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Astronomy And Islam

Let's go to the beginning, to the very beginning. Before the big bang, there was a state of timelessness.

Quran 6:101 - "Creator of the heavens and the earth from nothingness..."

Throughout the Qur'an, Allah created everything from something, except the universe, which was created from nothing. This "nothingness" was a state of timelessness, which is bound by no laws or logic. The fact that the universe violated the 1st law of thermodynamics (energy cannot be created) just means that, outside of our universe, there is a zero state where our universe's laws do not apply. Many ancient religions have the idea of "chaos" in the beginning. In short, there is matter outside of our universe, but we cannot reach it. In fact, time, like color, is just a perception. So is the sense of sight, taste, touch, and smell. The question "Where is God" was not understood before we went so far in astronomy. There is no doubt that outside of the universe, there is a cause where universal laws of logic don't apply.


Photons could not travel "in the beginning", there was no light. The universe was condensed in an "alpha state". It composed mainly of Hydrogen, Helium and a little of Lithium. When a gas becomes too hot it ionizes and becomes opaque like today's smoke.


[Quran 41.11] Then He directed himself to the Heaven when it was SMOKE, and then said to it and to Earth: "Come willingly or by force" they said "We do come willingly"

After the big bang, the condensed matter started to expand, the universe was created in a state of timelessness.
[Quran 21.30] Do not those who disbelieve see that the heavens and the Earth were meshed together then We ripped them apart? And then We made of water everything living? Would they still not believe?

The Qur'an continues, talking about the expansion of the universe.
[Quran 51.47] And the heaven, We built it with craftsmanship and We are still expanding.

There are two opposing orders in the universe, symmetry order and grouping order. They can be seen all over in nature.
In summary (source: http://everythingforever.com)
"In summary, within the great expanse of cosmological space, extreme grouping order by nature typically produces a pronounced round object, like a single star, the most common feature of the universe, and also round like the planets, which are also general examples of grouping order.  The very definition of an object is that it is isolated and distinct from other things.  However, in the opposite direction, things can also organize into symmetries and lattice structures. In this direction the parts of an environment increasingly entangle and merge into the uniformity of space.  As all things mix into one, the form of objects is given to the larger form of the whole.  All physical properties exist at the surface of an infinitely complex underlying order of balance and wholeness, which Bohm called implicate order."

 These are described in the Qur'an:

[051:049] And of everything have we created pairs that you may reflect.

Notable examples of the two orders in the universe:


The honey bee makes honeycombs in a hexagonal shape. A hexagon is the most appropriate geometric form for the maximum use of a given area.

Examples of symmetrical orders in the universe:






Perhaps the best example of symmetry order for my fellow Muslims, is (surprise!) the Ka'aba!



Additionally, the Qur'an tells us:

"He Who created the seven heavens in layers. You will not find any discrepancy in the creation of the All-Merciful. Look again-do you see any gaps? Then look again and again. Your sight will return to you dazzled and exhausted! "(Qur'an, 67:3-4)

We see rings and layers:



Atomic structure model







As you can see every simple thing is made from a pair of these orders:




The Rosette nebula is described as such:
When the sky disintegrates, and turns rose colored like paint. [55:38]

What will be the ultimate fate of the universe?

The universe will end with the big crunch in the Qur'an.
21:104 "The Day when We will fold the heaven like the folding of a [written] sheet for the records. As We began the first creation, We will repeat [universe going back to a singularity] it. [That is] a promise binding upon Us. Indeed, We will do it."

Basically the big bang will reverse and the universe will go to a zero state (flatten out). This is based on Einstein's works on astronomy. It implies that the universe's action is going to reverse. This is the hypothesis on everythingforever.com.

The Qur'an: "Say: “Can any of your idols initiate creation, then revert it?” say “It is God who initiates the creation, and then reverts it. Then, how could you deviate?” (10:34)"



Additionally, the age of the Earth and the universe is given in relativity to each other, as Einstein's theory states that time is relative.

We see the Earth was created in two periods (youms):
Quran 41:9 "Say, "Do you indeed disbelieve in He who created the earth in two days and attribute to Him equals?..."

...and the universe in six:
Your Lord is Allah, Who created the heavens and the earth in six days and then settled Himself firmly on the Throne... (Qur'an, 7:54)

Now when we divide the age of the Earth / the age of the universe, we get
2 days / 6 days = 1/3. Let's check this with what modern science has to say. The age of the universe is 13.7 billion years old. One third of 13.7 billion = 4.5 billion years, the age of the Earth.



How do we know that it's not talking about literally 6 days? Well because, we see throughout the entire Qur'an that time is relative.

On that Day He will call you, and you will answer (His Call) with (words of) His Praise and Obedience, and you will think that you have stayed (in this world) but a little while! (Surat al-Isra, 52)

And on the Day when He shall gather them together, (it will seem to them) as if they had not tarried (on earth) longer than an hour of a day: they will recognise each other. (Surah Yunus, 45)

He will say: "What number of years did you stay on earth?" They will say: "We stayed a day or part of a day: but ask those who keep account." He will say: "You, stayed for only a little while – if you had only known!" (Surat al-Mumenoon, 112-114)

Yet they ask you to hasten on the Punishment! But Allah will not fail in His Promise. Truly, a day in the sight of your Lord is like a thousand years of your reckoning. (Surat al-Hajj, 47)

The angels and the spirit ascend to him in a day the measure of which is like fifty thousand years. (Surat al-Maarij, 4)

