Post

They Took My Body From Me And Used It And Other Truths





I was in Europe. It was 1999. I was in a garden in a hotel. I was reading a book. French Literary Fascism. I was drinking kir royale. I had two. The second one didn't taste right. I didn't finish it. Then I became sort of sickish or weakish or something, and all I could think about was getting to my bed and not making a fool of myself in public view. I prayed: "Let me get to my room, please let me get to my room." I had ordered dinner from room service and the waiter, who had also made the drinks, had said: "It will be my great pleasure to serve you your dinner tonight." I conked out.

Then a boy was in the room with dinner. He had served me the second drink. I tried to get up and I fell against the far wall because I couldn't stand. I signed the cheque, but could barely balance myself. I fell back on to the bed. I didn't lock the door. I came to four or five hours later. I didn't know where I was. The curtains hadn't been drawn. Now it was dark; before it had been light, long before dusk.

I had internal pain. I hurt deep inside my vagina. I said to myself. "Well, it's cancer, and there's nothing you can do about it now so worry about it when you get home." I went to the toilet and found blood on my right hand, fresh, bright red, not menstrual blood, not clotted blood. I'm past bleeding. I tried to find the source of the blood. My hand got covered in it again. I found huge, deep gashes on my right leg from the middle of the back of the leg to the middle of the front. I couldn't stop the bleeding of the gashes so I tried to keep them clean.

A few hours later, I took a shower. I had a big, strange bruise on my left breast, next to the aureole, not a regular bruise, huge, black and blue with solid white skin in the centre, as if someone had sucked it up and chewed it. I didn't feel good the next day or the day after. I thought I had been drugged and raped, but I felt confused. I couldn't stand the thought of making a wrong allegation. I thought that the bartender had done it, because he had made the drinks and he was on the room-service phone and he had flirted grandly with me, though I had not reciprocated. I thought that maybe the boy, who had brought me the second drink, was supposed to report that I had passed out. I thought the bartender had raped me. I didn't know if the boy had been there or not, but I thought yes.

I couldn't remember, but I thought they had pulled me down toward the bottom of the bed so that my vagina was near the bed's edge and my legs were easy to manipulate. I thought that the deep, bleeding scratches, right leg, and the big bruise, left breast, were the span of a man on top of me. I had been wearing sweatpants that just fell right down. I had been wearing an undershirt. Usually I covered myself, but I had felt too sick to manage it before the boy came in with the dinner. Besides, I don't know how he got inside since the door was dead-bolted. He appeared suddenly, already in.

In my own life, I don't have intercourse. That is my choice. I got an internal infection in the aftermath. How? It was horrible not knowing. I had literally no memory of what the man and the boy had done. It's like being operated on. You don't feel anything until you feel the pain that comes with a return to consciousness. I speculated that my body must have been relaxed, no muscles straining, no physical resistance or even tension. This repelled me.

The hours were gone, missing. My mind went over and over that day and night for weeks and weeks turning into months and months. I couldn't find the missing hours because they weren't there, in my brain. That is why drugs such as Rohypnol and gamma hydroxybutyric acid (GHB) are called amnesiac drugs. (Since I could taste something in my drink, it was probably GHB, called on the street Grievous Bodily Harm.)

I lost all hope. I couldn't defend myself. I had been helpless. I had decided long ago that no one would ever rape me again; he or they or I would die. But this rape was necrophiliac: they wanted to **** a dead woman. Why? I was scared. I thought that being forced and being conscious was better, because then you knew; even if no one ever believed you, you knew. Most rape experts agree: how can you face what you can't remember? I tried to hammer through the amnesia, but nothing broke. I was so hurt.

A few days later, on a Sunday, at the suggestion of my mate, John, at home in Brooklyn, I placed a call to my New York feminist gynaecologist of more than a decade. I said that I thought I had been drugged and raped. She said that a gynaecological exam wouldn't prove anything one way or the other and that the call from me convinced her that she should have an unlisted phone number. I thanked her (I'm a girl) and collapsed in tears. On the plane trip home, I huddled and shook. I felt overwhelming grief as if I had died. I also felt grief for this sick world.

