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6 Year Marriage, Still Less Than Once A Month

I really don't know how this is ever going to get better. She says it will, she always says it will, it never does.

I just can't get past the guilt of leaving her over it even though it's making me miserable.

I don't want to be reliant on someone else for happiness, and there are lots of other things I am happy about, but without the intimate relationship I don't feel happy or comfortable in this marriage.

The last time we talked she said something along the lines of not liking being relied on for my happiness. Maybe me wanting sex more often is actually the turn off? But I don't just want sex for the release, I want to make her happy too. Sex with us has always been great, selfless and mutually pleasing.

6 years is going to turn into 20 and then where will I be? An old man who gave up sex to stay with the mother of his children cause he felt too guilty to do what would make him happy. How is that a good foundation for a marriage?
wantingandwaiting wantingandwaiting 36-40, M 14 Responses Jan 8, 2013

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You are not relying on her for your happiness. You are relying on her for sex. You are stuck with that if you want to keep your marriage monogamous.

You also need to accept that she and you have different levels of desire, and as of now, your sex life is being run on her optimal frequency.

The situation will definitely get worse over time. Even assuming that for now, this is the only problem you have (though I think you have two problems - lack of a matched desire, and an unwillingness for her to compromise to make you happy), there will be more problems in the future. You will still want sex, she will push you away, you will feel rejected, she will find ways to push you further away so you stop bothering her for sex.

Personally, I waited too long to force the issue. It would be a mistake for you to do the same.

The decision to leave is made by only a very select few. It has nothing to do with the alignment of the stars and planets but rather an internal alignment of self awareness, the overwhelming drive of the soul to live again and the ability to over-ride fear and push through what has, over the years, come to be a familiar pain threshold. Most who stay, get on with the distraction of being busy, paper and pencil exercises and wishful thinking. No one gets a pass on choice.

ModLulu is right. I have not seen a single person turn their ship around on this board without rocking the boat until it tips. By that, I mean an imminent and timed consequence to the dynamic in the relationship that your partner is aware of --something you are prepared to not only follow through on, but also to ensure that she is aware that you are doing so.

If you plan to stick (and I understand why you would), then what OTHER consequences can you introduce? No change is going to happen if the only consequence is the occassional "talk". It's not enough to take it seriously - the talk can obviously be tolerated and buy time.

As far as I can tell, the only two catalysts that seem to supply sufficient motivation to at least "intend to change":

1. Separation - beyond the threat - actually talking to lawyers, attending to the practical matters of it and affording it, and executing the plan with intention to carry it out.

2. either the DISCOVERY of an affair, or the declared intention to openly seek a lover and follow through - someone who has game, whereas a partner doesn't. Either one will shatter a partner's complacency and sense of security or control in a situation.

Well spoken coudn't agree more. Good advice this is.

You seem financially in a hard place right now but you have been more patient than any normal person would have been. It is of course only my opinion but when sexual intimacy is considered irrelevant to a partner in a marriage that is a valid indication that the refuser cares little or nothing for the other's needs or desires.
These circumstance do not resolve themselves and as the years pass only result in a growing disdain and and general discord in the relationship.
It may be a good time when circumstances again warrant a move to do so.

Waiting for things to improve will not work. You will wait forever. You have to take a stand for yourself and DO something.

If she wants to stay married to you, she will want to work on intimacy with you. If she has no interest in intimacy with you, then she will have made the decision for you.

I also turned my SM around with my husband and wrote about my experience (What I Did About It, Parts 1-4).

Wanting, I understand your reluctance to do anything for now. What I find difficult to understand is how this last pregnancy occurred. (No, I don't mean the basic mechanics!) Did you discuss with your wife how dysfunctional your marriage was for you? Did she fall pregnant by tricking you? Or did you both agree on another baby?

I'm sure you would agree that adding another child has not been helpful to the situation - no matter how much you both love your kids.

The problem of sexless marriage is compounded by children as we know. So I can see that your situation is definitely set back by the new baby. Your wife will certainly need your involvement and support during the next few months and years.

Have you considered personal counselling? You might find it helpful. At a later point, you might persuade your wife to also take part. . . .

I am sure we are all aware that pregnancy can occur even though you are being careful....