Then We drew (a veil) over their ears, for a number of years, in the Cave, (so that they could not hear). Then We wakened them up so that We might know which of the two parties would best calculate the time that they had tarried. (Surat al-Kahf, 11-12)

Such (being their state), we roused them (from sleep), so that they might question each other. Said one of them, "How long have you stayed (here)?" They said, "We have stayed (perhaps) a day, or part of a day." (At length) they (all) said, "Allah (alone) knows best how long you have stayed here.... (Surat al-Kahf, 19)

Or (take) the instance of one who passing by a hamlet, all in ruins and quite desolate, said: "Oh! how shall Allah (ever) bring it to life, now that it is dead?" Therefore, Allah caused him to die for a hundred years, then brought him back to life. Allah asked: "How long did you tarry (thus)?" He said: (Perhaps) a day or part of a day." He said: "No, you have tarried thus a hundred years; but look at your food and your drink; they show no signs of age; and look at your donkey: And so that We may make you a sign to the people, look further at the bones, how We bring them together and clothe them with flesh." When this was shown clearly to him, he said: "I know that Allah has power over all things." (Surat al-Baqara, 259)

In the past, Arabs used to believe that pillars kept the skies from falling. This was even mentioned in the bible. The Qur'an threw these ignorant beliefs:

--sura 50, verse 6.
"Do they not look at the sky above them, how We have built it and adorned it, and there are no rifts in it."

--sura 31, verse 10:
"(God) created the heavens without any pillars that you can see..."

--sura 13, verse 2:
"God is the One Who raised the heavens without any pillars that you can see, then He firmly established Himself on the throne and He subjected the sun and moon . . ."

The ozone layer: [021:032]  And WE have made the heaven a roof, well-protected, yet they turn away from its Signs.

The speed of light:

[Quran 32.5] (Allah) Rules the cosmic affair from the heavens to the Earth. Then this affair travels to Him a distance in one day, at a measure of one thousand years of what you count.

We know that the cosmic affair is run by the angels, who are made of light. Thousand years of "what you count" refers to the lunar calendar. Therefore, the speed of light is 12,000 lunar orbits / day.


"Consider the sky full of great constellations." (85:1)




Shape of the Earth:

The Qur'an became the first religious text of it's time to suggest a non-squared Earth

39.5. He has created the heavens and the earth with truth (meaningfully, and for definite purpose, and on solid foundations of truth). He wraps the night around the day, and He wraps the day around the night (until one covers the other completely).



It also became the first religious text to suggest that the moon was actually reflected light of the Sun.

He it is Who made the sun radiate a brilliant light and the moon reflect a lustre, and ordained for it proper stages, that you might know the count of years and the reckoning of time. Allah has not created this system but in accordance with the requirements of truth. He details the signs for a people who possess knowledge. [10:6]

 “You will see the mountains you reckoned to be solid going past like clouds – the handwork of Allah Who gives to everything its solidity. He is aware of what you do.” (27:88)

The solidity of an atom, and its electron cloud. This verse proves that even objects that look like they are rest are in fact, moving. Their electrons are moving in a cloud. Those who have taken chemistry past grade 9 should know that electrons move in clouds, and not like the motion they show in shows like Jimmy Neutron.



Continental drift:

Qur'an 79:30 "And after that He spread [stretched] the earth."

The word used for stretch here is 'dahaha', which has two meanings. It's an Arabic word that means "egg-shaped" in the context it was used. It also means to stretch out. Both meanings will be taken into consideration.



The stretching of the Earth's crust. "Continental drift is the movement of the Earth's continents relative to each other by appearing to drift across the ocean bed."
The continents of the Earth all used to be one piece known as Pangea, until they were stretched out and separated.

The word "dahaha" also means egg-shaped. We can clearly see that when an egg is hard boiled and cut in half, it models the Earth's crust, mantle and core.



The layers of the Earth's atmosphere are mentioned here:

It is He Who created everything on the earth for you and then directed His attention up to heaven and arranged it into seven regular heavens [skies]. He has knowledge of all things. (Qur'an, 2:29)

Do you not see how He created seven heavens in layers? (Qur'an, 71:15)

The Earth's atmosphere has seven layers.

1. Troposphere

2. Stratosphere

3. Mesosphere

4. Thermosphere

5. Exosphere

6. Ionosphere

7. Magnetosphere



It even includes another important fact: The Earth disgorges charges during an Earthquake.

When the earth is convulsed with its quaking and the earth then disgorges its charges and man asks, "What is wrong with it?", on that Day it will impart all its news. (Qur'an, 99:1-4)



Iron was sent down from space:

And We also sent down iron in which there lies great force and which has many uses for mankind… (Qur'an, 57:25)

There's an interesting fact about the iron verse. It is the 57th chapter, there are 114 chapters in the Qur'an. It is in the center of the Qur'an, just as iron is in the center of the Earth. Additionally, adding out the sequential values of "Hadid", the name of the chapter, yields 26, the atomic number of iron.

The numerological value of the word "hadid" حديد alone is 26. And 26 is the atomic number of iron.

ح is equal to 8.

د is equal to 4.
 
ي  is equal to 10.

د is equal to 4.

8 + 4 + 10 + 4 = 26


Clouds can bear up to 300,000 tons of water.

It is He Who sends out the winds, bringing advance news of His mercy, so that when they have lifted up the heavy clouds, We dispatch them to a dead land and send down water to it, by means of which We bring forth all kinds of fruit... (Qur'an, 7:57)

It is He Who shows you the lightning, striking fear and bringing hope; it is He Who heaps up the heavy clouds. (Qur'an, 13:12)

The water cycle is also mentioned.