I started hating every day. I hated seeing the sun rise. I couldn't put one foot in front of the other and I wanted to put a butcher's knife into my heart behind my ribs. I was very lonely. I was consumed by grief and sorrow until I was lucky enough to become numb. I thought I could resist by not dying, but that might be too hard and maybe I was too old and too tired and couldn't do it any more. My body was a curse and had betrayed me. I couldn't figure out why they would want to do this and why they would want to do it to me.

I couldn't be consoled. I couldn't talk to anyone. How could I say the words to the people I loved, most of whom work precisely to stop violence against women: this is what he, someone or they, did to me. Yeah, I know I represent something to you, but really I'm a piece of crap because I just got raped. No, no, you're not a piece of crap when you get raped, but I am. John looked for any other explanation than rape. He abandoned me emotionally. Now a year has passed and sometimes he's with me in his heart and sometimes not.

I don't know why the world didn't stop right then, when the creatures drugged and raped me. I don't know how the earth can still turn. I don't believe that it should be possible. I don't. I think everyone should have stopped everything because I was 52 and this happened to me. I think every person should have been in mourning. I think no one should work or spend money or love anyone ever again. I ask: "Why me?" I say: "It can't have happened to me." I say: "My bad pheromones or karma brought the rapist pigs to me." I blame me no matter what it takes. I go down the checklist: no short skirt; it was daylight; I didn't drink a lot even though it was alcohol and I rarely drink, but so what? It could have been Wild Turkey or coffee. I didn't drink with a man, I sat alone and read a book, I didn't go somewhere I shouldn't have been, wherever that might be when you are 52, I didn't flirt, I didn't want it to happen. I wasn't hungry for a good, hard **** that would leave me pummelled with pain inside.

And after: I don't want it to have happened. I can't remember it. They took my body from me and used it. They were inside me. I felt for stickiness. There was none. I prayed that meant they had used condoms. (I'm waiting for the outcome of a second round of HIV and other STD testing. Immediately after a drug-rape, as I didn't know then, there are about 24 hours in which to get a urine sample and 48 to 72 hours to get a blood test.)

And then there is that I know too much. Forgive me for saying this, but it makes everything harder. I know a lot about rape. I study it. I read about it. I think about it. I listen to rape victims. I engage with prosecutors and lawyers and legislators. I write about it. I was raped before this. I remember being raped. I say that we're fighting back. I give speeches and say that women and girls are being raped and we need to do this and this and this. I know hundreds if not thousands of raped women.

But this is new. Rape with amnesiac drugs is new. It's so easy. In most studies on rape and ***********, about 30% of men say they would rape if they could get away with it. They can. This is foolproof rape. The gang that couldn't shoot straight can do this kind of rape. You can do this hundreds of times with virtually no chance of getting caught, let alone having anyone be able to make a legal case in any court of law. And smart women with attitudes like myself can't stop these pieces of dog excrement through militance or violence or persuasion or just being reasonably polite.

See, if there were feminist vigilantes, I couldn't even ask a favour. I can't put the bartender in the hotel room with me. I know it was he and his little accomplice, but how do I know? The circumstantial evidence that leads to the conclusion that the rape happened does not identify the rapist(s). One point for prosecutors: this is poisoning as well as rape; always bring both charges.

As for me: about 10 days after I came home, my 84-year-old father broke his knee. He was never out of a hospital or nursing or convalescent home again until he died on December 4 1999. A few days before Christmas, I was hospitalised for bronchitis, pneumonia, cellulitis (an infection of the soft tissues in the legs - lethal if not treated with antibiotics) and blood clots. I had been wandering in delirium from a high fever on New York City streets until a young woman helped get me off the street and called John.

I was in the hospital a month, which caused my leg muscles to atrophy, so I am learning how to use them again. I used to worry about taking a Valium or two to fall asleep in strange hotels. Now I take on average 12 pills to sleep and they only work sometimes. How can I close my eyes and voluntarily become unconscious? For the first time in my life I go to shrinks, a lucid one who prescribes drugs and an empathetic one whose speciality is in dealing with people who have been tortured. I have been tortured and this drug-rape runs through it, a river of horror. I'm feeling perpetual terror, they both tell me. I stare blankly or I say some words. I'm ready to die.







