference of "platonic dualism" I have ever come across. I appreciate knowing it (splitting of body and soul is the most succinct definition I happened upon).

      I was blaming my grey hair, today, on my SM. LOL. But perhaps it's a result of rejection.

      There is much to embrace (pun intended) by rejecting platonic dualism.

      Thank you for enlightening me, HL42.

      16 hours ago
      2 likes
  • hl42

    Hope this works as a number of references for the info in the post.

    New Scientist summary (but this requires you to subscribe to get full text)
    http://www.newscientist.com/article/mg21628932.100-why-words-are-as-painful-as-sticks-and-stones.html

    Does Rejection Hurt? An fMRI Study of Social Exclusion -(Neuroimaging of social exclusion in online game)
    http://www.sciencemag.org/content/302/5643/290.abstract

    Social rejection shares somatosensory representations with physical pain (people recalling recent relationship break-up)
    http://www.pnas.org/content/108/15/6270.short

    Acetaminophen Reduces Social Pain - Behavioral and Neural Evidence
    http://pss.sagepub.com/content/21/7/931

    Variation in the μ-opioid receptor gene (OPRM1) is associated with dispositional and neural sensitivity to social rejection
    http://www.pnas.org/content/106/35/15079.full

    Time spent with friends in adolescence relates to less neural sensitivity to later peer rejection
    http://scan.oxfordjournals.org/content/7/1/106

    Shared sensitivity to physical pain and social rejection
    http://sanlab.psych.ucla.edu/papers_files/Eisenberger_pain%20%282006%29.pdf

    Neural correlates of giving support to a loved one
    http://www.psychosomaticmedicine.org/content/early/2011/11/09/PSY.0b013e3182359335.abstract

    Also, a rather more general description of the vital entwinement of the body with emotions and the mind in a popular book.

    The Feeling of What Happens
    Antonio Demasio

    There's also a study by James Coan which shows competely different responses to pain when in a good relationship versus a troubled one.

    http://psyphz.psych.wisc.edu/web/pubs/2006/CoanLendingPsychSci.pdf

    What a shame that our spouses have not been such a support, instead a cause of pain.

    Dec 17, 2012
    4 likes
  • theremustbeawayout

    Great post. I can only add information from an article in a recent New York Times, which cites research indicating that our primary relationships--parent/child and spousal--are formed and secured by physical contact. How about that? Scientific proof that debunks the crazy idea that a spousal relationship can be terrific except for physical intimacy; that such an idea is frankly impossible.

    Dec 17, 2012
    4 likes
    • elkclan

      can you remember the name of the article so I can google it?

      Dec 17, 2012
      1 like
    • hl42

      Thanks, I'd love to see that reference too. I guess the problem is that there are those who apparently don't need physical intimacy. But then, the question is, what business do they have getting married (especially to a sex person).

      Dec 17, 2012
      1 like
    • maryryan

      I think that non-sex people get married for reasons of societal expecation and compliance with norms. Many of us here are "nice" people and we ARE appealing. I also think there are many, many people (categorized as non-sex folks, naturally) who believe that sex does and should fade with age and they're relieved when that time comes. For us, it's the beginning of our nightmare.

      Jan 8
      1 like
  • clgsassy

    Wow... i would
    love to read the material you
    read for this information...
    always knew it instinctively
    but had not read any recent studies....
    thanks, clg

    Dec 17, 2012
    1 like
  • Awakeforthedance

    Love this, Hl42! (why do I call you Hi, when that's an HL?) Yes, it is a physical pain -- all of our emotions manifest physically in our body (just peaches must be on this wavelength today, too, with her status update). I equated it to the death of affection and I felt the same physical symptoms as I did the day after dad died. A choking feeling. Suffocating. Total ball of grief in the chest (heart). I have felt that many nights, too, when I know I can't just turn towards him and give/receive affection.

    YES to the exercise!! A million times, yes. I think exercise and healthy nutrition makes us more sane. Add meditation and yes, supporting others, to that and life is pretty awesome.

    While doing all those things to cope and be happy within my own life, I have changed way beyond the confines of this marriage. SM has made me who I am and I am grateful for who I am becoming. ;)

    Yes, numbing ourselves is ignoring what our soul is trying to say to us. I know not everyone agrees with this, but I personally believe depression is our true selves crying for our attention.

    Dec 17, 2012
    6 likes
    • clgsassy

      so well spoken...
      can relate deeply...
      i have also looked at depression as
      anger/rage...turned inward...
      rather than where the anger belongs...
      dunno...just know...
      it is definitely a loss, a significant grief...
      felt by me, at times...
      all over my body...
      11 years is a lot of rejection/pain
      to process, heal from...
      and release......
      without grace,
      impossible
      joyinthejourney, clg

      Dec 17, 2012
      1 like
    • Blueyedme

      I still cannot believe that there really are people that feel the exact same way and can understand. I honestly thought it was just me and I was made to feel I had unrealistic expectations and severe mental issues for feeling the way I do. You have no idea how reading all this is helping me. Thank you all! Wow......

      Dec 17, 2012
      1 like
    • hl42

      Yes, perhaps when people say they are coping, what is really happening is that they are ignoring messages until they come out with a 2x4 and whack them into acting. Sounds like you're much more attentive. The feelings for me were very similar to grief and loss too.

      If it helps, I did some mind-games where I took the representations of those feelings of rejection (for me, a black, horrible disk), and changed their size and placement, then put them somewhere that would keep me safe, but that were no longer in the foreground and blighting my life.

      Dec 18, 2012
      1 like
  • OldTexasFreebird

    yes please post the references :)

    Dec 17, 2012
    1 like
  • angryguy77

    This was an interesting read, thanks for sharing.

    Dec 17, 2012
    3 likes
  • EinEngel

    Oh my. Eye opening. Would it surprise you to know I take at least 8 paracetamol a week for minor pains? Maybe I am really taking it for something else.

    Dec 17, 2012
    3 likes
  • smithy8015

    thanks for this, hl. it's in accordance with your post, and timely, that i've noted my own personal pain has eased a LOT recently. why?

    *i am working out regularly.

    *i've come here fairly regularly for a while now & feel connected, supported, and supportive.

    *i've opened up to a select few friends that I can "vent" to.


    on the flip side, i compare this to several months ago. my H quite successfully managed my social separation from meaningful time with friends for years. isolation is painful; when accompanied by a sexless marriage with a P/A refusing spouse, it's that much harder.

    i had also not worked out regularly for quite some time. i know all the right things to do: taught fitness classes & was a personal trainer "on the side" for a number of years. i had just given up on doing things i enjoyed.

    so for those of us out there reading....take the time to do things for yourself. start small and work up to bigger. it helps tremendously.

    rated up!

    Dec 17, 2012
    5 likes
    • hl42

      Thanks, one of the chilling - and perhaps diagnostic - reactions from the refuser is to kick-back against attempts to increase your support and friend network, and to isolate you socially. Because they recognise in that an increase in your power and ability to look after yourself without them, and a reduction of their power.

      Dec 17, 2012
      1 like
    • smithy8015

      yes....i recognize his latest push back efforts. sorry, not buying this time!

      Dec 17, 2012
      1 like
  • Fienchanny

    A timely, well-written article. Thank you.

    Dec 17, 2012
    3 likes