It is Allah Who sends the winds which stir up clouds which He spreads about the sky however He wills. He forms them into dark clumps and you see the rain come pouring out from the middle of them. When He makes it fall on those of His servants He wills, they rejoice. (Qur'an, 30:48)




The lunar calendar

And We have decreed set phases for the moon, until it ends up looking like an old date branch. It is not for the sun to overtake the moon nor for the night to outstrip the day; each one is swimming in a sphere. (Qur'an, 36:39-40)

The date-fruit branch, when it dries up, it does resemble the English-letter S, which is what the moon's orbit looks like. This "S" orbital is seen in other places of nature as well. Date is a desert fruit.  The fruit and its branches are known to store water for survival. The moon is also very dry. This is a good analogy.







Only two should be enough... for now.

The date-fruit branch, when it starts growing up, it looks like an arch (crescent), and then as it ages, it starts curving from the bottom making it resemble the English-letter S as shown. The crescent marks the end of the lunar calendar.

The comparison to date trees was made purely because the book was sent to Arabs who would understand.

 

Orbits of other planets in the universe are in Qur'an 51:7

"By heaven furnished with paths;"


 

This could also be a reference to string theory, as it is talking about "pathways".

Space travel to the moon:

 

And [I swear by] the moon when it is full, you will mount up stage by stage! What is the matter with them, that they have no faith? (Qur'an, 84:18-20)

 

Neil Armstrong: "I am impressed that how remarkably some of the ancient writings seem to correspond to modern and recent Astronomy. There may well have to be something beyond what we understand as ordinary human experience to account for the writings that we have seen."

 

The function of mountains:

Quran 21: 31 - "We placed firmly embedded mountains on the earth, so it would not move under them… "

Quran 31: 10 - "He created the heavens without any pillars that ye can see; He set on the earth mountains standing firm, lest it should shake with you"

Qur'an 78:6-7 - "Have We not made the earth as a bed and the mountains its pegs?"

Mountains are responsible for preventing shocks on the Earth.

"Scientists have now come to realize that mountains are not just surface elevations or protrusions, however, but that they extend 10-15 times their height into the ground, and these extensions are called mountain roots. With these properties, mountains play a similar role to a nail or a stake hammered into the ground. For instance, a peak such as Mount Everest, which rises almost 9 km above the Earth's surface, has a root that extends downward for more than 125 km."

(http://www.wamy.co.uk/announcements3.html)

Qur'an 79: 30 - "And the mountains He set firmly [rooted]"

Mountains prevent the shocks that could severely shake the Earth and make the planet unlivable.

Mountains have roots deep under the surface of the ground. (Earth, Press and Siever, p. 413)

The separation of the seas

"He has let loose the two seas, converging together,with a barrier between them they do not break through"

(55: 19-20)

The difference in densities of the seas creates surface tension which prevents the seas from mingling together, as if there was a thin wall between them (Richard A. Davis, Principles of Oceanography, Addison-Wesley Publishing Company, Don Mills, Ontario, pp. 92-93)

Quasars

Allah is the light of the heavens and the Earth. The metaphor of His light is that of a niche in which is a lamp, the lamp inside a glass, the glass like a brilliant star, lit from a blessed tree, an olive, neither of the east nor of the west, its oil all but giving off light even if no fire touches it. Light upon light. Allah guides to His light whoever He wills and Allah makes metaphors for mankind and Allah has knowledge of all things. (24:35)

Quasars are star like, dense, bodies that emit light. They are the brightest bodies in the universe, about 2 trillion times brighter than the Sun and 100 times brighter than the milky way. The part about "giving off heat even if no fire touches it" is a reference to nuclear fusion, as Quasars burn without fire. Hydrogen atoms compress and release helium. This illuminates space. "A niche in a lamp" is a reference to the gravitational lens effect of the black hole.

"The gravitational effect of the galaxy on the distant quasar was similar to the lens effect of a drinking glass on a distant street light – it created multiple images lenses here too." (http://antwrp.gsfc.nasa.gov/apod/ap950711.html)

This could also be a reference to the Sun. As a hadith by Hadrat Ali (RA) says "Have you fully realized what Islam is? ...It is indeed a candle, through which several candles will be lighted".

To end the article, I would like to mention warnings of global warming, the need for water, conservation of resources, and how water will eventually run out.

 

Chapter 7, verse 32 “O children of Adam!...eat and drink but exceed not the bounds; surely He does not love those who exceed the bounds”

Chapter 25, verse 68 “those who, when they spend are neither extravagant nor niggardly but moderate between the two.


 

[018:008]  And We are definitely going to convert the earth into a bone-dry barren plateau.

 

Appreciate what you have and save it!

And we send down water from the sky (rain) in (due) measure,
and We gave it lodging in the earth, and verily, We are able to take it away.
 (Surah al-Mu’minun 23:18)

 

Water is important!

And We have made from water every living thing. (Surah al-Anbiya 21:30)

"It is He Who sends down water from the sky; and with it We produce vegetation of all kinds… " (Qur'an, 6:99).

Can be used to revive a dead land by letting the crops grow! "And Allah sends down water from the skies, and gives therewith life to the earth after its death…" (Qur'an, 16:65)

 "See you the water which you drink? Do you bring it down (in rain) from the cloud or do We? Were it Our Will, We could make it saltish. Then why do you not give thanks?" (Qur'an, 56:68,69,70).