The above story is Andrea Dworkin's account of the same rape that the fucktard in the screenshot accused her of lying about.

I ask readers to decide for themselves, who is the real liar?

After, Posting my story I found this





Vivagalore Vivagalore 31-35, F 27 Responses Nov 4, 2012

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http://www.experienceproject.com/stories/Was-Almost-Raped/2413472My story! I was a 17 yr. old virgin at the time and grew up in a very chauvinistic background. But it's an example of old-school, male-dominated thinking and it's effect on women. My parents, thankfully, over the years have changed!

oops.....

sorry about your experiences with this.

the real problem with the issue is that rape isn't as easy to prove as other crimes. in this situation you barely know anything that transpired that night.

people could both lie on other sides and that there is no foolproof way to point out that someone is lying. i've heard that some rape victims preferred to be silent because of the fear that no one would believe them and facing their abusers would only make them relive what happened. The other problem is the supposed "victim" could like about it for some unknown reason.

i guess the fault now in debates lies within the people who would assume that they know the 'truth' regardless of their ignorance on the topic/situation.

This was the experience of a vocal feminist Andrea Dworkin.

" i've heard that some rape victims preferred to be silent because of the fear that no one would believe them "

Yes! And we must make that stop. Silence and Fear are never going to stop rapists.

"This was the experience of a vocal feminist Andrea Dworkin."

ah, i see. i thought that i didn't exactly see Dente writing that...

"Yes! And we must make that stop. Silence and Fear are never going to stop rapists."

The main problem is because of false accusers.

No. Because 'flase accusers' are indeed very rare 2% of all claims.

We don't know that. or we were never suppose to know... What's the point of hiding the truth if we can easily declare 'truth' from statistics?

2% of rape allegations are false (this number includes rape accusations that are 'unfounded' which means is a he say she say with no evidence.)

What does evidence really mean? Do evidences completely tell us whether the act was consentual or not?

We Pretty much use evidence to decide on all matters... So for a rational person yes evidence of rape shows us the act is nonconsensual

Hmmm... I think its always possible to fake it and control/ use this 'evidence' as a tool. I dont know much about this topic but the laws arent always fair. In this particular issue women prob would be in the most advantageous position.

What kind of evidences are you specifically thinking?

Are you serious ?

Well, I said that i'm not that well informed about this topic. As far as evidence. The 'victim' could lie about it not being consentual, or I think that some of the rape in those statistics included consentual acts but with underage women.

I ask' what kind of specific evidence' just for the sake of clarity.

All sex between adults and children is rape. Only adults can consent to sex.

you may be right as far as the law is concerned but who said that 17 year-olds cannot think for themselves? my point is there are numerous grey areas and the statistics are probably faulty.

" who said that 17 year-olds cannot think for themselves"

Hmmm. Not a good point as most adults don't think 17year olds can think for themselves.


Btw 'statutory rape' is filed as 'statutory rape' per the FBI crime stats
"Forcible rape, as defined in the FBI’s Uniform Crime Reporting (UCR) Program, is the carnal knowledge of a person forcibly and against their will. Attempts or assaults to commit rape by force or threat of force are also included; however, statutory rape (without force) and other sex offenses are excluded."

Additionally "Rapes by force comprised 93.0 percent of reported rape offenses in 2010, and attempts or assaults to commit rape accounted for 7.0 percent of reported rapes"

"In this particular issue women prob would be in the most advantageous position."

This is not true. Unless there is indisputable evidence that the woman was raped she is not going to be in the most advantageous position. Indisputable evidence usually requires that the woman immediately contacted the authorities and reported the rape and was then examined. The examination usually has to show that rape actually occurred. For instance there has to be bruising and tearing to the vagina since this is what usually occurs when it is a rape because the woman is not relaxed or lubricated. She will also quite often have bruises on her arms and legs and her clothing will be torn. There is other evidence as well. If none of this exists the woman is going to have a very difficult time proving she was actually raped.

hmmm... i may be wrong with my statement about who is more advantageous but i was right that most likely there is no "indisputable evidence" therefore the statistics isn't as foolproof as dente would like to admit. (imo, the topic where the act may be consentual or not is also different from statutory rape and judging those situations is case to case basis. it is already on the grey area & the laws just simplify things so it would be easier to judge things equally)

" but i was right that most likely there is no "indisputable evidence" therefore the statistics isn't as foolproof as dente would like to admit"

Hate to inform you but rape kits don't only prove who commited a rape but that it was actually rape.