No. If you are truly unhappy in your marriage and contemplating divorce then sex should be protected multiple times over or not had at all. People who have oopsie babies when the marriage is on the rocks are not being nearly careful enough... just like people who are too young to be having children. Sorry to be tough on you, but bringing a child into the relationship that has been consistently this unstable and unhappy is unfair to the child. It's so easy to then say "but we were being careful." It reminds me of when I was a teenager and lost control of my car in a bad rainstorm on a highway. My uncle fussed at me in his worried-uncle way for driving too fast. I said I wasn't even driving too fast, it was below the speed limit. Without missing a beat he said "Obviously it was too fast, since you lost control of your car." Those are lessons we have to OWN, not chalk up to "we were being careful and it happened anyway."

"6 years is going to turn into 20 and then where will I be?"
Yes, then into 30... Only you can set yourself free and the sooner the better...

Brother Lao mentioned a week or so back that persons in ILIASM marriages for the most part, don't leave.

At the time, I thought "that's not right", but a rudimentary sampling of stories from 2 years back confirms Lao's claim.

Here you are brother W, 3 plus years down the track, and there seems no evidence that in another 3 years that your position will be any different.

Why bother worrying about it ? Just float on as the wind takes you. You won't be any worse off.

Tread your own path.

Well, a little over a year ago we had another talk and we started having sex a little more frequently. As it happens it was a short burst followed by her becoming pregnant. The morning sickness this time around was bad and we didn't have sex the first four months of her pregnancy. (Morning? it last 24/7 and I didn't blame her or pressure her for not wanting sex, it was awful to watch her go through it). We did have sex a couple more times before she got really pregnant and sex become uncomfortable. Now we have a 6 month old son at home. We had sex a coupe months after he was born and 3 more times since. (four times in the last 4 months.) So I don't want to make decisions on our sexual relationship based on the last year, as there are REAL reasons for the lack of currently. I am just worried that after those reasons disappear it won't get better, the same as the last time we had a baby.

This would come under the heading "Redundant Information" now, but, there you were with a dysfunctional marriage on your hands dating since at least Aug 2009, and you chose (or were rail roaded into) impregnationg her again in in Nov 2011 ?

I am sure we are all aware that pregnancy can occur even though you are being careful....

So wanting, are you saying you were using condoms and she was on birth control? Don't mean to be blunt but women around these forums often reportedly get a surge of sexual interest when it's time to have another baby and then it vanishes, sometimes for good, when the family is complete. That is also when oops my pills didn't work sometimes happens.

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Brotherwantingandwaiting you are one of the older members here and should know better. If you havent read up in the 3 years you have been on here i suggest you do so now.

Also the basics are as follows. Make a decision that you are no longer prepared to stand for this kind of behavour, tell her one last time than go out and see a lawyer, find out your rights and prepare an exit plan.

Actions speak louder than words and it would seem that she thinks your full of hot air on the matter.

Stay Strong & Good Luck

I have read up, and I would be likely looking at exit plans in another year or so after her maternity leave and baby-related issues are gone and things don't improve.

WaW, you have been here (on ILIASM) since August 2009. You still seem to be in the same place as you were then. What steps have YOU taken to move this forward? Are you undergoing personal therapy? Have you explained to your wife that her attitude to sex is a dweal-breaker for you? Have you seen a lawyer to find out what would happen in case of a divorce?

You are, it seems, waiting and wanting - but NOT doing! Sorry to be harsh, but as a long term member here I'm sure you MUST know that your "wait and see" appproach is never going to bear any fruit . . . .

With a six month old at home and her on maternity leave for another 6 months, and having been just laid off before she delivered, it's not the best time to talk about divorce for her or my sake. She is in a very dependent stage right now and a divorce at this stage would be bad for me financially and socially, bad for her emotionally and financially and I don't want to be away from my son that much at this young age.

I don't think Enna is talking about just divorce. There are plenty of other proactive things you can be doing to at least try to improve things. You two should be in counseling and/or individual therapy. You should be talking about your deal-breakers in your relationship, you should be trying to enjoy intimacy and sensuality in a broader sense (not just P-in-V intercourse), you should be open with her about your concerns and unhappiness AND your desires.

Lu, thank you. You have expressed very well what I was trying to say. WaW, please consider taking actions rather than just waiting. Ultrimately those actions will either lead to a cure or lead to a divorce. But with things as they are now, only a divorce seems possible.