And it is He Who sends the winds as heralds of glad tidings,
Going before His Mercy (rain);
And We send down pure water from the sky.
(Surah al-Furqaan 25: 48)

Corruption doth appear on land and sea because of (the evil) which men’s hands have done, that He may make them taste a part of that which they have done, in order that they may return. (Quran 30:41)

 

SAVE A DROP OF WATER, SAVE THE WORLD!

 

Bannedforyoursins Bannedforyoursins 70+, M 14 Responses Dec 27, 2012

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very interesting - however the balance of evidence so far is for a constantly expanding universe, not one where gravity causes a cosmic collapse again. I find that unintuitive, but we that's what the evidence suggests - so far

pdqsailor1 chickened out. My response to him: Ask the starving children in Africa why they don't have any nobel prizes

Yes starving children in Africa - how about we ask the well fed children in the Madrassa why they only learn from one book instead of all the others that have been written. Why do we not ask them if they will be scientists, astronomers, economists, Doctors, researchers, engineers, physicists - what will they do to better their lot and that of mankind?

Oh and stop making excuses - learn something, do any thing - productive.

Please dude, you're insulting yourself. Had it not been for Islam you would be believing the Earth is flat. We helped you survive the dark ages.

that is absolutly correct - science flourished in the isamic world when it was all but dead in th west. But for many centueies now the centres of progress have been US, England and Western Europe

And what has Islam done for the world since the writing of the Quran? NOTHING. Churchill was correct - he is still totally correct.

Lol. you're quoting ignorant Western POLITICAL LEADERS. I quoted Nobel Prize winners and famous historians and authors.

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Wow! What an inspiring post. I like the props you used. Very practical,enlightening.

thanks :)

All VERY VERY true - yes very well done and quite enlightening and very impressive and admirable. Yes the Quran was a miracle.....But how about we take a peak at what the contribution has been in the last oh say 100 years? Lets use a fair measurement of the betterment of mankind - the Nobel Prize to examine modern contributions ot mankind.

Muslims have been awarded 10 Nobel prizes out of 850 awarded for various contributions to the betterment of mankind 10 / 850 or 1.2% - yet they are 20% of the worlds population. Hmmmmm not so good. But for a point of comparison lets look just a bit deeper......

Jews number but 0.2% of the world population - there are only 14 million Jews total in the world - a tiny minority and they have been awarded - get this 180 Nobel prizes. That means that current contributions per capita of Jews are 18,000 times greater..... What - someone please chack the math....... Seems to me that in the Quran Jews are derided as being from Monkeys and Pigs. That is not very nice..... After all Jews count Abraham as their forefather too.

Ladies and gentlemen it may be time to crack open a few more books than just the Quran as a means of enlightenment - the "People of THE book" are apparently people of a great many books - and they apparently read them too and apprarently they write them as well, and teach and write scientific papers and discover and create and better the lot of all mankind - way way above their numbers. Education and creativity and ingenuity are all valuable to the betterment of mankind.

Sorry I truly hope no one is offended. I just wanted to inspire people towards the value of education and achievement.

that same old nobel prize argument... Back when the Muslims were advanced there was no such thing as a nobel prize, btw, most nobel prizes are biased towards Muslims and not only that, the Jews are usually richer, so instead of comparing through religion, compare using race

Old argument? Really - says who? it is an entirely valid argument. Please point to achievments say from tthe industrial age to today and demonstrate some tangible contribution to the betterment of mankind. No I don't think there is any case for ahievment. Wealth? Really? What even if this false accusation had any merit does wealth have to do with acheivement accross the areas of contribution? Wealth is a means of keeping score for economic performance - say Warren Buffet or Bill Gates or to get to your particular point Larry Ellison - all of whom changed the world and built their wealth from nothing. Race? No I don't think so religion is a valid argument - even Jews at a totlal of only 14 milion combined compared to oh I don't know - EVERYONE else at 180/850.... but in particular th emodern contributions of Muslims.

I am not being negative - I sm suggesting it is appropriate to study one book at the expense of all others. It is time to pull at least a commesurat amount of weight with respect to contributions to the balance of mankind.

I meant don't compare using race or religion, you have to look at wealth, and in countries where America didn't invade for oil

Yawn - beyond lame and totally boring, not interested so our conversation is over

Of course wealth matters. It gets you an education. Which is a real good start when it comes to achievements. Wealth gets you those books to crack open which have been suggested

BS - attitude - excuses and worse blaming others for your ineptitudes- the hunger to learn gets you an education. Reserch Bernard Smith

Self taught - the son of a black smith. No money to finish high school - he had to work - educated himself in public libraries. He attended in the 1930's meetings of rocket scientists - the foremost minds of the day. He was accepted at a university based upon his self studies and interests - became a physicist - and a legitimate rocket scientist - he invented the Sidewinder missile. He had a love of sailing and penned a book called the 40 knot sailboat in 1963 - that design just set the world record for sailing speed over both 500 meters and the mile a few years after his death at age 99.

Oh and he was a Jew.

What a crock of crap - show me results and inovation and creativity and bettering the lot of mankind - show me results.

My Father told me that creativity - inteligence you can not buy in a butcher shop.

What if you live in a place where you're not allowed to go to the local school, nor are you allowed to go to the library?

Will your attitude pull you thru?

Or what about if there just isn't a library? Should one build one?