The tearing and bruising that often happens during forced rape is V E R Y distinctive.

Please educate yourself on what victims face when they report rape before you spout out misinformation.

http://www.uic.edu/orgs/cwluherstory/CWLUArchive/rape.html

http://thinkprogress.org/justice/2012/10/03/947981/court-requires-disabled-rape-victim-to-prove-she-fought-back-calls-for-evidence-of-biting-kicking-scratching/?mobile=wp

http://www.cps.gov.uk/publications/prosecution/rape.html

http://home.earthlink.net/~elnunes/rapekits.htm


Seriously stop pretending that rape boils down to 'he said she said' it's ignorant.

i see, but didn't i admit that my knowledge in this topic is limited?

"Seriously stop pretending that rape boils down to 'he said she said' it's ignorant."
well, i am not pretending the only reason why i allowed myself to have a conversation with you was for you to correct me properly with your own views (succinctly). This is not me spreading misinformation or putting my ego on the line in discussions - i'm well pass that.

Abrasions, bruises and lacerations on the victim help elucidate how a rape was carried out...45 percent of victims show evidence of external trauma, most commonly at the mouth, throat, wrists, arms, breasts and thighs: trauma to these sites comprise approximately two thirds of injuries.

Trauma to the vagina and perineum account for approximately 20 percent.


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rape_investigation

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC1831375/


Also let me be very clear since " According to the United States National Crime Victimization Survey, less than 39% of rapes and sexual assaults were reported to law enforcement officials." I don't believe the statistics are accurate...rape happens a lot more!

And considering that out of 100 rapes, only 46 will be reported, 12 will lead to an arrest, 5 will lead to felony conviction, and only 3 will spend a single day in prison. I certainly don't believe statistics paint a full picture... I think since the statistics I used only considered convictions that it's pretty clear that in those cases the evidence proved beyond a reasonable doubt that a rape in fact happened.

A visual of what the whole 'picture' looks like

http://i.imgur.com/uTOxBOH.jpg

Quite often women who are raped will be severely traumatized and will not think rationally about what they should do to deal with the situation. Instead of immediately contacting the authorities and submitting to the required examination they will often rush home, shower for long periods of time trying to remove the filth they feel from being raped, and become introverted and fearful. Unfortunately this reduces their chances of proving they were raped when they finally can't take it anymore emotionally and they then decide they need to contact the authorities and report what occurred.

precisely that just obscures facts... so the evidence might not be as dependable....

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Thanks for sharing your story.

It takes a lot of guts for a woman to talk about rape even thought the story you shared was about another woman. I dated a woman once and she had been raped twice. She felt guilty about the rape and she said the they were her fault because she was not more careful. I tried explaining that rape is never a woman's fault. But I did not get far.

Rape is not a crime that lasts sixty seconds like an armed robbery. The effects last for 50, 75, 100 years. Because when the woman is raped she looks at the world differently. She doesn't trust strangers or men. She may not go out at night, and avoid circumstances that might lead to a repeated situation. She might blame herself or blame the world.

It's going to impact the relationships she has with others to include her husband and children. She is probably going to treat her children a little bit different than she would without the experience of rape. She is going to treat her daughters a bit different, perhaps being more protective and raise her sons differently. It may be a subtle difference, but it will influence their lives. It is a generational crime.

This is very true. It can also very often cause a woman who enjoys sex to become repressed and not want sex anymore. Rape destroys something they found pleasant and enjoyable, and turns it into something that caused them pain, fear, sadness, and grief.

This is andrea dworkin's story!

I know. Even thought it was her story, you are the one that brought up the subject and initiated the conversation with your ideas.......)

I'm sorry previously some people thought it was me... I just wanted to be clear.