There are many steps between where you are (and have been for the last nearly 4 years) and divorce. Start making some in a direction. It will provide clarity and shake up the status quo. If you keep driving down the same road in the same direction it should be no surprise to you when you arrive at your destination.

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I'm right there with you. I feel your pain. Been married for 15 years, together for 20 since school and college. 2 years into the marriage I got told,"I don't like it" This destroyed my world. She sees it as a duty to perform, not a mutual pleasure. We must average about once every 2-3 months. Feel like I've taken a vow of chastity. Lived with this for so long it drove me into a deep depression which luckily is now sorted.
I hope you sort things out, please try Relate-some good therapy there ;)

Relate?

How is it sorted?

The main thing I learned from my 10-year SM was: listen to their ACTIONS, not their WORDS.

What she's showing you - and actually telling you in this case - is that your needs and wants are not important. Is that the marriage you desire?

Please read my post on the forum about why your sex life is probably bad, hope this helps....

http://www.experienceproject.com/groups/Live-In-A-Sexless-Marriage/forum/How-Im-Starting-To-Turn-My-Sex-Life-Around/82597

Please also note the many comments on the fact that this is what worked for ONE couple, and might not work in general for anyone else.

Well the principles I'm using are working for MANY couples.

They didn't work for me so...

What didn't work for you?

Just about everything on your list.

I read the linked forum post and was disgusted. No wonder that hasn't worked for the OP. Anyone who blames lack of sexuality in women on "feminism" is wrong. It's just plain wrong.

My Bad. I should have been clearer in my OP. Feminism has been responsible for demonizing Male sexual needs to the point of a man needing an explicit green light before commencing sex. Anything else is considered automatic Rape. This subtle message pemuates through society.

Unfortunately for men (and women) this kills the major turn on for woman, and puts both in a catch 22 situation.

Women are turned on by seeing their man desire/want/lust after them, and putting that desire into action through dominance, playful flirting, and following through, e.g. pinning his woman to the bed and having animal sex with her because he 'absolutely must have her'. In a loving relationship this would be fantastic, but brow beaten husbands have been reduced to having to plead for sex, because of the wives reactive desire being offline through lack of dominance/alpha displays by the husband, who themselves fear being dominant and showing his desire for his wife sexually.

Asking for sex is the biggest turn off for women.

I partly agree with you!

"Women are turned on by seeing their man desire/want/lust after them, and putting that desire into action through . . . playful flirting, and following through, e.g. pinning his woman to the bed and having animal sex with her because he 'absolutely must have her'. In a loving relationship this would be fantastic"

I removed "dominance" be ause for methat is NOT a turn on.

"Asking for sex is the biggest turn off for women." This is definitely true in a dysfunctional situation - but it applies equally to me. NEITHER sex should have to beg their spouses for sex.

AND . . . I actually like asking my partner for sex. He sees it as me desiring him and wanting him - which I do! - and it works well for us. I suspect other women may share this with me.

I notice you are STILL talking in absolutes - as if all men and women are the same. Surely you realise this simplistic viewpoint DETRACTS from anything of value you have to say?

>>AND . . . I actually like asking my partner for sex. He sees it as me desiring him >>and wanting him

I wish my wife did, but you are in a minority. Even the general Feminist movement has coined the phrase 'Reactive Desire' to characterize that the majority of woman have to be seduced before having sex, and will never initiate. And from what I've seen on the other forum (Google Married Men sex life), the majority of the women on there do not directly initiate, even though they are trying to get more sex out of their husband. They will however give signals they are receptive, flirting etc.

>>I notice you are STILL talking in absolutes

Well I'd say I'm basing my observations on what the majority of woman do/want, which is based on lots of research and women's opinions on other relevant forums. Very few women will openly initiate sex for fear of being labelled a ****/*****, etc by society.

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Thats what I am very scared of. My husband and I have sex still about twice a month, sometimes more. But I'm very worried that it will get less and less. Then I'll be in my 40s saying the same thing, and missing out on something I really need. Its not selfish or wrong need intimacy with your spouse. Most things are okay with my marriage except for the intimacy. I debate a lot whether its enough to leave. Some days I'm more sure then others.

I hope it gets better for you. You deserve to be happy and have the marraige you desire.