The greatest library the world has ever known is at your fingertips - right now. Use it with productivity to better your life and those of others.

At my fingertips yes, how many don't have it at their fingertips? What do they do? I'm not talking about me, I'm talikng about the link between wealth, achievement and education. There are people that will never be educated or achieve anything because of lack of money, it's got zilch to do with their attitude. Tell them to pull their finger out their ***, not me.

There are people who have had less than dirt who have gone from the dung hill to sit with Princes. Like cream that rises to the top there is no way to let circumstances retard progress and invoation. Einstien was but an impoversed patent clerk - one of the greatest minds the world has ever seen. Larry Elison was an orphan - he built himself up from NOTHING to be one of the ten wealthiest men in the world. Stop making excuses- the internet and computers are all over the world of Islam, China, India, Africa - show me results. The playing field of knowledge has never been so level in the hstory of mankind.

Yeah right

so the Africans starving should have Nobel prizes? Nice Jewish logic

At least there is logic - look get back to the matter at hand. Precisely what contributions to the betterment of mankind do 1.4 BILLION islamists provide to the world?

I am borred with your ego, your inflated self image and your total absence of substance ,performance or achievement. I have said what I came here to say - don't be so proud - you do not have anything to be so proud of and you have contributed NOTHING to the betterment of mankind - now back into your cave.

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excellent post! Thank you.

This was a great story. The Quran is truly a miracle, and i'm so proud to be Muslim. Thank you for this story.
Do you know how to read the Quran in arabic, or do you only read translations?

I read a set of verses in Arabic, then I read various interpretations of the same verse from different scholars in English. This way I can figure out the double meanings of things.

Good idea. We have a religion class in my school so we mainly learn the Quran in arabic. I prefer learning it in arabic because the translations don't really give the full meaning, but it's good that you read both.

Yes, in fact, Maurice Bacaille who converted to Islam, actually learned Arabic so he could read the Qur'an himself and confirm the meaning. He was the one who did the research on Firaun's body

Wow thanx for sharing!

I'll second that Galacteal ...WOW!

PervertedPope, Thank you for an interesting read!... interesting username to boot too.lol.. wow on that also! *smile*

Thanks guys :)

Taken from my article earlier this year

As an Atheist and Socialist who originates from an Orthodox Jewish background, I retain several troubling questions concerning the validity of Islam. As a former Jew - and to further compound my sin - an atheist (Zanadiqa) - I am by Islamic definition an apostate, and in line with Sharia Law, I should be hanged, or otherwise dispatched - quickly and without debate, and with no possible recourse to argument.

Debate within Islam is proscribed, you either accept that the Qur'an is the literal, unimpeachable, immutable word of God as recited to Mohamed by the Angel Jabril (Gabriel) or suffer the consequences of misogynistic, malicious, bigoted (male) Islamic 'Scholars'. To suggest that Mohamed was a liar or at best an unpleasant fantasist lays me open to a predictable, vicious Islamic fatwa.

The dilemma(s) encountered within Islam is that unlike Christianity (or Zionism) the ideology has not undergone or been examined in a period of Reason and Enlightenment, nor has the dogma experienced a Renaissance. To return to my second paragraph; I cannot even imply that the Qur'an is not the word of God, I either accept the initiative without discrimination or once again I suffer Islam’s bellicose consequences. Further, I am informed, Arabic, the language of the Qur'an, is the only world language that cannot be translated into English…

In Islam there appears to be a tacit acceptance that every consequence is the will of Allah, inshallah; so do not even question the validity of Islamic ideology, because simply and crucially, dissent within Islam is unconditionally disallowed.

The marriage of Mohamed (54) to Aisha (6) is problematic, yes, child brides were allowed, even encouraged in pre medieval and post medieval Christian society, however eventually the light shone incandescent and we discontinued this merciless, anachronistic practice. Similarly with slavery, we realised and acknowledged that slavery was fundamentally immoral, consequently we abolished this unjust, inhuman practice. However, we note Islam has yet to proscribe slavery. Indeed slavery still is practiced within contemporary Islam. It is promulgated within the Qur'an, therefore we cannot, must not dispute Allah's immutable word… And if slavery was encouraged by Mohamed, that most perfect of men, that paragon of virtue, (his words, not mine) then we must allow it.

Mohamed was a slave trader, and remained a slave trader until his death, he even personally sexually abused and encouraged his followers to abuse their female slaves. Is this behaviour acceptable for the enlightened, 'perfect' man?

The West has apologized for its involvement in the slave trade, however we have to ask from whom did the slave traders purchase their merciless merchandise? Sorry, but the answer to this question is Muslim slave dealers.

We discourage dissembling, but Islam signally encourages the lie. Taqiyya (and Kitman) is a fundamental tenet of Islam, and Islamic protection money, Jizya is crucial to maintaining Islamic economic and spiritual supremacy. I am informed that my worth is less than a Muslim, yet even Christians and Jews embrace equality. How can I ever believe a word you utter when it could be a religiously sanctioned lie?

Equality, is an unaccepted concept in Islam, a woman is deemed to be worth less than a man, the only argument seems to be the aggregate, is it by half or by the quarter? And the brutal practice of wife beating, is again Islamically condoned, and encouraged by scripture. Please, I am aware that the practice is promulgated in the Bible and Torah, but we have finally realised that violence against women (or for that matter, men) is wrong, wrong, wrong.