Your comments were spot on. Rape isn't a singular act...it's something which permanently changes all involved.

Ive often wondered if rapists are aware of this. They aren't just forcing sex upon a someone for a hour, they are permanently changing someone for the rest of their lives !

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Well rape is a horrible thing true. I dont wish to sound hard but if you were drugged and dont recall what happened that would be your one blessing..

Be glad you dont recall and never bring it up again. Do not think about it because your making it much worse.
Let it go before it destroys you is my advise.

No need to force bad memories about something you dont recall. Ni idea what the bar man or the other was doing in the room?
If you can prive they were and u did not invite them sue!

This isn't about me. Have you heard of PTSD ?

Rape: it is a dreadful experience, but the picture is not finished until it is finished. The picture comes in 3 parts; the act, the coming to terms with and the taking back what never went away. A survivor (not a victim!) is not the one with the problem, the attacker is. All of their actions, whatever they may use, are OF them, not of the beautiful person who thy TRY to take away. That beautiful person is always there, still the same, has NEVER left. They may need to remember WHO they were and all of th beautiful things that make them and LEAVE the rest to drift back to the ATTACKER - the very sad individual who has to live with have that about their personality FOREVER. The survivor really DOES not. The survivor was before during and after still the same beautiful person, they just have to TAKE themselves BACK PLEASE. Then the pictures is finished.

wow how could anybody accuse this woman of lying.shame on you people who call her a liar......seriously she came on here to tell her story give a little credit and respect....

She is dead. She died a few years after writing this.

I knew a young woman who was raped after Rohypnol was slipped in her drink at a party. Like Dworkin she awoke seeing and feeling that she was physically damaged, but not knowing why, and suspecting she had been raped even though she had absolutely no memory of it happening. 
Over time she began to get the very vague, and short memory flashes of what had happened to her, but she still was unsure it had actually happened and thought she might be suffering from some sort of psychosis. She struggled for months before finally telling anyone about it and seeking help. 
As time went on she began to remember more and more about what had happened, and had seen flashes of young men's faces. Through some investigating with a friend she discovered who the four fraternity boys were whose faces keep flashing into her mind when her memories of the rape would surface. She then decided to go to the police and report what had happened. 
Initially they did not want to take any measures to go after the young men she had become certain had raped her because they felt too much time had elapsed, but when she was able to provide them with their names they agreed to look into it further. While investigating her allegations one of the young men gave in while being questioned and confessed to all that had occurred. All of the memory flashes she had experienced turned out to be correct. The young men were prosecuted, and the police also confirmed that two other girls who had come to them and reported that essentially the same thing had happened to them, had been raped in the same manner by the same young men.
Those young men were over eighteen and they are now serving time in prison for raping these girls. Unfortunately the girl I know is still struggling psychologically because of what happened to her, and it is likely that she always will. She has told me that she suffers from severe depression and feels permanently ruined and damaged because of what those young men did to her. She says she does not see young men in the same positive, exciting, hopeful way that she did before. She now feels skeptical, jaded, and cautious, and does not open up to young men in the same lively, vivacious, bubbly, way that she used to. She now tends to be introverted, withdrawn, and reserved around men.
I can't understand why any man who doesn't know a woman would be so adamant about claiming that she is lying about being raped unless 1) he is a rapist himself who wants to remain in denial about the horrific thing he has done, or 2) he is a man who has lied about being raped himself and is obsessed with projecting his own lies onto women because he hates them.

With respect to this: She says she does not see young men in the same positive, exciting, hopeful way that she did before. She now feels skeptical, jaded, and cautious, and does not open up to young men in the same lively, vivacious, bubbly, way that she used to. She now tends to be introverted, withdrawn, and reserved around men.

Boy oh boy!!! I can sure relate!!! I am sure of one thing... I am absolutely certain that rape, whether it happens to us, or someone we know, or even strangers, creates a ripple effect of fear among all women and ultimately results in less availability of enthusiastic, consensual sex in the world.

I would call this phenomenon a "negative feedback loop", in the sense that the more that sex is forced, the less sex naturally blossoms and flourishes. Force creates less of the desired experience in the world.