Taken from my article earlier this year

As an Atheist and Socialist who originates from an Orthodox Jewish background, I retain several troubling questions concerning the validity of Islam. As a former Jew - and to further compound my sin - an atheist (Zanadiqa) - I am by Islamic definition an apostate, and in line with Sharia Law, I should be hanged, or otherwise dispatched - quickly and without debate, and with no possible recourse to argument.

FALSE. "Let there be no compulsion in religion" Qur'an 2:256. I challenge you to find a verse in the Qur'an which orders death to apostates. Not the hadith about rebelling, as hadith is not taken into account for Shar'iah law. In fact, Islam is the ONLY ABRAHAMIC RELIGION to not have a death penalty for apostasy in its holy book.

Debate within Islam is proscribed, you either accept that the Qur'an is the literal, unimpeachable, immutable word of God as recited to Mohamed by the Angel Jabril (Gabriel) or suffer the consequences of misogynistic, malicious, bigoted (male) Islamic 'Scholars'. To suggest that Mohamed was a liar or at best an unpleasant fantasist lays me open to a predictable, vicious Islamic fatwa.

Invite people to Islam with beautiful preaching, wisdom and argue in ways that are best and friendliest. Qur'an 16:125

The dilemma(s) encountered within Islam is that unlike Christianity (or Zionism) the ideology has not undergone or been examined in a period of Reason and Enlightenment, nor has the dogma experienced a Renaissance. To return to my second paragraph; I cannot even imply that the Qur'an is not the word of God, I either accept the initiative without discrimination or once again I suffer Islam’s bellicose consequences. Further, I am informed, Arabic, the language of the Qur'an, is the only world language that cannot be translated into English…

The reason you cannot translate the Qur'an is because some words, like Dahaha, are lost to translation. Dahaha literally means an ostrich egg, but could also mean to stretch out. The Earth's crust was stretched, and the Earth is egg-shaped. Both properties are defined in one sentence that way.

In Islam there appears to be a tacit acceptance that every consequence is the will of Allah, inshallah; so do not even question the validity of Islamic ideology, because simply and crucially, dissent within Islam is unconditionally disallowed.

Think of life like a video tape, we are in it right now, and God has watched the entire tape from start to finish. You might want to look up Einstein's theory of relativity on Harun Yahya for more detail on this.

The marriage of Mohamed (54) to Aisha (6) is problematic, yes, child brides were allowed, even encouraged in pre medieval and post medieval Christian society, however eventually the light shone incandescent and we discontinued this merciless, anachronistic practice. Similarly with slavery, we realised and acknowledged that slavery was fundamentally immoral, consequently we abolished this unjust, inhuman practice. However, we note Islam has yet to proscribe slavery. Indeed slavery still is practiced within contemporary Islam. It is promulgated within the Qur'an, therefore we cannot, must not dispute Allah's immutable word… And if slavery was encouraged by Mohamed, that most perfect of men, that paragon of virtue, (his words, not mine) then we must allow it.

FALSE. Slaves were encouraged to be freed in the Qur'an. One notable example is Qur'an 90:11-17.

Mohamed was a slave trader, and remained a slave trader until his death, he even personally sexually abused and encouraged his followers to abuse their female slaves. Is this behaviour acceptable for the enlightened, 'perfect' man?

False again. You should find a reliable citation for this. Muhammad (pbuh) encouraged the buying of slaves for freeing them. He and his companions freed 40,000 slaves. Nadvi (2000), pg. 453

The West has apologized for its involvement in the slave trade, however we have to ask from whom did the slave traders purchase their merciless merchandise? Sorry, but the answer to this question is Muslim slave dealers.

The West MUST apologize. No other civilization treated slaves like animals. Did the Muslims ever have human zoos? "A slave is not greater than the master" (From the NIV Bible, Matthew 10:24)

We discourage dissembling, but Islam signally encourages the lie. Taqiyya (and Kitman) is a fundamental tenet of Islam, and Islamic protection money, Jizya is crucial to maintaining Islamic economic and spiritual supremacy. I am informed that my worth is less than a Muslim, yet even Christians and Jews embrace equality. How can I ever believe a word you utter when it could be a religiously sanctioned lie?

FALSE! What an absurd joke! Christianity and Judaism NOWHERE match Islam in human equality! bring me one Bible verse that orders its followers to free slaves UNCONDITIONALLY! I'll give you several in ISLAM: 90:11-17, 2:177.

Equality, is an unaccepted concept in Islam, a woman is deemed to be worth less than a man, the only argument seems to be the aggregate, is it by half or by the quarter? And the brutal practice of wife beating, is again Islamically condoned, and encouraged by scripture. Please, I am aware that the practice is promulgated in the Bible and Torah, but we have finally realised that violence against women (or for that matter, men) is wrong, wrong, wrong.

FALSE. The bible says: "The birth of a daughter is a loss" (Ecclesiasticus 22:3).

The QURAN:

"...I will not suffer the work of any worker from among you to be lost whether male or female, the one of you being from the other." Surah Al-Imran:195

"O you who believe, it is not lawful for you to take women as heritage against their will. Nor should you straiten them…." Surah Al-Nisa:19

“…the world lies at the feet of mothers.” Prophet Muhammad(saas)

“O’ ye men. Fear Allah and treat your women with kindness.” Prophet Muhammad(saas)

"…marry such women as seem good to you, two, or three, or four; but if you fear that you will not do justice, then marry only one…" Surah Al-Nisa:3

"And for the divorced women, provision must be made in kindness. This is incumbent on those who have regard for duty." Surah Al-Baqarah: 241

WOMEN RIGHTS ARE A JOKE IN THE BIBLE! I'll give you only a few examples, they should be enough to make you figure!