I believe everything you wrote out, I had a similar experience when I was younger, being cluless of what happend, but I was to young to understand.

this is the story of andrea dworkin ... She died 3 years after publishing this story. I am hoping to spread light on the issue. I am sorry that you had to go through a similar situation, being brave and talking about it like you are helps other survivors know they aren't alone, so THANK YOU!

Maybe the reason people don't want to believe it, is it is just too too horrible to think about. (I pray the real reason people disbelieve isn't because they themselves raped someone)

I do see that some comments are no longer here (maybe a positive thing!) so I just wanted to reiterate my support for Dente in this situation.

I completely understand the visceral reaction of some of the posters here and how they were initially shocked and believed this to be a story about Dente. I thought the same, but it was my fault for not catching the end of the story, when she clearly states that this was Andrea's account of her own rape. I missed this because, like many, the story was difficult to read (I had to pause while reading it, I found it that brutal) and it as a horrible thought to think this happened to one of my friends.

I understand the way the story was presented made it provocative, but all the necessary information as there to clearly indicate that this was not Dente's personal account. Additionally, she included a screen shot of the conversation that -at least in part - inspired her to share this story.

Perhaps in some way we are simply too accustomed to the "proper" order to write a story (disclaimer out of the way, story follows) that to read a piece with a twist frustrates us because it draws us in and emotionally involves us in a manner we did not expect. To be honest, I would probably not have read this story had I realized it was about Andrea because I grow weary of the controversy her name draws.

Ultimately, we should be outraged at the content of the story and the fact that rape happens to any woman. The situation described in this story is terrifying; it highlights how rape can happen anywhere and how sophisticated predators have become.

The screen shot Dente included showing someone saying "this is probably a woman who lied about being raped" with NO evidence to support this claim shows us how tragically far we need to go. As hard as it is for most to grasp, some men simply hate women, and they litter EP at times.

It's no wonder rape victims are scared to speak up. THIS is what we should be discussing; not the order that the author’s words were shared.

Rape is a dreadful thing, it takes your identity from you. It is not about a sexual act, it is more of a violent act of taking a huge part of what feels like your very soul. I have known men who have been accused of it when they have not, having a terrible effect on their lives. I have know women who have lied about it and I have tried to support them. I don't think its about being believed by someone in authority, or even about getting justice. I think it is about remembering the person you were before it happened and taking that person back! The picture as a very dear friend once said to me is not finished until it is finished. Getting hurt is only half way through the picture. The picture is finished when the survivor has taken themselves back.
Rape is a violent crime commited by thieves of personalities.

Unfortunately some people who have been raped never get themselves back. Sometimes they are able to reinvent themselves in a positive way, but many lose the person they once were forever, and can't reinvent themselves to be as positive, unfearful, unapprehensive, and unjaded as they were before.

My one issue with this is that it transforms rape into a gender issue. Can we please stop talking about rape as a man vs woman issue?It offends those of us who have male loved ones who have suffered through sexual assault. I know the vast majority of victims of rape are women, but that doesn't make it a genderised issue. One cannot generalise about rape.As a female survivor myself, I believe that it is important to bring this up. We cannot isolate male victims, for their pain is just as deep as ours, and if we genderise the issue, we create the idea that male rape is somehow impossible, thus making it easier for the rapist to get away with it. There still are many countries where male rape is not recognised. The good people need to stick together, and there is only one battle: that of us against those who rape, male or female they may be.Nonetheless, this is an important piece and needs to be read, for both women and men against rape.

how does this post transform rape in anyway? How, exactly does it cause offense to men? How was it generalised in this article?

*genderised

No, I didn't explain myself well enough. This article does not generalise.
This post does not 'transform' rape into anything. It is a stark, brutal account of her rape. It does not cause offence to men, but some of the comments seemed to genderise rape, transforming it into a gender issue.
That just bothered me a little and felt the need of putting my point out there. But as I said it's a very important piece of writing. The injustice this woman has gone through and the damage she is recounting is a truth that needs to be spoken. As you said, we need to understand it in order to defeat it. That can only be done if women like Andrea Dworkin speak honestly and most brutally about what it is to go through a rape, because we are not only fighting rapists unfortunately but people like Todd Akin and the like. Truth can be something we do not want to hear sometimes, but people need to be shaken out of their stupidity. Sometimes the only way to understand something is by getting slapped in the face with it.

Okay, because I do try to be fair... I do think it is a gendered crime but, only in the sense that different help needs to be offered for different genders, heterosexual men face disbelief and mocking...that needs to be addressed as does the unique needs of lesbian and gay survivors. Your friend is good to have your support I am sure it is very difficult for him.

Yes, I agree completely with different help needs to be offered for different genders.

By the way, here's a link to this article, I don't know if you've heard of it, but it might be of interest. It's terrible how it seems there seems to be such a small amount of tutelage in the world for rape victims.
http://www.feministlawprofessors.com/2009/11/another-step-backwards-for-women%E2%80%99s-rights-in-italy/

That is dreadful. It does seem as if we are slipping back into our past mistakes.
Heartbreaking.

"Violence against women is thus a manifestation of men’s fear about women’s freedom and mobility. This fear, as Italian scholar Tamar Pitch stresses, is “closely linked to fear about the future and the ‘other,’ which leads to the search for – or even the fabrication of- pseudo-homogeneous, pseudo-traditional cultural identities.” As a result, such sentiments lead to the criminalization of migrants, who are potential menaces to national “values.”"


I honestly had not considered the migrant perspective... this is very enlightening THANK YOU for sharing it!!!!

You're welcome, glad you found it of interest.
It's good to see someone so passionate about human rights.

Yes you are right LittleMonroe....sadly to say men women and children suffer....there is not enough mentioned about that. It is harder I think for men, and they probably need far more support in some ways. Well said thank you

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I am terrified at the thought of this violation and I would love lining the prospective offenders against the wall with a laser on their privates u.til one sissy boy would less up. I have no doubt that you were not the first or the last these COWARDS have raped. I want you to believe you did NOT ask for this-you felt safe in a safe place. You trusted what we all take for granted, that our Waiters and Hotel Staff are above reproach. Thank you for sharing thi b/c everyone should be vigilant and trust their instincts.

Andrea was a feminist activist, one that spoke out against rape and counseled survivors of rape, her story is especially poignant because at least to me, if she can get raped...anyone can. If she can be dismissed anyone can. And that keeps alot of other people silent about their experiences.

I think it's easier for people to call you a liar than stomach the horrible truth that has consumed your whole being.

I think people do dismiss rape as fiction because it is so insidious and so prevelant that we sheild ourselves against it with fictions and proverbs... however, I think being honest about it... and understanding it will be much more effective in ending it and that is what is most important.

^^well said^^

I think the lie is greater than the question of whether or not Dworkin's account is accurate (Frankly, I don't know anything about it, or, for that matter, much about Dworkin.), but, rather, a refusal to acknowledge a truth. That is, irrespective of being privileged (taking LAV's accusation as truth) or educated, there's nothing about the above story that's particularly exceptional. Stuff like this happens every day, and the cruel truth is that the world doesn't stop turning.

the truth is often cruel maybe thats why we discount it as fiction. who knows but it is this type of behavior which keeps victims silent, which keeps victims isolated and scared.

The cruel truth? The only truth I see is people have an amazing ability to ignore everything that goes on around them until it happens to them, man or woman, yet we wonder why things go unchanged. I like this article, it brings a lot of things to the table.

It is hard to look at things which frighten us or remind us of our mortality.

I don't find it hard as it reminds me of humanity and a reason to fight, but I forget that not everyone is like me so I guess its beyond me lol :o

"It is hard to look at things which frighten us or remind us of our mortality." Or in some cases remind us of ourselves or the horrible things that our gender does.

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OMG.
I have no words...

It appears that many people thought this was about you. Why didn't you put that it wasn't in the beginning rather than the end?

Like Joey, when I read this at lunch time, I thought it was about you. Please don't do this again.

Read comment to suzy and be assured I wouldn't dare. ENJOY "gang raping" those comment threads...and being hilarious in your I love gang rape group because that always makes me laugh when it pops up in my activity thread !