The Greek philosopher Aristotle, whose influence on western culture is still adhered to up to the present day, once stated;

“Women are not to be considered full humans”.

This opinion of women, as stated by Aristotle, is also the opinion of Christianity and the western mentality. Up until the 1800’s, in the Christian church, women were considered to be without souls and had no rights of inheritance. They were given no respect as is proven in 1 Corinthians 14:34-35 of the New Testament of the Bible;

“….for it is a shame for women to speak in church…”

In the Qur'an, both Adam and Eve were responsible for the sin. In the bible, childbirth is a punishment and Eve was responsible for the "sin"

hristianity blames women for the so-called “Fall of Man”, for the so-called “Original Sin”. Christianity believes that it is the woman’s fault as to why she gives birth in great pain. This has been the teaching of the Christian Church, regardless of denomination, for over 2000 years and many fundamentalist Christians still adhere to this belief to this very day. This is not the teaching or belief of Islam.e.

There is an Orthodox Jewish Prayer which every Jewish male recites that goes as such;


“Blessed be God, King of the Universe that Thou has not made me a woman.”

THERE ARE DOZENS, MILLIONS, of examples. You are lucky I'm giving you a free pass to take your words back.

Oh and I forgot the main thing

Believers do not mix their oaths with falsehood. 6:82
Provide proof and Truth to what you claim. Produce your proof if you are Truthful. 2:111, 21:24, 27:64, 28:75
Be an honest (truthful) witness in everything you do and see, and be True to Allah Almighty 5:8, 9:119

Taqiyya and Kitman are solely for protecting one' self from loss of life or property. The west's apology is useless. It still uses sweatshops for its clothes and other products. Like pervertedpope said. Islam encouraged buying of slaves so that you could release them. Slaves are only to be taken from POW. If the slave asked to be paid so that he could buy his own freedom. When a slave's master dies the slave automatically becomes free. Tell me. Did the great West ever have an empire which was built by people who were slaves or have high ranking people in their governments? No. The muslims did. It was called the Mameluke empire. Dont believe what Robert Spencer, Pamella Geller and other 'scholars' on islam say. You will only land yourself knee deep in *koff koff*

Oh yeah, Dunno if PP addressed this but apostates are to be killed only if they also commit treason or leave the community. Thats why the Prophet PBUH killed some apostates and didnt kill others.

Actually, we CAN believe what scholars and cool people say about Islam. Here are a few notable examples:

"If a man like Muhammed were to assume the dictatorship of the modern world, he would succeed in solving its problems that would bring it the much needed peace and happiness." George Bernard Shaw

"My choice of Muhammad to lead the list of the world's most influential persons may surprise some readers and may be questioned by others, but he was the only man in history who was supremely successful on both the religious and secular level." --Michael H. Hart, THE 100: A RANKING OF THE MOST INFLUENTIAL PERSONS IN HISTORY, New York: Hart Publishing Company, Inc., 1978, p. 33.

"I hope the time is not far off when I shall be able to unite all the wise and educated men of all the countries and establish a uniform regime based on the principles of Quran which alone are true and which alone can lead men to happiness." [Napoleon Bonaparte as Quoted in Christian Cherfils, 'Bonaparte et Islam,' Pedone Ed., Paris, France, 1914, pp. 105, 125]

"How, for instance, can any other appeal stand against that of the Moslem who, in approaching the pagan, says to him, however obscure or degraded he may be 'Embrace the faith, and you are at once equal and a brother.' Islam knows no color line." (S. S. Leeder, VEILED MYSTERIES OF EGYPT)


"It (Islam) replaced monkishness by manliness. It gives hope to the slave, brotherhood to mankind, and recognition of the fundamental facts of human nature." --Canon Taylor, Paper read before the Church Congress at Walverhamton, Oct. 7, 1887; Quoted by Arnoud in THE PREACHING OF ISLAM, pp. 71-72.

"No other society has such a record of success in uniting in an equality of status, of opportunity and endeavour so many and so varied races of mankind. The great Muslim communities of Africa, India and Indonesia, perhaps also the small community in Japan, show that Islam has still the ower to reconcile apparently irreconcilable elements of race and tradition. If ever the opposition of the great societies of the East and west is to be replaced by cooperation, the mediation of Islam is an indispensable condition." (H.A.R. Gibb, WHITHER ISLAM, p. 379)

"I have studied him - the wonderful man - and in my opinion far from being an anti-Christ he must be called the saviour of humanity. " George Bernard Shaw in "The Genuine Islam"

"Four years after the death of Justinian, A.D. 569, was born at Mecca, in Arabia the man who, of all men exercised the greatest influence upon the human race . . . Mohammed . . . " John William Draper, M.D., L.L.D., A History of the Intellectual Development of Europe, London 1875, Vol.1, pp.329-330

"People like Pasteur and Salk are leaders in the first sense. People like Gandhi and Confucius, on one hand, and Alexander, Caesar and Hitler on the other, are leaders in the second and perhaps the third sense. Jesus and Buddha belong in the third category alone. Perhaps the greatest leader of all times was Mohammed, who combined all three functions. To a lesser degree, Moses did the same." Professor Jules Masserman

"The extinction of race consciousness as between Muslims is one of the outstanding achievements of Islam, and in the contemporary world there is, as it happens, a crying need for the propagation of this Islamic virtue." --A.J. Toynbee, CIVILIZATION ON TRIAL, New York, 1948, p. 205.