^^^ sarcasm ^^^ in other words it ******* sucks...but it is the internet so I don't expect anything different.

For the record, you are absolutely correct to chastise me. As I noted in my message to you, I have asked EP to remove the group. The title was unintentionally insensitive and I was wrong.

SHOULD GET HOLD OF A PRIVATE INVESTIGATOR! .A.S.A.P.! NEVER TOO LATE!!!

The woman who this happened to is dead ... Hopefully her story will empower others to come forward, to not remain silent, and for people to understand a rape doesn't exist in a single moment it affects a person their whole life.

Wow... I thought this was about you at first, I was going to cry. As far as the person in those screen shots I think its ignorant to assume this woman was lying since I know for sure this person doesnt know thos woman personally.. obviously. Its sickening to hear how people assume so much about someone, its how all wars, genocide, violence stems from.

^^^very true

It's not her fault. It's sad that rapists seems to get away with what they've done.

This was one of the rawest stories I have read on EP. Every single word was horrific and the strength it has taken for you to get to a point of being able to share it is not to be underestimated.

The fact that you were simply eating dinner in a hotel and you were violated so badly just demonstrates that this can happen to ANYONE and ANYWHERE. Bastards and cowards....

Dente thank you for being brave enough to share what happened to you.

As said this isn't my story. what happened is horrific.

It doesn't matter if Dworkins account is 'true'. The message of the account is true, in 2012 as much as in 2000. Dismissing the message, on the argument the story is fiction, is dismissing the suffering of all rape victims.

I believe Dworkins story btw.

I believe it too. And I agree with every single word you have written.

.<-- speechless.
That story is horrible.
I suspect I was drugged once - or at the very least, some people ensured I was drunk enough so they could do whatever they wanted. I do remember everything that happened, and it makes me sick to my stomach.
Rape is wrong. And using any kind of substance to use another person sexually is criminal and despicable.

I agree... and survivors shouldn't be re-victimized by the callous dismissals of people who don't know them or know their story. I am so sorry you experienced such a horrible experience... there are no words so (((hugs and love)))

Thanks. Not sure it was rape, but they definitely took advantage of me. Full story in my blog. I don't feel like posting it publicly.

Just so that it's all out in the open- my response to LAV:

EdieZen Nov 4, 2012 1:33 PM

I think Andrea's story is heartbreaking. Its hard to even pin point who did what since she was roofied. It's still no reason to call her a liar. This is one of the main reasons most rape victims do not come forward.

it's quite sad that in this day when someone hears a story about rape they have the balls to turn around and state "well women rapists get less time in jail when they rape" and blah blah blah.

You say feminism has brainwashed us but i think some of you anti feminists are angry, self loathing individuals that seem to see "evil" in anyone that doesnt agree with everything you state.

*claps*

Excellent Edie. The men you speak of are indeed self loathing and I'd pity them if the ramifications of their words were not so incredibly serious and far reaching. As such, I will save my empathy for victims of crimes such as Dente described.

.sometimes, it's not even men. Sometimes its women too that will turn around and call a victim a liar. I know that first hand. Sad indeed.

I think it is perhaps even more tragic that women would do so. I just have no words, and my heart dies a little hearing you know first hand :(

=/ makes for strong character with a lot of fukked up thinking? ehhhh.... lets not dwell.

It makes you a survivor. I salute you (and throw in a hug)

Rape denial is tragic no matter who does it. It's horrible.
The worst thing I think, is when a whole community turns against the rape victim and isolates her, calling her a liar. It's unbelievable how people can be so insensitive.

Cruel and insensitive.

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That is so very sad...:(

='(

How dare he accuse her of lying about that!!! Who is he? Oh yeah that is right HE is the guy who when he was here on EP as Deviantproxy LIED ABOUT BEING RAPED. (Amongst a myriad of other lies)

.so upset with him. and sick of that ****. how can he assume anyone is lying about that? for fecks sake

Because he doesn't bother to look into it...he just spews bullship and disgusting lies like a geyser.

Hopefully, this will put some perspective on the issue.

That dude has proven over and over again that he is seriously f'd up.

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