"The closer we examine this development the more extraordinary does it appear. The other great religions won their way slowly, by painful struggle and finally triumphed with the aid of powerful monarchs converted to the new faith. Christianity had its Constantine, Buddhism its Asoka, and Zoroastrianism its Cyrus, each lending to his chosen cult the mighty force of secular authority. Not so Islam. Arising in a desert land sparsely inhabited by a nomad race previously undistinguished in human annals, Islam sallied forth on its great adventure with the slenderest human backing and against the heaviest material odds. Yet Islam triumphed with seemingly miraculous ease, and a couple of generations saw the Fiery Crescent borne victorious from the Pyrenees to the Himalayas and from the desert of Central Asia to the deserts of Central Africa." --A.M.L. Stoddard, quoted in ISLAM - THE RELIGION OF ALL PROPHETS, Begum Bawani Waqf, Karachi, Pakistan, p. 56.

"The doctrine of brotherhood of Islam extends to all human beings, no matter what color, race or creed. Islam is the only religion which has been able to realize this doctrine in practice. Muslims wherever on the world they are will recognize each other as brothers." Mr. R. L. Mellema, Holland, Anthropologist, Writer and Scholar.

...and many more omitted for simplicity

Continue to listen to your Voices... They may one day tell you how to fly an aeroplane into a building, honour killings, suicide bombers, murdering homosexuals... I could go on, but I have a life to live

Ad Hominem is a logical fallacy. When one resorts to logical fallacies, it just means the other party has won.

Oh btw, since your Jewish, I take it that your father sliced the sh!t out of your foreskin as the 10,000 foreskins that the King commanded wanted you to?

Nice one, lol!

1SA 18:27 I demand 200 foreskins to make a sweater

Thats right dumb moron. Scuttle away. I bet your mummy's so proud. I mean 'Continue to listen to your Voices... They may one day tell you how to fly an aeroplane into a building, honour killings, suicide bombers, murdering homosexuals... I could go on, but I have a life to live'...seriously? That is the lamest comeback i have ever read in my life.

allesandro is clearly not intelligent enough to argue using facts so he's using his childish insults. how sad. how very, very sad.

Indeed. A standard last resort.

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my dear i created a group the name is "why Islam is a good religion?"i wanna make a request to you,kindly read the story "why pork is forbidden in Islam?".

regards

Nadeem

Sure thing :)

good, i am a muslim so whatever Quran says i believe and i keep reciting it as well.

Yes well the Qur'an has quite a lot to say in just one verse so as you read make sure you get a Qur'an that has a side-by-side English interpretation so you can thoroughly think through each verse. This really helps you find the stuff in it.

i do the same read Arabic and then translation.

Don't be silly. It's not that he universe will one day expand so much that it will collapse into a black hole. It's that one day the initial energy of the big bang will be depleted, and gravity will suck us back into where we came out of. Over...and over

Yes it will be too weak to support the gravity, thus forming a black hole.

All the matter will begin to fall back towards a centre point, untill the mass becomes so extremely compressed that another big bang happens, and then it all starts agian. See you in a few billion years right here on EP mate

nice one i really appreciate it.

Thanks, how did you find it?

BEST. POST. ON. EP.

thanks :)

no, really, I love how in-depth it is :D

Did you read all of it? So fast O.o

shaddap, M, how dare you question my ability to read XD

Shh, don't you know, if you mention "M", then the illuminati can read my mind, lest I use the tinfoil hat!

jkjk

no offense :P

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Who is the "We" that it keeps referring to? I thought that it was supposed to be only Allah.

Good question. It is a severe blasphemy to refer to Allah as "he" or "she"

Although in Christianity God is referred to as 'he'

So he's referred to as a plural? Why not call him "it?" And why is it considered blasphemous to say "he?"

Because God has no gender. He's not a bearded man like Christians portray him.

Sorry, I didn't mean to insult your God, btw. I just noticed I said "he." I dunno if that's as bad coming from an unbeliever, but I didn't mean to offend, or anything.

Lol I'm not offended, it's ok. But see, if God was a "he", that would mean he's from the Earth. Allah is like a deistic God, only that he sends prophets and holy books.

I think that's cool. I believe in male and female Gods, so that isn't really a problem for me, lol! A lot of people (besides Christians, of course,) have their God either genderless, or have a female aspect to him. (Like the Jews.)

The thing is, Allah is not a deity you can portray. He's the supreme order of the universe. He has no partners or sons (including Jesus).

Lol! Makes sense, from a monotheistic point of view. That's something that I never got with Christianity. He created all of existence itself, reality, and everything, and yet he's a "he?" Does he have a ****, and balls? Did he screw Mary while in ghost form? Or did he just teleport his "godly man-juice" into her? It's just full of holes, lol!

Jesus and Adam were created in the same way according to the Qur'an.
Jesus wasn't crucified.
Jesus didn't die for our sins, humans are accountable for only their own sins, and no one is born a sinner. In fact, it's the opposite. We're masum (never committed a sin) until we grow up and stuff.

That makes sense. The Christians believe that kids are innocent, but they also believe everyone is born a sinner, so yet another conflict, in their belief system, lol!

Kids are so innocent, even the perverted pope acknowledges ;)

because it's translated from arabic and in arabic (you can speak with we instead if I in case of greatness ) , so god speaks about him self but he used we for greatness ,also in the old time kings used to say we

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